Charged with brandishing???

[Toxic6]

Advocates flaunt their guns to support rifle-totin' teen

Someone shared this on another forum I am on, asking for opinions. What do you guys think? I think "brandishing" is a stretch lol.

more info http://birmingham.patch.com/articles/rifle-carrying-teen-pleads-not-guilty-pre-trial-set-for-mid-may

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[Kimber Custom]

Not nearly enough detail in that paragraph to make any real commentary but when has that ever stopped us before

 

[Toxic6]

Right....lol. I'll see if I can find any other story links.

Guessing the story wasn't violent enough to get a ton of coverage, but since guns were involved somehow it still made the news....

 

[deadeye]

It was here too.....http://www.northwestfirearms.com/le...un-enthusiasts-protest-arrest-birmingham.html

 

[sheepdip]

I dont often side with the police BUT, with the school shootings going on all over the country I dont blame them for wanting to give him the once over.

 

[MarkAd]

Sheepdip, put down the public education kool-aid and step back. The lad was not in or at a school.

 

[hermannr]

If you take the 18-21 year old's right to openly carry a pistol, what is left?

 

[PaulZ]

Good point, seems like "loaded with a round in the chamber" would be a poor choice also. Refused to show ID? Why? Then again, this is all assuming that the stories are accurate.

Sheepdip, put down the public education kool-aid and step back. The lad was not in or at a school.

 

[Norm0931]

Good point, seems like "loaded with a round in the chamber" would be a poor choice also. Refused to show ID? Why? Then again, this is all assuming that the stories are accurate.

"Loaded with a round in the chamber" is the way guns work. Loading a round in an extra step that you may not have time to make. That's really irrelevant though. Considering it's not illegal.

Refused to show ID? Why? ...Probably because he knew he wasn't required to. Last time I check this was not yet Communist Russia or Nazi Germany where you have to have your papers on you and supply them at command to prove you are not doing anything wrong.

Likely situation:
Cops see "kid" with gun.
Cops stop "kid" who, knowing the law, tells them "No."
Cops get angry and arrest "kid."
Cops make up bullbubblegum to justify when they are proven wrong.

Maybe that's not the case but, we see it happen to adults all the time. Some obviously overzealous cops being told they are in the wrong by an 18 year old probably did not make them anything but, pissed off that some "kid" questioned their "authority."

Would I have handled it differently, probably so but, did the cops overreact to a "Non-Sheaple," probably yes as well.

 

[PaulZ]

For the love of Mike Norm; An M1 Garand surrounded by teenagers at the mall. It is not a self defense weapon. The kid
wanted to show it off. I stand by my statement; "a round in the chamber was not a good idea".
As for not showing the Cop his ID; Why be a dick when you don't need to?

 

[BDA.45]

Why be a dick when you dont need to???? Why show your ID when you dont need to! Its people like this, who get the judgement of us, that help us keep our rights. Why ID yourself? Your not required to. I flex my rights whenever and wherever I can. I dont look for it but if it finds me, I flex. CHL with a cop; I never tell them Im carrying. Asked for ID??? I dont show it. Its MY/OUR RIGHT. Stopped by the Border Patrol in CA last summer and sat there for 45 min while they threatened to rip me out of the car for non compliance, got let go after not stating my citizenship and not showing ID. Why? Because I dont have to! Am I being detained???? Am I FREE to go???? NO? Got nothing to say to you then, speak with my attorney! IM a dick because MOST OTHER PEOPLE ARE NOT!!! Fight for your rights. Your not going to, but somebody else will and we'll all judge 'em here safe behind our computers.

 

[rsmccsman]

Maybe there is a city ordinance or state hunting safety regulation there that states you can't carry a rifle with a round loaded in the chamber, that is a pretty common rule. I know you can't carry a long gun in a car with a loaded chamber in most states. Nevertheless they didn't have probable cause to believe their was a round in the chamber when they stopped him. In the State I am from originally the charge of brandishing a weapon usually involves pointing the weapon at someone in a threatening or menacing manner, not simply carrying it. So I agree that brandishing is a stretch, unless this kid was "showing off." by handling the gun in an unsafe manner. (I wasn't there I don't know if that's what happened, I guess his friends can all be his witnesses in court.)

The police will stop you and question you these days if you carry a gun openly. That is the reality of our new politically correct society. Model responsible gun ownership and change public opinion that just sees us as a bunch of nuts with guns. The Supreme Court cares little for the constitution or the Bill of Rights as written or the founders original intent. Preserving our rights involves educating people. If the politicians have the votes they will do what they want to restrict our freedom, however, if public opinion is against them they will be cowards and not openly support gun control for fear of not being reelected. Sure it would be nice to think that the founders ratified the second amendment and that settles it forever, but that is not reality.

Why go out of your way to give the police a reason to mess with you? There are enough laws out there they can usually find a reason to make you life miserable even if it doesn't stick in court. I'm not saying don't stand up for your rights, I'm saying exercise good judgement and discretion.

The kid was legal to own the gun if I were the police questioning him about it, I would have contacted him too (the police are allowed to walk up and talk to you), and once I verified that he was legal to own the gun and asked him a few questions about what he was doing with it, I would have left him with some advice to not freak out the liberals and little old ladies in the neighborhood by walking around with a rifle, and to keep the chamber empty on a long gun for safety. When I got my first car as a teenager I drove it to a friends house to show it off, before taking it to the DMV to get plates for it and I got pulled over on the way home. I was polite to the police officer who ran me for warrants and my car to see if it was stolen. He was not a jerk and I didn't give him attitude. Once he checked everything out he told me I was free to go and to have a nice day. (not quite the same as this situation but my point is things could have gone differently if I had a bad attitude.)

Now if the cop was just being a jerk, then there is certainly a time to simply ask the questions BDA45 asks "Am I being detained???? Am I FREE to go???? NO? Got nothing to say to you then, speak with my attorney!" I would just suggest doing it without being a "dick."

 

[hermannr]

BTW: an 18 year old isn't a "kid". At 18 they are legal adults, they can vote, get shot at while in the military and die, they can contract...an 18 year old is a legal Adult in every state I know of...except, when it comes to firearms and being a US Senator or the President of the US.

Now, to me, I can call a 60 year old a "kid", and definately a 40+ year old, as I have an over 40 year old daughter, but you know what, they are all legal adults, and should be treated as such.

PaulZ...what do you do when the law restricts your ability to carry what would be normally considered a "defensive weapon"?

Sheepdip...you bought into the Brady bunch hook, line and sinker, you are no better than that jack booted thug of a LEO.

 

[fd15k]

Anybody open carried in Portland lately ? I believe PPD was threatening to charge open carriers with "disturbance of peace", since they can't charge CHL holders for unlawful possession. As for the brandishing charges, cops often do that - charge a person with number of things, to increase their chances of something actually sticking.

 

[fd15k]

BTW: an 18 year old isn't a "kid". At 18 they are legal adults, they can vote, get shot at while in the military and die, they can contract...an 18 year old is a legal Adult in every state I know of...except, when it comes to firearms and being a US Senator or the President of the US

And celebrating our Independence Day with a bottle of beer.

 

[hermannr]

Anybody open carried in Portland lately ? I believe PPD was threatening to charge open carriers with "disturbance of peace", since they can't charge CHL holders for unlawful possession. As for the brandishing charges, cops often do that - charge a person with number of things, to increase their chances of something actually sticking.

ORS 166.025 "Disorderly Conduct" is not conducive to success here for the LEO's...you have to be doing something that is "unlawful" for them to even come close...

Open "carry of a pistol in a holster on your hip" (ORS 166.250(3)) is, by definition not concealed, not covered by the prohibitions in ORS 166.250, and not an unlawful activity...doesn't mean they are not going to try until someone picks their pocket through a civil rights lawsuit again.

Oh yes, alcohol...demon rum...the prohibitionists are still here with us today, you are correct there fd15k

 

[fd15k]

ORS 166.025 "Disorderly Conduct" is not conducive to success here for the LEO's...you have to be doing something that is "unlawful" for them to even come close...

Open "carry of a pistol in a holster on your hip" (ORS 166.250(3)) is, by definition not concealed, not covered by the prohibitions in ORS 166.250, and not an unlawful activity...doesn't mean they are not going to try until someone picks their pocket through a civil rights lawsuit again.

No, not under state statute, but under city ordinance. Although I just did a search, and couldn't find any ordinance like that.

 

[badclam]

"Loaded with a round in the chamber" is the way guns work. Loading a round in an extra step that you may not have time to make. That's really irrelevant though. Considering it's not illegal.

Refused to show ID? Why? ...Probably because he knew he wasn't required to. Last time I check this was not yet Communist Russia or Nazi Germany where you have to have your papers on you and supply them at command to prove you are not doing anything wrong.
.

Have you watched any news in the last month? You can be arrested in Arizona for not having or producing papers.

 

[fd15k]

Have you watched any news in the last month? You can be arrested in Arizona for not having or producing papers.

That's not true.

 

[Mohawk13]

Badclam,
Yes You Can!!! If You appear not to belong there, they will check You out. Most States have a Law on the Books, that You Must produce ID for the Police, on request....Arizona (along with Many other US States) have been invaded from the South. They are just trying to maintain their Sovereignty!!!!!