Do we as CHL holders live in a dream world?

[biggie24420]

Hey everyone.... I was up very early and decided to troll around on youtube and I ran into this two parter video and it really made me think how I would do in a situation where if I had to draw my concealed firearm and use it. To me this was a sobering experience and I thought I share it with you guys.

Part 1
YouTube - Proof that Concealed Carry permit holders live in a dream world, Part One

Part 2
YouTube - Proof that Concealed Carry permit holders live in a dream world, Part Two

Read More

 

[Father of four]

I watched most of the first video and stopped...The shooter that comes into the classroom seems to already know who has the gun and where they are seated. Both the guy then the girl are placed in the front row in the same seat.

Unable to draw a fair conclusion.

 

[Sponkmeister]

This video made the rounds before and it was staged in favor of the "bad guy."

 

[ShelbyT]

that guy was set up to fail so hard... made it about 4 minutes before I had to turn it off..

helmet and big gloves, baggy shirt :huh:

 

[NK777]

Aside from all the propaganda it is true that training is key. Gun's aren't magical. The video has an agenda that is further reaching then this however which is very upsetting.

 

[CEF1959]

I watched most of the first video and stopped...The shooter that comes into the classroom seems to already know who has the gun and where they are seated.

Which is one of my objections to open carry. Why let the bad guy identify YOU as an important target?

 

[LibertyorDeath]

Firearms instructor versus a novice that didn't even know how to draw a weapon concealed. Shooter knows who has the weapon. Yup this is a totally true unbiased video and we should all throw away our carry permits.

 

[raftman]

Also, the BG in the little scenario is a firearms instructor, while the defenders were given rudimentary training in the function of their gun and apparently given little or no opportunity to practice drawing their weapon. Plus, as already mention, the BG seems to know exactly who is armed and where they are, taking them out early on. Definitely set up for the defender to fail.

 

[LibertyorDeath]

Which is one of my objections to open carry. Why let the bad guy identify YOU as an important target?

I don't open carry but if everyone did there would probably be a lot less crime.

 

[fry]

no, the media lives in a dream world.

 

[matt_w]

The video makes a good point though...since the odds may are stacked against you (is there ever a fair gun fight after all?), you should just sit there and wait for the cops to arrive and ask the gunman nicely not to shoot you in the face.

 

[shotgun-2]

I agree at least being armed gives you a chance to protect yourself and others around you. I think in most cases though the perp has the suprise thing going for him and will find it easier to pull the trigger than a citizen will.

Also remember the 4 Lakewood officers gunned down by one man with a 38 spc. revolver, they were trained, experenced, armed, and wearing body armor.

Hopefully none of us will ever be faced by an armed Bad Guy, but without being armed you have no chance of defending yourself at all.

 

[biggie24420]

I see how it's kinda one sided and also I learned a few things. Just because I have a gun it doesn't mean in need to engage.... also I know I need more training so I can control my tunnel vision, making sure I look around for multiple bad guys etc. I also learned that if you can why not wear concealable body armor. Yeah I know, it can sound like your paranoid but hey if you can afford concealable body armor and you can wear it comfortably.... why not? I personally don't think it's being paranoid, but smart. Yeah you can't wear it all the time but at least certain places and certain times might help.

I don't know I just got a lot of mixed feelings about the video and it made me think about a few things so.......... that's all.

 

[Dr. Tatu]

Firstly, just because a story is in the "media" (which, by the way, is technically all forms of mass communication) and is critical of guns does not make it an anti-gun-commie-liberal-conspiracy meant to take away yer freedumbs.

Secondly, any informed/intelligent argument or conclusion regarding a story/article/piece of legislation/political candidate/book/film/person/situation/etc. CAN NOT be adequately formed through only examining 1/4 of the item. If you had to stop watching after 4 of the 15 minutes, how could you possibly have any clue what the rest of the piece concludes?

Despite the clearly slanted training and testing experiments, I found the piece pretty interesting. It really reinforced the fact that consistent/constant and serious TRAINING is incredibly important for those of us who plan on using firearms for self defense. *GASP* untrained people with firearms are dangerous!?!?!?!???? Holy crap, I must have an anti-gun bias!!!

Honestly, seeing the "safety practices" (or lack thereof) of other people around me at ranges and in the woods I think we're SAFER with FEWER people carrying handguns!!! Taking a 2 hour class from someone that goes over how to disassemble a pistol and then paying $65 and getting a piece of paper DOES NOT a super-dooper gun and crime fighting super cool safe pistol slinging hero make!

That said, I do think that having more people that were trained in safety/safety/safety/tactics/safety/marksmanship/safety/skills AND THEN carrying would be a good thing.

 

[Dr. Tatu]

not sure why I went off to that extent...as I re-read the above posts, there wasn't a single mention of liberal media bias...or anti-gun conspiracy...

oh well.

 

[The Somnambulist]

Gives me some good ideas to enhance my training.

 

[Decker]

IMHO there are some good tidbits in there to keep in mind... like constantly training and when you train do more then just stand there and shoot at a paper target. However, as pointed out, those people were set up to fail... ****, those shirts they were given to wear were long enough to be dresses so even getting to your pistol is going to take a hella lot longer then a proper length shirt.

my .02

-d

 

[8ball]

There is definitely some truth in it, regardless of the editorializing.

Let's face it - most CHL holders don't train to the level that they could survive an encounter like that. There are 250,000 in WA alone. If eveone ryreally trained like that, ranges would be packed 24/7 and training courses would be booked out. You'd need a ton of regular force on force training to survive that.

Even pro-2A sites like Armed Citizen anecdotally seem to indicate that a good number of defensive encounters end up with most bullets missing their targets, fewer fatal shots to the BG than you might think and a fair number of wounded good guys. As shotgun-2 pointed out, our recent history in WA shows that even four well trained police officers can be jumped by a single guy.

Having said all that, as long as you aren't going to hit a bystander, I'd still prefer to be carrying.

FYI, they weren't all inexperienced shooters. One guy allegedly had hundreds of hours of range time. Criticizing the students for not taking cover is a bit weak. Those desks would not have stopped any bullets.

Technical question: were they using Simunitions?

 

[MarkAd]

range plinking time is not training time. My last trip to KRRC I shot 50 rounds, 45 ACP, in an hour plus. Most was single round draw fire reload with a one round mag, make safe and holster. I was gooing slow and it was tough to do smoothly. TRAINING MODE is hard work.

 

[pokerace]

This is an old video,and it's all fixed.