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Today's hearing on SB 1551

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by robertg, Feb 6, 2014.

  1. robertg

    robertg Sandy Oregon Silver Supporter Silver Supporter 2016 Volunteer

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    OFF Newsletter:

    Oregon's Only No Compromise Gun Rights Organization
    .
    02.06.14

    Today's hearing on SB 1551, Senator Prozanski's gun registration expansion, was enlightening to say the least.

    While gun owners are often referred to as a "vocal minority," the sign-up sheets for testimony show only 19 people in support of the bill, with 28 opposed.

    First to testify was Trish Whitfield from the Oregon State Police ID unit.

    While she did provide numbers for the total number of background checks done and the total number of denials, she did not provide any numbers for how many of those denials were for no cause.

    She did not provide numbers for how many denials were actually felons, as opposed to people who were denied because they were not Oregon residents and simply misunderstood laws about non-resident purchases.

    But far more interesting was that she could not provide any data at all about the number of "felons" who attempted a purchase and were denied and subsequently prosecuted.

    The OSP has no info and can't share any info on this critical statistic.

    But we know it is virtually never that a convicted felon attempts a transfer and is prosecuted for it. This, of course, demonstrates what a colossal farce SB 1551 is.

    Celebrity victim Mark Kelly followed the OSP. Mark, as you know, is the former astronaut husband of Congresswoman Gabby Giffords. Giffords was shot along with others in Arizona by Jared Lee Loughner.

    Kelly and Giffords are the spokesmodels for " Americans for Responsible Solutions" which has outraised all other "SuperPacs" with massive donations from millionaires, such as anti-gun zealot Mike Bloomberg of New York.

    SB 1551 is a bill that will expand the failed background check system to virtually all gun transfers, even to a gun you give to your father-in-law or your best friend.

    But while Mark Kelly was promoting this vast new invasion of your privacy, (and calling your rights "a loophole") he had some trouble responding to a question from Senator Betsy Close. She simply asked him if his wife's assailant had passed a background check. Which, of course, he had.

    So Kelly attempted to divert the issue by discussing a whole host of other things that this bill does not address. But the damage was done. Clearly this bill would do nothing to stop the kinds of attacks that Kelly is exploiting.

    Kelly's testimony was virtually an exact copy of the speech he recently gave in Washington state. Giffords and Kelly are on a national tour, largely funded by Bloomberg, promoting registration bills across the country.

    Joining Kelly was Oregon Governor John Kitzhaber, who stated both that the bill would not stop felons from getting guns and that we needed this bill to stop felons from getting guns!

    The next panel was made up of a representative of the NRA (Dan Reid), Kevin Starrett of Oregon Firearms Federation and the irrepressible, and irreplaceable, Manny Martinez, a former Cuban citizen who escaped from Fidel Castro's utopian workers' paradise and came to America.

    For sheer passion, few can compare with Mr. Martinez. You owe it to yourself to listen to his testimony.

    Note, the hearing started with invited testimony. OFF was NOT invited. We testified as part of panel that was determined by NRA, which graciously extended an invitation to OFF and Mr. Martinez.

    Dan Reid, the NRA rep, was chided by Floyd Prozanski for not being a resident of Oregon. (Mr. Reid covers several states and lives in California.) This was ironic of course, considering the star anti-gun celebrity witness (Mark Kelly) is from Arizona.

    What followed was numerous panels of speakers from both sides of the issue. As you would expect, the anti-rights people recounted endless horror stories about victims of "gun violence." (They seem totally unconcerned with people who are victims of any other kind of violence.) One woman who supported gun registration discussed how important it was for people who were suicidal to give their guns to other people. No one pointed out that under this bill that would be illegal.

    But there was one uniform reality.

    Not a single story involved an incident that would have been prevented if this bill was enacted. Not one.

    When one firearms instructor noted (correctly) that he might well have to run a background check on anyone who took his class and used one of his guns, Senator Prozanski responded with a complete misunderstanding of an opinion from the legislature's lawyers and said this was not true. As usual, Floyd was 100% wrong.

    But for pure comic relief, nothing could top Prozanski's claim that he had nothing to do with informing the anti-gun side about the hearing well in advance of the public getting this information. Floyd's ability to tell this whopper with a straight face tells you all you need to know about the man.

    Floyd set the date of the hearing. He decided the time and format of the hearing. Ceasefire Oregon had all this info almost a week before the public. There is simply no other place they could have gotten it from.

    One thing was clear: this bill is not about reducing crime. It's not about stopping felons. According to Sen. Prozanski, the Oregon State Police performed 263,343 background checks for firearms transfers in 2013. He said that more than 99% were approved, and less than 1% were denied. That would be 261,128 unnecessary background checks on law-abiding Oregonians in order to prevent less than 1% of transfers by licensed dealers at the cost of millions to law-abiding Oregonians.

    Whatever the number of actual felons attempting a purchase (something we cannot know), virtually none faced any prosecution.

    So what exactly are we doing here? All the proponents agree this won't solve the problem. It's just a "step." So what's the next "step" and what's the goal?

    There is no question they are tightening the noose. We have learned from other states that registration leads to confiscation. It's not open to debate; it's happening now.

    Prozanski responded to this reality by suggesting it was a "conspiracy theory." But it's not a "theory;" it's a reality.

    Many supporters of liberty showed up today and gave excellent testimony. We are grateful for each of you. This dangerous legislation is an attack on everyone who believes in individual rights. For everyone who showed up, whether you got a chance to testify or not, thank you.
     
  2. Dunerunner

    Dunerunner You'll Never Know Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for the blow by blow. Appreciated!
     
  3. U201491

    U201491 Well-Known Member

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    Sent it out to my mail list also .
    So this info is wide spread.
    Keep pumping letters and pressure in earnest to every oregon legislator also.
    The pressure CANNOT stop !!!!!
    We have to dig a grave for this bill.
     
    bnsaibum and (deleted member) like this.
  4. OLDNEWBIE

    OLDNEWBIE State of Flux Well-Known Member

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    "One woman who supported gun registration discussed how important it was for people who were suicidal to give their guns to other people. No one pointed out that under this bill that would be illegal."

    An excellent talking point I never thought of, these people are idiots.
     
  5. 3MTA3

    3MTA3 DMZ between Liberty and Tyranny Behind Enemy Lines Bronze Supporter

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    That would be the highly vaunted intellect of the liberal elite, right there. Yessiree, that's exactly what that was.
     
    Stomper and (deleted member) like this.
  6. bnsaibum

    bnsaibum Corvallis, OR Well-Known Member 2015 Volunteer

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    My take on some additional points to press in your correspondence with your representatives:

    Is there anyone here who would have fought to stop fixing this problem? Aside from the information that is currently gathered and registered in the OSP database on lawful purchasers, would anyone fight to stop the OSP notifying the relevant agency or jurisdiction of a prohibited purchase attempt so that an investigation, arrest and prosecution could be made? How long have we been saying to enforce the current laws? This could have been addressed years ago with little to NO argument from gun Rights supporters. In this case it looks like it was missing some key pieces, but the foundation has been there all along and not utilized.



    in part by saying that if Az had gun show background checks like Oregon and a law like this one proposes to make AND had his wife's assailant been reported as having mental issues he would have been unable to buy a firearm. I cannot have been the only one to hear the word he did not speak: legally. He would not have been able to buy one legally. He planned his attack and would have procured a firearm, legally or not.




    How many Bliss Ninnies have acknowledged that it won't stop the problem? Whatever cause célèbre it happens to be at the time, how many say that it is a 'step' in the right direction? Without saying so directly, the Governor and any others who agree that it won't stop violence are talking about incrementalism. Yet they say that isn't what they are doing. This is an area that needs to be shoved in their faces. Any time they bring up 'we know it won't stop all bad guys from getting guns...' it needs to be addressed as incrementalism, AGGRESSIVELY! What were the arguments and assurances used in the late 80's to implement Oregon's background check system? What were the arguments and assurances used for the gun show checks? I am sure they used the same type of language at some point. "It won't stop them all, but it is a step in the right direction" would probably sound familiar to anyone who has lived here over the lase 25 years.

    Make sure to visit Dave Workman's post and article that addresses some of their tactics behind this.
    https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/progressivemajorityaction/pages/64/attachments/original/1363644630/Voicing_Our_Values-To_Curtail_Gun_Violence.pdf?1363644630
    http://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/748675/gun-violencemessaging-guide-pdf-1.pdf
     
  7. BAMCIS

    BAMCIS Eugene Well-Known Member

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    I sent a very short email to and then called Sen Chris Edwards (since I have the wonderful privilege of living in his district) to voice my opposition to this stupid bill.

    While I was at it I sent Merkley an email simply reminding him I still remember where he stood on Obamacare and more importantly the 2A, and that I was doing everything I could to see he gets the chance to spend more time with his family and pursue opportunities elsewhere.
     
    tiggers97, Stomper, ocarolan and 6 others like this.
  8. U201491

    U201491 Well-Known Member

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    ROFLOL
    I SEND him so much crap along those lines it is funny.
    He is a waste. I keep telling him he is fired but he doesn't listen to that either. :eek:
     
  9. 1337BaldEagle

    1337BaldEagle Earth Active Member

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    Anyone have video of the whole thing? I'm practically on my death bed with a sickness from hell and was unable to attend.
     
  10. U201491

    U201491 Well-Known Member

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    If it is that flu, it hits twice, first as a b...ch of a cold then about a week later, have a case of Imodium handy.
    Just got over it a day ago........ lasts all total about 2 weeks. Just keep going, and it will not lay ya up too bad.
     
    bellarum and (deleted member) like this.
  11. tiggers97

    tiggers97 United States Well-Known Member

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    Ah, but you can still type... I HOPE YOU GOT YOUR WRITTEN TESTIMONY IN :winkkiss:

    Seriously, at the end, senator P. said that he would continue to accept written testimony into next week. It wasn't in the OFF update, but should be.

    With the cold weather out there, it seems like the perfect indoor activity. It doesn't have to be lengthy, fancy, or mega insightful (1337BaldEagle), but send something in. If you want help, I'd be happy to help track down data or help you get started with ideas. Or use these templates, links, and instructions here to get-er done.

    there's some youtube clips here
    LaughingAtLiberals - YouTube

    Hope you feel better, 1337BaldEagle
     
  12. 1337BaldEagle

    1337BaldEagle Earth Active Member

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    Thank you sir. I intend on putting in footnotes that sight my sources and amend the msg a little bit so it is more directed for the commity. I should have it done in 2 days, (nights rather, graveyard guy here) provided I don't die from this or that it incapacitates me further. I welcome any and all input you may have. Just send me a PM and we will establish a freer conversation on the subject without highjacking anymore of the OP's thread.
     
  13. Stomper

    Stomper Oceania Rising White Is The New Brown Silver Supporter

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    So, Sen. (Genius) Prozanski chided the NRA representative for not being an Oregonian, yet enabled (and cheered) the hypocrite spaceman from Arizona? Did he actually do that with a straight face? He's actually a state prosecutor?

    I wonder what his conviction rate is..... Hmmmmm.



    The barely intelligible comments in support of this F-ed up bill from the "peanut gallery" clearly shows the lack of intellectual depth of THAT constituency. Clearly, you "can't fix stupid".... It should be outlawed.
     
  14. boarder4life81

    boarder4life81 Eugene, Oregon Active Member

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    Have you managed to get a reply from Edwards? I've sent several messages over the past year and have never received his reply. My feeling is that his lack of communication shows he is in favor of the gun control bills and refuses to acknowledge people in his district that oppose it.
     
  15. Stomper

    Stomper Oceania Rising White Is The New Brown Silver Supporter

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    Here's a letter in opposition to Measure 70 written by Prozanski back in the day (that I parsed out in quote-blocks). Bear with me and read it, there's valid points to be made...


    Nice buzz-word to use for those times.... Ahem, "I did not have sex with that woman, Miss Lewinski". -William Jeffeferson Clinto (the first REAL black U.S. President)




    Clearly, even if he takes his shoes off, he can't count to Section-27 of the Oregon Constitution... You know, among the BILL OF RIGHTS where says:

    Article-1

    Section 27. Right to bear arms; military subordinate to civil power. The people shall have the right to bear arms for the defence [sic] of themselves, and the State, but the Military shall be kept in strict subordination to the civil power[.]

    Notice is says FOR THE DEFENSE OF THEMSELVES (primary purpose), and the State (secondary purpose)

    Notice that it also says (in context of bearing arms) the MILITARY shall be kept strictly subordinate to civil power, NOT the people.

    Sen. Prozanski IS correct about one thing for sure, "Gutting Oregon's Bill of Rights will not reduce crime." Just like as has been REPEADEDLY STATED by those that support SB1551 that it would not stop the very tragedies they supposedly seek to prevent!



    Obviously SB1551 is beng touted as "doing SOMETHING to help protect the public, but apparently it's ok with Prozanski to take rights away from, and place Oregonians at greater risk to harm when it suits his Statist agenda. :rolleyes:



    Out of their own pockets in fact, directly to pay for the OSP background check fee. But we don't care about gun owners' money, do we Sen. Prozanski?


    Sen. Prozanski, stop using the public's time and money against it in order to proliferate your Statist agenda. There is MORE THAN ENOUGH tax revenue to get the damned roads and other infrastructure fixed, fund our emergency services personnel, if you'd stop pissing our tax dollars away on spotted owls, free needles/condoms, and "arts & croissants", and a multitude of other suckling piglets latched ont the public tit.


    The curtain is up, and we SEE YOU! (Ps- shave that scraggly beard, it looks like you got crap all over your face)


    GET BLOOMBERG MONEY OUT OF OREGON, NOW!
     
  16. Dunke

    Dunke Rogue Valley Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I suppose it would be ok to copy/paste parts from the OFF Newsletter in a letter to my Senator?
     
  17. tiggers97

    tiggers97 United States Well-Known Member

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    Sure. Maybe reword a bit to make them your own, or insert a few observations of your own.
    If anyone as a good link for information or quotes, please feel free to share for others!
     
    bnsaibum and (deleted member) like this.
  18. Glock Jock

    Glock Jock Wilsonville , OR Well-Known Member

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  19. skey

    skey Seattle Area New Member

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    We just went though the trained seal show here in Washington. It is hard to fight stupid since they are too stupid to realize they are stupid. Best Regards from us here in Washington who are fighting I-594. We have to stand together and fight as a united front wherever these dingbats show themselves.
     
  20. cookie

    cookie THE SOCIALIST STATE OF KALI - FORNIA Well-Known Member

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    Shovel ready politicians?