Getting ready for the ban

[CamoDeafie]

What anti-gun bill has been written or even sponsored by a Republican. I get that that's a pretty low bar, but it's still a bar the dems can't get over.

Mitch McConnell? Pat Toomey?

 

[CamoDeafie]

Again... have the Party of "Law and Order" managed to sponsor, put up, get bills through Committee to repeal the NFA, GCA, FOPA Hughes Amendment ..? I can only remember one bill introduced, and it died. I can only remember Hearing Protection Act, and National Reciprocity but these two arent calling to repeal all gun control laws. Bubblegum, if they were staunch 2A supporters, they oyghta have stuck to their guns and introduced such bills as often as the other Party introduces anti2A bills.

 

[GWS]

Mitch McConnell? Pat Toomey?

That's right. I forgot Toomey Manchin. What bill did McConnell write or sponsor?
Yeah, I know how he voted. I'm sure that was part of some political master plan that I do not appreciate but what anti 2A bill has he authored? What has he ?sponsored. The real point is that Democrats write and sponsor all, or very nearly all of the anti-gun legislation that has hit the House and Senate. I am not saying the Republicans aren't bad. I'm saying they are not as bad as the Democrats on gun legislation.
Like I said, a low bar.

 

[American123]

You mean "only one party is actively pushing for more gun control".

The other Party hasn't started hearings to my knowledge, to prosecute 18 USC Sec 241/242 violations, put bills to repeal gun control laws, nor actively campaigned on the side of 2A. They may say that they're "for 2A" but..... it was with the help of a couple of their members that the House AWB passed, even though seven (7) members from the actively anti2A party voted against the House AWB.

"A couple of members" compared to the almost entirety of the other side of the aisle. Acting like these are even in the same ballpark is disingenuous at the very least.

Why would politicians think pro 2nd amendment stuff would pass? There are lots of Elmers who think all they need is their bolt action deer rifle.

More activism is needed. Putting politicians between a rock and a hard place and simply stating "we want this item repealed" and if you don't follow through with this we will find a replacement for you." Many politicians care most about re-election. It needs to be presented in a way they will care about.

 

[CamoDeafie]

I'm just saying, if the Republican Party members were just as passionate about 2A as they seem to be about pro-life and religious/faith based causes, and as passionate about defending and "expanding"(restoring actually) 2A protections as the Democratic Party is about dismantling and destroying 2A.... they would have more votes from the gun community IMO. How often do we see posts here that they (voters) aren't going to bother voting if the candidate is not all in on 2A protection, or 100% lock step with their standards?

Again, while it seems true that they aren't writing or sponsoring anti 2A bills, it is also true that they are not actively campaigning and promoting and writing bills to repeal gun control laws and to abolish the ATF and rein in FBI and DOJ attacks on gun owners, at least, not as fervently as the Democrats are pushing for gun control.

They have shown themselves to be more... cowardly when it comes to 2A causes. Every time Hearing Protection Act or National Reciprocity or defunding ATF is brought up, something happens, and the Democrats uses that to kill these ideas and the Republicans as a whole, roll over.

Who has "compromised" with the Democrats on gun control laws to get them passed? Didn't 15( fifteen) Republican Senators vote yes on the last "bipartisan" Senate gun control bill?

And @American123 ; 2 Republicans who voted yes on House AWB versus 7 Democrats who voted no on House AWB...I'd say that says more than what you infer.. that in the Democrat camp, there are more persons who remembers what happened in 1994 mid terms.

 

[American123]

I'm just saying, if the Republican Party members were just as passionate about 2A as they seem to be about pro-life and religious/faith based causes, and as passionate about defending and "expanding"(restoring actually) 2A protections as the Democratic Party is about dismantling and destroying 2A.... they would have more votes from the gun community IMO. How often do we see posts here that they (voters) aren't going to bother voting if the candidate is not all in on 2A protection, or 100% lock step with their standards?

Again, while it seems true that they aren't writing or sponsoring anti 2A bills, it is also true that they are not actively campaigning and promoting and writing bills to repeal gun control laws and to abolish the ATF and rein in FBI and DOJ attacks on gun owners, at least, not as fervently as the Democrats are pushing for gun control.

They have shown themselves to be more... cowardly when it comes to 2A causes. Every time Hearing Protection Act or National Reciprocity or defunding ATF is brought up, something happens, and the Democrats uses that to kill these ideas and the Republicans as a whole, roll over.

Who has "compromised" with the Democrats on gun control laws to get them passed? Didn't 15( fifteen) Republican Senators vote yes on the last "bipartisan" Senate gun control bill?

And @American123 ; 2 Republicans who voted yes on House AWB versus 7 Democrats who voted no on House AWB...I'd say that says more than what you infer.. that in the Democrat camp, there are more persons who remembers what happened in 1994 mid terms.

Looking at that last paragraph - ok, now post the numbers of how many on each side voted yes. Like I said - super disingenuous to even make that comparison and claim it is remotely in the same ballpark.

Regarding getting more gun owners to vote - I also call complete BS on that. In Washington state for example we couldn't get enough votes to defeat ballot initiatives 594 and 1639 - items that had somewhat little turn out and many gun owners never new about until after they had already been passed.

There is some new blood in the pool that are not yellow (and by that I mean cowardly, obviously).

Majorie Taylor Green (despite some wackiness in some ways, is one of them)

 

[Member 3687]

Regarding getting more gun owners to vote - I also call complete BS on that. In Washington state for example we couldn't get enough votes to defeat ballot initiatives 594 and 1639 - items that had somewhat little turn out and many gun owners never new about until after they had already been passed.

The sad part is even now a lot of gun owners, and want to be gun owners, sill do not know about this or the 68 gun act or the 86 gun act and so on and so on,

I work in a shop about 25 miles from Spokane in Idaho and I get folks all the time from Washington, California and so on that want to buy guns that I can't sell them because of Washington/California/Federal gun law and they look at me and ask when did that go into effect with a straight face. We do not transfer but they just assumed they could just buy it and walk out the door.

Guns are not their priority on the ballot, until they want to buy one, then they feel its just not right.

So getting these folks to vote is not going to be easy and with out them we could be screwed.

 

[mhayd93]

Looking at that last paragraph - ok, now post the numbers of how many on each side voted yes. Like I said - super disingenuous to even make that comparison and claim it is remotely in the same ballpark.

Regarding getting more gun owners to vote - I also call complete BS on that. In Washington state for example we couldn't get enough votes to defeat ballot initiatives 594 and 1639 - items that had somewhat little turn out and many gun owners never new about until after they had already been passed.

There is some new blood in the pool that are not yellow (and by that I mean cowardly, obviously).

Majorie Taylor Green (despite some wackiness in some ways, is one of them)

Just like we have many gun owners in Oregon completely unaware of Ballot Measure 114 that we will be voting on in November!

Oregon - Oregon Ballot Measure 114 – Magazine Ban and Permit To Purchase Firearms — Vote NO!

All Oregonians, take notice, Ballot Measure 114 (spawned from the successful initiative petition 17) will be on the ballot this November. If it passes (YES on 114), Oregon will become one of the most restrictive States in the Union when it comes to our 2nd Amendment rights. Most notably...

www.northwestfirearms.com

The 2nd Amendment has been under constant attack for much of the last 100 years; it's sad that many gun owners still allow themselves to be ignorant of proposed legislation until it's too late!

 

[CamoDeafie]

Looking at that last paragraph - ok, now post the numbers of how many on each side voted yes. Like I said - super disingenuous to even make that comparison and claim it is remotely in the same ballpark.

217 to 213.


If the two Republicans who voted yes had voted no, it could have been 215 to 215, thus killing the AWB....

If the seven Democrats who voted no, had voted yes; and the same two Republicans voted no; it could have been 222 to 208.

If the seven Democrats voted yes instead no, and the two Republicans voted yes anyways, it would be 224 to 206.

It is more significant that seven Democrats voted no than that two Republicans voted yes. While yeah, it was significant that these two Republicans had sided with the party of gun control, the simple fact remains... if the same seven Democrats had voted yes, then these two Republicans' votes would have been relatively insignificant and the House AWB passed.

 

[Old Dog]

Regarding getting more gun owners to vote - I also call complete BS on that. In Washington state for example we couldn't get enough votes to defeat ballot initiatives 594 and 1639 - items that had somewhat little turn out and many gun owners never new about until after they had already been passed.

Yep. Spot on.

In one rural Eastern WA county, that always votes Republican, with one of the highest percentages of CPL holders (and presumably gun-owners), only 17% of eligible registered voters turned out -- so we got I-594 foisted on us. Wasn't much better in many of the other traditionally "red" counties.

Fast forward six years, now comes I-1639. Same results.

Every gun shop (even Sportsman's Warehouse, Cabela's, Bass Pro) and gun show had the anti-initiative political posters, banners, ads, there were bumper stickers -- how could you be an RKBA defender and not be aware? Plain and simple -- as a group, we suck, .

 

[sobo]

Yep. Spot on.

In one rural Eastern WA county, that always votes Republican, with one of the highest percentages of CPL holders (and presumably gun-owners), only 17% of eligible registered voters turned out -- so we got I-594 foisted on us. Wasn't much better in many of the other traditionally "red" counties.

Fast forward six years, now comes I-1639. Same results.

Every gun shop (even Sportsman's Warehouse, Cabela's, Bass Pro) and gun show had the anti-initiative political posters, banners, ads, there were bumper stickers -- how could you be an RKBA defender and not be aware? Plain and simple -- as a group, we suck, .

Yes, that whole failure of a response by supposedly RKBA supporters really bit me in the crotch. And it still smarts...

 

[American123]

Yep. Spot on.

In one rural Eastern WA county, that always votes Republican, with one of the highest percentages of CPL holders (and presumably gun-owners), only 17% of eligible registered voters turned out -- so we got I-594 foisted on us. Wasn't much better in many of the other traditionally "red" counties.

Fast forward six years, now comes I-1639. Same results.

Every gun shop (even Sportsman's Warehouse, Cabela's, Bass Pro) and gun show had the anti-initiative political posters, banners, ads, there were bumper stickers -- how could you be an RKBA defender and not be aware? Plain and simple -- as a group, we suck, .

That's because a small voracious, organized and militantly aggressive group can steer a huge group of people and stand up to much larger less-so forces.

That's literally the history of the US during the revolution and also (not that they are comparable) the history of Nazi movement and rise to power, Stalin in Russia, and Mao in China.

 

[American123]

217 to 213.


If the two Republicans who voted yes had voted no, it could have been 215 to 215, thus killing the AWB....

If the seven Democrats who voted no, had voted yes; and the same two Republicans voted no; it could have been 222 to 208.

If the seven Democrats voted yes instead no, and the two Republicans voted yes anyways, it would be 224 to 206.

It is more significant that seven Democrats voted no than that two Republicans voted yes. While yeah, it was significant that these two Republicans had sided with the party of gun control, the simple fact remains... if the same seven Democrats had voted yes, then these two Republicans' votes would have been relatively insignificant and the House AWB passed.

No sorry - it's not significant, what is most significant is the fact that the vote happened entirely along party lines either for or against.

Those that voted for or against separate from their party may have voted their conscience, or knew the outcome regardless of their vote and tried to make a "see I tried" to their constituents.

 

[Diamondback]

That's because a small voracious, organized and militantly aggressive group can steer a huge group of people and stand up to much larger less-so forces.

That's literally the history of the US during the revolution and also (not that they are comparable) the history of Nazi movement and rise to power, Stalin in Russia, and Mao in China.

So the game is, how do WE get organized as well as them?

 

[American123]

So the game is, how do WE get organized as well as them?

Grass roots advocacy seems to be the only viable method. People can't make sure to vote for/against something they know nothing about.

I made sure when 594 was a ballot measure to explain to everyone in every circle I was in why they should vote "no" - politics is downstream of culture though so the real problem is cultural.

 

[Diamondback]

Grass roots advocacy seems to be the only viable method. People can't make sure to vote for/against something they know nothing about.

I made sure when 594 was a ballot measure to explain to everyone in every circle I was in why they should vote "no" - politics is downstream of culture though so the real problem is cultural.

And then we et to the problem of MAKING people care... the Average Mouthbreathing Retard refuses to ever read the gory details and insists "they'd NEVER do that to us" despite all prior evidence saying otherwise, then p--- and moan ehen it does get rammed up their rear about "why didn't YOU stop this"... *rolls eyes*

Steve Kirby is the ONE dude who did this to us with his key vote to let it out of committee, and if you support him YOU did this to us too.

 

[American123]

And then we et to the problem of MAKING people care... the Average Mouthbreathing Retard refuses to ever read the gory details and insists "they'd NEVER do that to us" despite all prior evidence saying otherwise, then p--- and moan ehen it does get rammed up their rear about "why didn't YOU stop this"... *rolls eyes*

Steve Kirby is the ONE dude who did this to us with his key vote to let it out of committee, and if you support him YOU did this to us too.

I like the phrase F (insert politician here) and F you for voting for (him/her)!

Being in Seattle / King county I don't recall a single thing I've ever voted for that went the way I wanted it to go except for the 2016 presidential election.

 

[Diamondback]

I like the phrase F (insert politician here) and F you for voting for (him/her)!

Being in Seattle / King county I don't recall a single thing I've ever voted for that went the way I wanted it to go except for the 2016 presidential election.

There's a dude on TOS whose av says it all. A pic of Steve Austin with the words "Vote Blue? F You!"

To you so-called "pro-gun Dems,"*snorting laughter* YOU need to start cleaning house in your own party.

 

[American123]

There's a dude on TOS whose av says it all. A pic of Steve Austin with the words "Vote Blue? F You!"

To you so-called "pro-gun Dems,"*snorting laughter* YOU need to start cleaning house in your own party.

Thread close imminent for sure - but you can't have high expectations from people who support a political party that claims "men can get pregnant."

 

[xtratoy]

And then we et to the problem of MAKING people care... the Average Mouthbreathing Retard refuses to ever read the gory details and insists "they'd NEVER do that to us" despite all prior evidence saying otherwise, then p--- and moan ehen it does get rammed up their rear about "why didn't YOU stop this"... *rolls eyes*

These are same people who proudly claim " I don't waste my time voting, it doesn't matter".