ATF trolling classified adds

[Paolung]

Either the ATF is trolling classified adds and trying to bait people into selling firearms illegally or there are some really uneducated (about buying process) people here. Ive had multiple people asking to ship to states that are restricted or wanting to do shady hand- offs.
My feeling is that the ATF Portland division is on this site and trying to bait people like they did to the airport executive they shot killed. Just thought id share this experience.

Or maybe, just maybe, some people just don't believe in having their rights infringed.

 

[PORSCHE928S4]

Only shady deal here was a guy selling an original Belgium FAL for $2k said he wants me to send electronic payment before meeting at ffl. His English was very formal so likely the Nigerian prince wanting to make life easier.

If it is this Prince the deal was prolly legit !

 

[Yarome]

If the receiver was originally a rifle, I don't think it can ever be an "other" or pistol ever - or at least it shouldn't be transferred that way - IMO.

And yes, I know, that if it was originally a pistol or "other" then that is fine (to be transferred as such) - just saying to be careful about such.

Indeed. There can be varying factors involved in a wide variety of situations. My post wasn't intended as a deep dive into any "given" situation. Merely a single surface example that could possibly appear as a "shady hand-off" to someone not as well versed to know that something like that is actually quite a common practice.

Obviously, I don't know what the OP's knowledge level is when it comes to firearm or related deals. I just know that some folks idea of what is "shady" or not can sometimes be inaccurate.


Anecdote:
I was once trying to buy a shotgun barrel from an out of state guy. He was under the impression it could only be shipped to an FFL in my state via overnight shipping with signature required and wanted me to pay the exorbitant and unnecessary costs. I informed him that an FFL wasn't required and asked him to give me a standard shipping quote directly to a residential address. He immediately cancelled the deal and blocked comms stating he won't deal with anyone asking him to engage in illegal activity. That was the end of that!

(I even got reported to the admin's.(not NWFA))

Funny thing is. It was a fairly rare SxS barrel in excellent condition and his asking was one of those "on the verge of stealing it" varieties. If he had written back and insisted that was the only way he would ship it... I woulda paid the extra and been happy to pick it up from the LGS.

 

[VinnieBoomBah]

Indeed. There can be varying factors involved in a wide variety of situations. My post wasn't intended as a deep dive into any "given" situation. Merely a single surface example that could possibly appear as a "shady hand-off" to someone not as well versed to know that something like that is actually quite a common practice.

Obviously, I don't know what the OP's knowledge level is when it comes to firearm or related deals. I just know that some folks idea of what is "shady" or not can sometimes be inaccurate.


Anecdote:
I was once trying to buy a shotgun barrel from an out of state guy. He was under the impression it could only be shipped to an FFL in my state via overnight shipping with signature required and wanted me to pay the exorbitant and unnecessary costs. I informed him that an FFL wasn't required and asked him to give me a standard shipping quote directly to a residential address. He immediately cancelled the deal and blocked comms stating he won't deal with anyone asking him to engage in illegal activity. That was the end of that!

(I even got reported to the admin's.(not NWFA))

Funny thing is. It was a fairly rare SxS barrel in excellent condition and his asking was one of those "on the verge of stealing it" varieties. If he had written back and insisted that was the only way he would ship it... I woulda paid the extra and been happy to pick it up from the LGS.

Lots of folks' get their "knowledge" from the LGS, can you imagine if The Gun Room was their only LGS?

 

[monkeybutler]

I expect ATF doesn't have the resources to sleaze places like this under most circumstances. Seems the most gov scrutiny is on FFLs, with the recent laws in WA, and the utterly inscrutable to vendors crap in them.

 

[ma96782]

Aloha, Mark

 

[RVTECH]

Another forum I am a member of (very 'old' forum - probably one of the first) has a real problem with trolls, however a lot of them appear to be 'bots' but a lot of the membership is pretty naive and 'roll over' for them.

The biggest % is a new member posts wanting to 'know the value of this gun' they got from relative/family member etc. They post blurry pics of the gun, showing no markings and describing them like they know NOTHING about guns. Some of the guns they posts pics of are illegal such as chopped rifles and shotguns.

There are so many of these similarly verbatim they cannot be legit - and it's crickets thereafter from the 'new member'.

Then there is the new female 'member' who joins. Avatar is a pic of an attractive girl but the verbiage, grammar and punctuation is typically poor and is no doubt something AI or a BOT.

 

[Hawaiian]

20 years ago the Illinois State AG ordered some auto knives, aka switchblades, from a couple of internet dealers, actual stores, not individuals selling a knife on a forum.
The AG then filed charges against the dealers as auto knives are illegal in Illinois. Thereafter, most all of the dealers had 'No sales to Illinois' listed on their website for auto knives. Later, CA and a few other states were added to the no ship list.
The Feds also would not go after individuals for auto knives. If customs discovered an auto knife being shipped from Italy, they would confiscate it and send the owner a seizure letter, stating ' we have it, if you want to claim it, come see us.' LOL. They would take action against the individual if they discovered a large shipment worth $$$.
Bottom line is if the Govt is going to spend $ and resources they are going after a larger target like the dealers in the business, not Joe Blow selling/buying one or two items on a forum.
On the other hand, it would not surprise me to see the anti gun activist organizations posting up on a forum just so they can say that the evil gun forums are illegally selling guns.

 

[Stomper]

Either the ATF is trolling classified adds and trying to bait people into selling firearms illegally or there are some really uneducated (about buying process) people here. Ive had multiple people asking to ship to states that are restricted or wanting to do shady hand- offs.
My feeling is that the ATF Portland division is on this site and trying to bait people like they did to the airport executive they shot killed. Just thought id share this experience.

Be careful…. the ATF are master baiters at snatching as many water-heads as they can.

 

[Flopsweat]

Another forum I am a member of (very 'old' forum - probably one of the first) has a real problem with trolls, however a lot of them appear to be 'bots' but a lot of the membership is pretty naive and 'roll over' for them.

The biggest % is a new member posts wanting to 'know the value of this gun' they got from relative/family member etc. They post blurry pics of the gun, showing no markings and describing them like they know NOTHING about guns. Some of the guns they posts pics of are illegal such as chopped rifles and shotguns.

There are so many of these similarly verbatim they cannot be legit - and it's crickets thereafter from the 'new member'.

Then there is the new female 'member' who joins. Avatar is a pic of an attractive girl but the verbiage, grammar and punctuation is typically poor and is no doubt something AI or a BOT.

Sounds like a poorly managed forum.

 

[Flopsweat]

Be careful…. the ATF are master baiters at snatching as many water-heads as they can.

Yep. Seems like lately they're going after headlines instead of major kingpins. All we hear about in the news is some low-IQ dumbas getting conned into doing something stupid by 6 feds and three confidential informants over 6 months. It's never Leaders of Major Drug Smuggling Gun Running Operation Arrested. It's always Hillbilly Crack Heads Sold Two Guns to Feds Acting Like Violent Retards.

 

[Alexx1401]

Hanlon's Razor

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

This!
The feds have FAR too much to do to bother with trying to buy one gun off some site like this. If anyone would give 2 s it would be a State AG and even they just don't have the time. There are a LOT of people who will both try to get you to ship a gun to them, and or let you sell to them face to face. Doing so is of course over the top dumb but, I have little doubt a lot of people do play this little risky game.

 

[RVTECH]

Sounds like a poorly managed forum.

Yes it is. Some of the rules are really strange and unnecessary, and mods & mgt don't seem to understand common internet concepts, such as memes. Memes are NOT allowed, but sometimes someone will post a pic with no captions and a mod will delete it calling it a meme.

New member 'welcome' Introductory post pictures are not allowed.

If a video is posted that has ANYTHING 'impure', or ANY swear words it is deleted and the member is warned or temporarily banned.

I am NOT passing judgement but this forum has a very active 'religious' membership and has a 'religious discussion' thread category.

 

[Gunbuggy]

Here's a little quick questionnaire to help you know if the alphabet boys are in your forum.

#1- Are you engaging in buying, selling or discussing firearms on the internet?

If your answer is yes, then the feds are monitoring the forum.

Don't be stupid, don't do handshake deals with ppl you don't know, don't sell banned items to people you don't know, you'll be fine.


You'd have to be a moron to even question if there are 3 letter boys on this forum.

 

[Yarome]

Yeah. I don't think the alphabet is too into searching and entrapping randomly on a forum like this.... unless... something draws their attention. IE., following up on a credible tip that illegal activity is occurring (they are obligated to investigate).. or say someone on here sold something that showed up at a crime scene. In the course of investigating that individual seller they might take a broader look at others and put out some "feelers" on the same forum to see if it's some kind of hotbed for illegal activity. I'm sure it would be focused mainly on the individual, but you never know what might trigger an investigator once they start poking around.

"Show me the man and I'll show you the crime" mentality.

I'm quite sure that airport exec never dreamed his activity had drawn official attention and had no clue whatsoever he was even under investigation. It's likely he never even reached that realization before his lights went out. Standing at the pearly gates asking "WTAF was THAT all about!!" (???)

 

[monkeybutler]

Colonel Flagg and precious bodily fluids.

 

[The Heretic]

This!
The feds have FAR too much to do to bother with trying to buy one gun off some site like this. If anyone would give 2 s it would be a State AG and even they just don't have the time. There are a LOT of people who will both try to get you to ship a gun to them, and or let you sell to them face to face. Doing so is of course over the top dumb but, I have little doubt a lot of people do play this little risky game.

It might be some other entity seeking headlines, like the Oregon gov. or a city gov. or just some anti-gun entity, looking for somebody to make an example of. I wish we were back in the good old days, but I never knowingly ask someone to break the law and if they ask me to, then I decline.

 

[Gunbuggy]

Yeah. I don't think the alphabet is too into searching and entrapping randomly on a forum like this.... unless... something draws their attention. IE., following up on a credible tip that illegal activity is occurring (they are obligated to investigate).. or say someone on here sold something that showed up at a crime scene. In the course of investigating that individual seller they might take a broader look at others and put out some "feelers" on the same forum to see if it's some kind of hotbed for illegal activity. I'm sure it would be focused mainly on the individual, but you never know what might trigger an investigator once they start poking around.

"Show me the man and I'll show you the crime" mentality.

I'm quite sure that airport exec never dreamed his activity had drawn official attention and had no clue whatsoever he was even under investigation. It's likely he never even reached that realization before his lights went out. Standing at the pearly gates asking "WTAF was THAT all about!!" (???)

From listening to a (annoying and idiotic) close to home source who is employed under a 3 letter agency, they're on here. And tacswap. And armslist. And FOR sure calguns

 

[CamoDeafie]

From listening to a (annoying and idiotic) close to home source who is employed under a 3 letter agency, they're on here. And tacswap. And armslist. And FOR sure calguns

Lets simplify that. They are everywhere that has to do with 2A, guns.

 

[Gunbuggy]

Now while I do say some stuff on here that is a little off the cuff, I try to not make incriminating statements. I'm pretty hard on certain groups especially the ones that "identify" in weird ways and I've definitely had my fair share of hand-slappings from mods on this forum for speaking certain truths that are offensive to certain (weak minded) individuals BUT everything I've said on this forum I would gladly be able to defend it to a judge.

My advice is don't say anything on this forum (or anywhere on the internet) that could incriminate you because one day it might be used against you in a court of law.