I watched a robbery and did nothing

[wired]

There is a good reason Cops HATE domestic calls more than any other call. It is by far the most volatile. It is common for a woman to call because she is getting pounded. Then when Police arrest her baby daddy she will try to attack them. Also too many times they get called, most often by the woman, then here comes the man with a gun to start trying to shoot them from ambush.

Seen it many times . Good old apartment living . I HATE apartments

 

[Alexx1401]

Seen it many times . Good old apartment living . I HATE apartments

YEP! When I was young and single I several times was more than willing to rent a home if I had to have a roommate rather than an apartment that was just mine. I HATE apartment living.

 

[Mikej]

Pointing out that the theft wasn't as bad as the corporations claimed doesn't excuse the actual theft

Obviously you don't know anyone, or are close to anyone, that works in retail

 

[VinnieBoomBah]

Obviously you don't know anyone, or are close to anyone, that works in retail

You could not be more wrong

 

[Old Dog]

So if someone doesn't intervene to stop a crackhead from walking off with a bunch of crap the store doesn't want to protect itself, that makes them "morally flexible"? They should interject themselves into a situation against the wishes of the store management and take on risks injury and liability when there is no imminent threat of harm to others? That's an interesting worldview.

Personally, I value my freedom, health, and financial well-being more than playing hero for an unappreciative victim. My daughter growing up without a father, or shamed by her father being in prison, or being penniless from lawsuits is a steep cost to pay for stopping someone from walking away with a $99 piece of consumer electronics. So if having the capacity to gauge risk and be selective at what you're willing to throw your life away over is being morally flexible, then I guess I'll be morally flexible.

Eh, returning to the thread after a few days off-line.

Wasn't talking about a full-scale intervention or attempting to physically stop a shoplifter. Especially not talking about drawing a firearm. Nor in any way, shape or form placing my life in danger. Just being a good citizen. Letting the individual know they've been seen. Maybe even politely suggesting they may want to drop the items or return 'em to the shelves. Maybe snapping a few photos or capturing some video. Following out at a "safe" distance, getting a description, license plate. Notifying the store's LP staff.

A big reason so much of this crap is going on now is because most citizens are meek, non-confrontational and ignore everything that happening right in front of them while out in public. Hell, a couple cities almost burned down during the pandemic, and everyone just sat back and said, thank God that's not happening here, or just went along with Kamala and MSNBC believing that it was all just "peaceful protests."

Do you not think that we as citizens have any responsibility if we observe a crime being committed? What's your threshhold? Seeing someone get assaulted, stabbed, shot? Attempted abduction of a child occurring in front of you? A hit and run accident car vs. pedestrian?

Yeah, it's just "stuff." But that's where criminals start. First with what they can get away with, then increasingly more and more criminal acts and eventually, if they keep getting away with their actions, violence.

 

[VinnieBoomBah]

Do you not think that we as citizens have any responsibility if we observe a crime being committed? What's your threshhold? Seeing someone get assaulted, stabbed, shot? Attempted abduction of a child occurring in front of you? A hit and run accident car vs. pedestrian?

Property? Almost never

People? Cry havoc and let slip the sporks of war!!

 

[Grasshopper541]

You have to pick your battles man. Nowadays the cops would try to charge you if you did something. Not worth it over a store that hates God loving Americans anyways. Does anybody else remember the satanic merchandise fiasco they had a few months back? Screw em'.

 

[po18guy]

The only times I go to Target in Bonney Lake are for when I need to pick up medication or to look at their cookware.

Thus I'm standing in the check out line with my bags of pills and a new non stick frying pan, idly trying to determine the gender and potential species of the blue haired whale like cashier. I've determined it is most likely a female, perhaps a species of white orca that had been conscripted to this life of cashiering.

To our left a lot of yelling is going on, an anorexic appearing teenager starts jumping around a second large creature (this one resembles a black walrus with low quality weave work.) The poor clerks arms are flailing about like Kermit the frog, saying she cant leave yet and has to pay. She pushes her cart past him and out the door. I instinctively grip my Luger and get ready to confront her when I had a vision of the future. I saw myself being handcuffed and sitting in the back of a squad car.

The poster child for anorexia didn't follow her outside, why should I risk my safety and freedom?

This wasn't my battle, not worth the risks involved to "do the right thing". I'd have liked to have done something but I believe I made the right choice to not go after the walrus, it's not as if I packed my harpoon gun for such an occasion anyhow.

Let Target go under. They are idiots.

 

[Silver Hand]

The only times I go to Target in Bonney Lake are for when I need to pick up medication or to look at their cookware.

Thus I'm standing in the check out line with my bags of pills and a new non stick frying pan, idly trying to determine the gender and potential species of the blue haired whale like cashier. I've determined it is most likely a female, perhaps a species of white orca that had been conscripted to this life of cashiering.

To our left a lot of yelling is going on, an anorexic appearing teenager starts jumping around a second large creature (this one resembles a black walrus with low quality weave work.) The poor clerks arms are flailing about like Kermit the frog, saying she cant leave yet and has to pay. She pushes her cart past him and out the door. I instinctively grip my Luger and get ready to confront her when I had a vision of the future. I saw myself being handcuffed and sitting in the back of a squad car.

The poster child for anorexia didn't follow her outside, why should I risk my safety and freedom?

This wasn't my battle, not worth the risks involved to "do the right thing". I'd have liked to have done something but I believe I made the right choice to not go after the walrus, it's not as if I packed my harpoon gun for such an occasion anyhow.

You are not a cop. if you pulled a gun a real officer of the law might have told you to drop it, or maybe just something much worse.
The privilege you have or be it a right, is for life and death. if you have no other option, use it to save a life. Brandishing a weapon for any reason is a bad idea and may lead to a felony.

 

[nammac]

You are not a cop. if you pulled a gun a real officer of the law might have told you to drop it, or maybe just something much worse.
The privilege you have or be it a right, is for life and death. if you have no other option, use it to save a life. Brandishing a weapon for any reason is a bad idea and may lead to a felony.

Or death…

 

[DB is Here]

may lead to a felony.

 

[NeoBlackdog]

Eh, returning to the thread after a few days off-line.

Wasn't talking about a full-scale intervention or attempting to physically stop a shoplifter. Especially not talking about drawing a firearm. Nor in any way, shape or form placing my life in danger. Just being a good citizen. Letting the individual know they've been seen. Maybe even politely suggesting they may want to drop the items or return 'em to the shelves. Maybe snapping a few photos or capturing some video. Following out at a "safe" distance, getting a description, license plate. Notifying the store's LP staff.

A big reason so much of this crap is going on now is because most citizens are meek, non-confrontational and ignore everything that happening right in front of them while out in public. Hell, a couple cities almost burned down during the pandemic, and everyone just sat back and said, thank God that's not happening here, or just went along with Kamala and MSNBC believing that it was all just "peaceful protests."

Do you not think that we as citizens have any responsibility if we observe a crime being committed? What's your threshhold? Seeing someone get assaulted, stabbed, shot? Attempted abduction of a child occurring in front of you? A hit and run accident car vs. pedestrian?

Yeah, it's just "stuff." But that's where criminals start. First with what they can get away with, then increasingly more and more criminal acts and eventually, if they keep getting away with their actions, violence.

^^^^^^^^^THIS!^^^^^^^^^
One needn't draw a weapon or go hands on with someone to make a difference. Hell, you don't have to interact with the bad actor at all, just be a good witness. Get pictures or video, get a description, note the direction of travel, etc..
Sure, it's a Target store and they are pretty much a pooptyhole company. So what? There is still right and wrong and allowing wrong to occur without an effort to do something is what has gotten society to the point we're at now.

 

[wired]

^^^^^^^^^THIS!^^^^^^^^^
One needn't draw a weapon or go hands on with someone to make a difference. Hell, you don't have to interact with the bad actor at all, just be a good witness. Get pictures or video, get a description, note the direction of travel, etc..
Sure, it's a Target store and they are pretty much a pooptyhole company. So what? There is still right and wrong and allowing wrong to occur without an effort to do something is what has gotten society to the point we're at now.

You aren't allowing anything to happen. You are just in the vicinity while someone commits a crime. Your actions may cause a situation to escalate though. Target knows they have a theft problem. Its cheaper for Target to let it go than it is for them to hire, train and pay adequate security. They know that. You intervening in a crime in action isn't going to make you the hero but it could lead to the real situation where a desperate criminal has now been made and gets into fight or flight mode endangering the rest of the target shoppers. It might seem like a great idea to pull the Gomer Pyle Citizens Arrest ( you have to be pretty old to get that reference) but it could lead to some bad times pretty quick as the thief, who may be armed himself gets into escape mode.

 

[NeoBlackdog]

You aren't allowing anything to happen. You are just in the vicinity while someone commits a crime. Your actions may cause a situation to escalate though. Target knows they have a theft problem. Its cheaper for Target to let it go than it is for them to hire, train and pay adequate security. They know that. You intervening in a crime in action isn't going to make you the hero but it could lead to the real situation where a desperate criminal has now been made and gets into fight or flight mode endangering the rest of the target shoppers. It might seem like a great idea to pull the Gomer Pyle Citizens Arrest ( you have to be pretty old to get that reference) but it could lead to some bad times pretty quick as the thief, who may be armed himself gets into escape mode.

It's almost like you didn't read my post at all.
Nowhere did I say to intervene. What I said was to be a good witness and then let the cops handle it. Collect what information you can safely collect, turn it over to the folks that are paid to deal with such things, and then get back to your regularly scheduled programming.

 

[wired]

It's almost like you didn't read my post at all.
Nowhere did I say to intervene. What I said was to be a good witness and then let the cops handle it. Collect what information you can safely collect, turn it over to the folks that are paid to deal with such things, and then get back to your regularly scheduled programming.

Witness? You think the cops are going to bother showing up for a shoplifting incident where the shoplifter left the store? IF they do, they wont, it will be two hours later.

 

[NeoBlackdog]

Well, I reckon we might just as well give up and let the cretins overrun us then. Fug it.

 

[Lazyfaire]

So if someone doesn't intervene to stop a crackhead from walking off with a bunch of crap the store doesn't want to protect itself, that makes them "morally flexible"? They should interject themselves into a situation against the wishes of the store management and take on risks injury and liability when there is no imminent threat of harm to others? That's an interesting worldview.

Personally, I value my freedom, health, and financial well-being more than playing hero for an unappreciative victim. My daughter growing up without a father, or shamed by her father being in prison, or being penniless from lawsuits is a steep cost to pay for stopping someone from walking away with a $99 piece of consumer electronics. So if having the capacity to gauge risk and be selective at what you're willing to throw your life away over is being morally flexible, then I guess I'll be morally flexible.

I agree. If Target doesn't care about obvious theft, will they care about you and your welfare? I won't count on it. But I wouldn't go back there anymore (I don't now!).

 

[PiratePast40]

Witness? You think the cops are going to bother showing up for a shoplifting incident where the shoplifter left the store? IF they do, they wont, it will be two hours later.

Not true. We had a shoplifter cuffed and stuffed within 15 minutes of the report by Target loss prevention in Salem. By the time we took her back to the store, they already had the report from all the stores she had been observed shoplifting, along with a detailed list of merchandise with prices. That included info from Walmart, Fred Meyer, and other participating retailers.

As far as shoplifting in major stores, they have all the information they need. For other crimes where there isn't continuous monitoring, yes, credible, actionable, information is needed if you want the cops to be able to do anything. Video is probably the best evidence you can offer.

Inserting yourself into the situation and becoming a part of it, is a completely different matter and I think that's what this discussion is about.

 

[nwslopoke]

You aren't allowing anything to happen. You are just in the vicinity while someone commits a crime. Your actions may cause a situation to escalate though. Target knows they have a theft problem. Its cheaper for Target to let it go than it is for them to hire, train and pay adequate security. They know that. You intervening in a crime in action isn't going to make you the hero but it could lead to the real situation where a desperate criminal has now been made and gets into fight or flight mode endangering the rest of the target shoppers. It might seem like a great idea to pull the Gomer Pyle Citizens Arrest ( you have to be pretty old to get that reference) but it could lead to some bad times pretty quick as the thief, who may be armed himself gets into escape mode.

I was at a Walmart in Oakland (I doubt it still open) some years ago. I don't remember where each party was in line but I was next behind the group. There was a young couple with a baby and a middle age woman. At the checkout, one of the parties item had fallen into the person being checked out and they were being charged for it. Should have been a simple and easy fixable issue.

The single woman started a huge scene and immediately tried to get people to be on "her side". Many people in surrounding lines were getting involved because of the commotion. Simple things get out of hand so fast. Who wants to be involved in that? Luckily there was no violence, but plenty of threats.

It's hard to fix what you don't control. Physical violence is the main decider. I have plans for my future. Other people idiocy doesn't fit into it. The bureaucracy has just built up to this three headed beast. If you get involved you get totally, involved.

 

[VinnieBoomBah]

Target knows they have a theft problem. Its cheaper for Target to let it go than it is for them to hire, train and pay adequate security. They know that.

Everybody wants to be a capitalist until it's time to let the capitalist system work in a way they don't like