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Hypothetical question about SBR and Suppressor in WA.

Discussion in 'NFA Weapon Discussion' started by sasquatch98226, May 10, 2010.

  1. sasquatch98226

    sasquatch98226 Bellingham Member

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    I got to thinking the other day, (I know bad news, and the smoke starting coming out the ears).

    Is it possible to permanently install a suppressor (I belive I was told red locktite is considered permanent by the ATF) on a short barrel in WA to get to the overall length of 16" barrel and therefore not have an SBR?

    Just Curious.
     
  2. dj_fatstyles

    dj_fatstyles renton New Member

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    im not sure about the locktite but it legal to permanently attach a can to your rifle to bring it to legal length. from what i undersatnd, though, is that it has to be silver soldered or welded in three spots to the barrel for it to be good to go.
     
  3. stmcelroy

    stmcelroy Madras, OR Well-Known Member

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    Yes it is legal, as long as it brings the total barrel length including can to 16"+.

    No red locktite is not an approved method of permanently attaching a muzzle device.
     
  4. Gov't Mule

    Gov't Mule NW Member

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    What type of rifle are you considering?
     
  5. sasquatch98226

    sasquatch98226 Bellingham Member

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    either a .223, or maybe even a 9mm.
     
  6. Gov't Mule

    Gov't Mule NW Member

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    It boils down to 2 issues.

    1. Do you really want to permanently dedicate your suppressor to only one weapon? With a 9mm you could run it on multiple long guns and sidearms. With .223 you could have a 14.5" barrel with a permanently attached flash hider to bring it to 16" and a 20" varmint/target rig plus run it on a .22lr.

    2. Do you want to assume the risks of cleaning the weapon with the can permanently attached? Baffle strikes from a cleaning rod don't sound good. Neither does getting a bunch of cleaning gunk stuck in the can.
     
  7. coctailer

    coctailer Portland, OR/Hastings, MI/Vancouver,WA I run with scissors.

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    Cleaning rods and "gunk" won't hurt the can.

    The "gunk" will make it quieter.
     
  8. 8ball

    8ball WA Quit talkin' and start chalking!

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    I've read silver solder is OK to meet the minimum length. I want to do this myself with a PS90.

    Of course, we still need to overturn the WA ban on using silencers.
     
  9. Gov't Mule

    Gov't Mule NW Member

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    Here is what Kel from Gemtech has to say about this:

    I think that, in general, it's not optimal to permanently install anything that doesn't have to be.

    That said, I certainly understand the value of avoiding the secondary tax stamp, or for states where you can't have SBRs (WA, for instance, where I once lived).

    I might make some observations first: If any suppressor is to be permanently installed, it's obviously crucial that it be aligned correctly. Whoever is doing the install gets one shot at this, so do it right. "Permanent" is... permanent. If the welding is done wrong, and warps things, or disturbs heat treating, etc., that's a bad thing. Continuing in that vein, repairs to any part of the upper may be a future, downstream hassle due to the chunk of stainless steel now residing on the barrel, possbily preventing rail/gas system/barrel changes, etc.

    Weigh all this against the utility of the $200 tax stamp.

    The one thing that people bring up a lot against permanent .223 can installs is "Oh, you could get a PATCH stuck down in the can!" (The horrors!). I have to say, in the 15 years I've been selling suppressors, I've never seen a patch stuck in a can that caused a problem, although I'm sure it's happened. I'm also sure that the incredibly powerful superheated blast of gas will pretty much obliterate and push downrange a small strip of cotton. Overrated, near-chimerical concern, in my opinon.

    We warranty defects in our manufacturing and design - it's not reasonable to assume any manufacturer will warranty some hacksmith's work on their product.

    All that said, there is a logical conclusion concerning warranty issues: If it's done right, you'll never have a problem that would require service or even our knowledge of the work, no?

    Kel

    source: http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=2&f=246&t=190287
     
  10. wired

    wired Yakima Well-Known Member

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    I have several guns with permanently attached ie blind pinned and welded cans. $200 per can for the stamp. BFD. Red loctite is not kosher for permanantly attaching anything according to the ATF.