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Gun control reduces suicides

Discussion in 'General Firearm Discussion' started by jim97701, Sep 3, 2015.

  1. jim97701

    jim97701 Bend Well-Known Member

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  2. Diatribe

    Diatribe Issaquah, WA Member

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    You know what else? If you ban cars, deaths from auto accidents will drop precipitously.
     
  3. bolus

    bolus Portland Gold Supporter Gold Supporter 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    no link to study? automatically dont care what the journalist's interpretation of the study is.
     
  4. Boboclown

    Boboclown North Carolina Well-Known Member

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    Less people committing suicide also reduces suicide. Less people murdering each other also reduces murder. But you need to ban/control guns in order for people to stop thinking of suicide and murder? o_O
     
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  5. Lance Jacobs

    Lance Jacobs South Willamette Valley Oregon Well-Known Member

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    The journalist provides no links at all to the study, which is really shabby journalism on her part.

    However, she does say that the study was conducted by the Bloomberg School of Public Health. Does that tell you enough regarding whether it might possibly be biased??

    .
     
  6. etrain16

    etrain16 Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Having known several people that have committed suicide as well as a few who have attempted it, I can tell you, not having a gun didn't stop them. They used ropes, pills, knives and carbon monoxide.

    One of my long-time friends killed himself 3 years ago. He had been battling depression his whole life and the mental health folks just couldn't get his problems worked out. On the outside, he was the life of the party - kind of a Robin Williams character. Everybody loved him, but he hated life. He attempted suicide 3 times before he finally managed to finish the job. Each time, he used a rope. The attempt before the last, he almost succeeded, but someone came home early and found him. He spent the next 6 weeks in an ICU. A year and a half after his recovery, he did the same thing again, only this time, no one came home to find him until after he was gone. No guns involved. It still hurts to think about it, but all I can say is that if anything failed him, it wasn't access to rope, it was the inability for the mental health workers to get his depression under control - not that it's their fault; sometimes they just can't get through to these folks.

    Gun control just takes one of many tools away. Heck, how can you stop them from jumping off a high place - a cliff, a building, a bridge? Using suicides to continue to push an anti-gun agenda, an agenda that further restricts the rights of millions of Americans, is a pretty crappy way to make a false point. Suicide is awful no matter what method was used. Stop using the deaths of others to further your cause.
     
  7. Qaolin

    Qaolin 1 A.U. from a G2 near Beaverton Old Army Cook Silver Supporter

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    The only thing the absence of a gun accomplishes is the amount of time between ideation and execution decreases. The gun makes it quick and immediate while other methods of suicide take more planning. Even with access to a gun one still goes through a lengthy process of how,when,and where to make an exit. (Don't ask me how I know.) As etrain16 pointed out, the lack of a gun will not stop anyone truly bent on suicide. Most people who commit suicide will have left clues as to their intent if one is observant. I've lost friends to suicide and none used a gun.
     
  8. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    Exactly,there isn't enough pills in the US,well one state, to overdose the planet
     
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  9. etrain16

    etrain16 Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Well, let's let Google give us some additional information:

    According to this article (2013), Chicago area suicides are on the rise and officials don't know why. Funny, if guns are less available, shouldn't suicides go down??? http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...suicide-rates-prevention-death-investigations

    According to this article (2012), Chicago ranks the highest in the nation for teen suicides: http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...suicide-rates-prevention-death-investigations

    Oh, and this article shows that there are a very high number of suicides by train in the Chicago area - considering mass transit is usually a pet project of the same folks that push for gun control, does that mean, using their same logic, that they are responsible for more suicides??? http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-metra-suicides-met-20140825-story.html

    Point is that you can draw just about any conclusion you like from a few cherry-picked stats on the internet. But drawing a false conclusion without real supporting evidence just makes you look like an ignorant turd.
     
  10. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    Just as history is written by the winner,the surveys are written by the payer
     
  11. slimer13

    slimer13 Deer Park Well-Known Member

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    Gun control also makes you better looking, taller and better in bed. Fact, check Snopes.
     
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  12. edslhead

    edslhead Vanc Gold Supporter Gold Supporter Silver Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Why is suicide a bad thing? Isn't the whole point to keep disturbed people from killing others.
     
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  13. DuneHopper

    DuneHopper Douglas County. Well-Known Member

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    Yes this is the same theory they use to end drug addiction, obesity and it works so well ............Not !
     
  14. Heywood

    Heywood Prineville Oregon Well-Known Member

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    I am shocked the very people that think government sanctioned suicide is "death with dignity" but doing it by your own hand is a bad thing.
    Is it the fact that they don't have control of the matter that they don't like?
    Or are they just throwing excrement at a wall to see what sticks with hopes the mindless sponges will come soak it up?
    Both perhaps?
     
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  15. Diatribe

    Diatribe Issaquah, WA Member

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    The left likes to throw suicide numbers in their gun violence numbers. I struggle to intellectually classify suicide as "violence". That 33,000 people die a year from guns number they are always spewing? Yeah, that includes 22,000 suicides. Here are some even better numbers. The total number of suicides for 2011 or 2013 (I can't remember, the number is pretty consistent year to year) was 38,000. So a little more than half of the suicides used firearms as the method. BUT. And this is a big but. The CDC estimates that there are 25 times more ATTEMPTED suicides than actual suicides. So that is almost 1 MILLION total suicide attempts with 38,000 successful suicides. I think we all agree that the number of attempted suicides by firearms is likely much lower than any other method unless you are a complete idiot. So let's say that there are twice the number of suicide attempts by firearm than successful suicides. That means there are 44,000 suicide attempts using a firearm. I don't believe it is that high, but I'll use that number for illustrative purposes. That is 44,000 out of 1 million attempts. Or in simpler terms, 4.4% of all suicides are attempted with firearms. This tells me that we don't have a firearm problem, we have a mental health problem. If you got rid of guns, you'd still have 956,000 people trying to kill themselves every year.

    Finally, if suicides are on the rise, I'd love to see a graph of social media growth against suicide growth. I know correlation doesn't equal causation, but I cannot say that I think social media has been healthy for our children. A whole new realm of bullying has been created.
     
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  16. Morpheus

    Morpheus Columbia Gorge Anyway, back on the farm.

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    Correlation does not equal causation.

    Just looking at the Wiki on Suicide Rates we are 50th (based on 2013 data). With our rate about 12.1 per 100,000 people.

    South Korea, Japan, Iceland and Finland are all have worse rates.

    Australia is 63rd is 63rd (tied with Solomon Island) at 10.6.

    If gun control really made a HUGE difference, then why are 4 countries with very strict laws if not complete bans have worse than us, and one with almost complete ban only 1.5 better?

    Maybe, just maybe. Suicide rates have little to nothing to do with means and more about the person committing suicide?

    But that would be silly talk, why address the person and not the means they use to commit the harm. (Or Self harm as the case may be.)
     
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  17. Martini_Up

    Martini_Up NW USA Well-Known Member

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    more attempts to justify gun control in the ever broadening people control campaign, all in a country who's national anthem claims 'land of the free' and who's own charter states firearms ownership 'shall not be infringed'.

    nothing good can come from all of this.
     
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  18. bolus

    bolus Portland Gold Supporter Gold Supporter 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    not necessarily. Some scientists still use critical thinking and try to stay unbiased no matter who donated enough to put their name on a school building. That's why I like to read the study.

    Its the same thing in medicine. I will never, ever, ever make medical decisions based on the media's interpretation of a medical study. I want to read the study myself. I have never seen the media get a medical study interpretation quite right (and therefore I assume that every story is not right either).
     
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  19. OLDNEWBIE

    OLDNEWBIE State of Flux Well-Known Member

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    Our suicide rate is sure to go up as euthanasia/assisted suicide is becomes more accepted/legal throughout our Country.
    I guess Progressives are O.K. with suicide for Elderly or Terminally Ill as long as a gun is not used?

    The whole suicide argument is asinine when you are talking about the method!
     
  20. NWGlockgal

    NWGlockgal Oregon Well-Known Member

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    A large percentage of suicides are due to depression. They are generally not a danger to anyone but themselves.
     
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