6.5 or .308 for a mountain rifle

[PORSCHE928S4]

6.5X55 Swede, been killing everything since Jesus was a private, might not be the flashiest or newest, but it's well proven across the board!
A Nice light Ruger M-77 with 20" barrel and irons combined with your optic of choice in this caliber would be about perfect!
Others to consider, the 7X57 Mauser, or 7mm/08 are also damn near perfect, and the .308 Winchester, proven beyond all doubt!

I think my next rifle will be in the 6.5x55 Sweede sounds like a round that will get the job done and no one at camp will ask to borrow ammo so win win !

 

[bcp]

Aren't mountain rifles supposed to have skis?

 

[bcp]

Classic 6.5mm mountain rifle:

The Deadly Little 6.5×54 Mannlicher

Q. I own an old Mannlicher-Schoenauer carbine in 6.5x54 MS calibre that my father bought back in the early 1950s. I understand that this rifle and cartridge has an illustrious history with early African big game hunters. John 'Pondoro' Taylor commenting, 'The lightness and handiness of these...

sportingshooter.com.au

Bruce

 

[PORSCHE928S4]

Aren't mountain rifles supposed to have skis?

View attachment 1292502

You bet braaaaahhhhhhh!

 

[kmk1012]

My T-shirt: "I have Chemo-brain. What's your excuse?"

Hey, that's a very real thing! I take a maintenance dose of chemo every day for the last two plus years as well as a monster dose every 28 days. I certainly can tell a difference in my "mental sharpness" at times. It's a little harder to concentrate than it used to be. I'm confused about the original question(s) and am glad I'm not the only one, LOL

 

[PORSCHE928S4]

Hey, that's a very real thing! I take a maintenance dose of chemo every day for the last two plus years as well as a monster dose every 28 days. I certainly can tell a difference in my "mental sharpness" at times. It's a little harder to concentrate than it used to be. I'm confused about the original question(s) and am glad I'm not the only one, LOL

I hope all is well my friend and you are good to go ! All of you that have to go through with that it sucks ! I have nothing but good thoughts for all of you .

 

[kmk1012]

I hope all is well my friend and you are good to go !

Yes, doing quite well now. I was in pretty rough shape when originally diagnosed. I celebrated my 40th bday with a first dose of chemo. Now, after bone marrow transplant (stem cell) and much treatment, I'm in remission and leading a normal life. Thank you!

 

[kopcicle]

Because the question was 6.5 Creedmoor or .308 for a mountain rifle.
My answer was neither because I .308 out of reflex and at this point consider the 6.5 Creedmoor to be a caliber of the month club offering.

Just so happens I have a thing about the 35's. For me it just makes sense.
Then again, I Like to dip my French Fries in a chocolate shake.
The 35's aren't for everyone. I don't recommend them for everyone, but I'll suggest it to anyone that cares to listen.

As for the .277/6.8/.270 mention, I get it. Although my .270 is nowhere near retirement. I love what my .270 does. From 120gr to 160gr (round nose), cast to jacketed. It's just a sweet spot.

As for the 7mm/.284 I get it. I owned a 7 x 57 Mauser and loved it.

6.5 x 55 is not only the longest existing cartridge ammunition but is one of the first. Moving from the original round nose to a spire point was "inspired".
Swedish Ljungman M42B anyone? Mauser m/1896 anyone?
AI 6.5 x 55? Check those velocities against the 6.5 Creedmoor.

Again, the question was 6.5 or .308. I think it was the wrong question.
I just offered an alternative because I think differently than the herd.

 

[AK0perator47]

Because the question was 6.5 Creedmoor or .308 for a mountain rifle.
My answer was neither because I .308 out of reflex and at this point consider the 6.5 Creedmoor to be a caliber of the month club offering.

Just so happens I have a thing about the 35's. For me it just makes sense.
Then again, I Like to dip my French Fries in a chocolate shake.
The 35's aren't for everyone. I don't recommend them for everyone, but I'll suggest it to anyone that cares to listen.

As for the .277/6.8/.270 mention, I get it. Although my .270 is nowhere near retirement. I love what my .270 does. From 120gr to 160gr (round nose), cast to jacketed. It's just a sweet spot.

As for the 7mm/.284 I get it. I owned a 7 x 57 Mauser and loved it.

6.5 x 55 is not only the longest existing cartridge ammunition but is one of the first. Moving from the original round nose to a spire point was "inspired".
Swedish Ljungman M42B anyone? Mauser m/1896 anyone?
AI 6.5 x 55? Check those velocities against the 6.5 Creedmoor.

Again, the question was 6.5 or .308. I think it was the wrong question.
I just offered an alternative because I think differently than the herd.

Actually you blanket stated 6.5 in your original post

Once again TLDR warning so move along if you don't give two cold s**ts

.308 mostly, but that's what I have the most experience with.
6.5 kind of because of the 6.5 x 55
The .308 in the Remington 788 (both versions) as well as multiple battle rattles.
The 6.5 in too many rifles to detail properly but included a Md 70 and a Surplus Swede/Mauser.

Actually neither.

The 35's. This includes every 38 Spl , .357 Mag pistol bullet. This includes every loading of the 35 Remington. This includes everything .357-.358".

Now pick your rifle brass. I'd stay with the short action and expand LC .308. Better yet there is a fair argument to Improve the chamber although it's another step. Then again, .35 Remington is already there if not available in stores near you.

There's a bump in the road, however. There are some pistol bullets that will not stay in one piece at extended velocities with a 1:9 -1:10 twist. The first that comes to mind are the 125gr Silvertips. There are some heavies, 250gr plus, that also won't stabilize.

Why?

Bullet selection. My favorites were the 125gr, truncated cone, semi-jacketed, flat point at some predictable node over 2,200 to 2,400. Much faster and you detonate small game at short ranges.
Most any 158gr loaded down to reasonable cast boolit velocities. Same for 200gr Lyman.
Whatever that 225gr was that Nosler put on the Whelan.
Share rifle and pistol caliber. Add a .357 lever gun or 35 Remington (141) and a revolver and you're covered. At that point if you have something like the Remington 141 do you really need a reach out and touch little things far away bolt gun?
At this point .358 bullet selection just might be second only to .308 and possibly greater.
.35/.308 AR10. What a novel concept. You know it's been done. Think of all the rail space you'd have to clown it up! Or not and stay high speed low drag. Consider barrel weight/length carefully here. 16" is no better an answer than 24" so use your head and get the result you want.

Why not?

Because you asked 6.5 or .308.
Expanding .308 is not a one operation deal and should include an anneal step and results in a somewhat thinner neck.
Because you don't see the convenience in having the same rifle and pistol bullet diameters.
Because you have no interest in detonating pests at close range with pistol bullets traveling 1,000 ft/sec faster than they were designed for.
Because you don't agree with a rifle in a caliber that allows you to go between a 125 varmint round and 250gr bear poison in seconds.
Because you have no need to share rifle and pistol caliber.
Because you don't see the utility of having a 250gr soft point to distract a bear.
Yes, I said distract. I've had to convince a bear and myself that the bear was indeed dead. The trouble is the bear figured this out some time after I did. The bear never got within 30 yards, but he knew where I was and was headed in my direction. I don't think multiple 6.5's could have been a viable talking point. I'm not sure a .308 mono/solid would have been convincing. I am sure that of the 4 hits, two 250gr 35 round nose were placed well enough to be a convincing argument and the third ended it.

Sights

I'd use a LPVO and have. It's one of the many 4X prism scopes. Works well. ACOG, sure why not. I just don't see the need here for big tube big mag FFP clown scope. Only reason I'd use an optic now is my eyes. Up to the last few years I'd have been happy with micro click diopter irons.

So TLDR from some greybeard that likely knows nothing or something to think about. It's up to you I didn't force anyone to read it.

Note, I answered this for a friend last week, so it was on my mind. I left it on the 'hide and I'll get smoked for it for sure. I'll probably leave it on THR as well since I haven't posted there in a year or so. Thought I'd share.

So ANY 6.5 could have been inserted

 

[drstrangelove]

OP has gone down the rabbit hole. There are tracks but I'm not going in to have tea with the Hatter.

I own a 6.5PRC, 6.5CMx2, and a 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser. I've sold 3 of the 4 308's I've owned. Why? Because more recoil, lower BC, and poorer range.
Nuf said.

If you want something with more knockdown for elk, get a 7 or 300 mag, but mind you, 6.5 Swede is serious Moose medicine and has been for a longer time than any of you has been alive.

 

[Nosferatu]

I keep trying for some reason, but for the hunting I do, I still haven't found anything that can dethrone my Tikka T3x Superlight .30-06 with a 160gr Hammer Hunter @3000fps.

No it's not the ultra sexy 6.5 super wonder of the month, but it's made everything I've shot at dead.

 

[3MTA3]

One thing to keep in mind with the 6.5x55 is that factory ammo as well as reloading manuals feature loads that are safe for the older actions. If you have a modern rifle and reload you ca take the 6.5x55 to places that the short action 6.5's like the CM and 260 just can't go.

A second advantage is that since the cartridge is about halfway between a short and long action modern rifles use long actions for them. This gives plenty of room to adjust bullet seating to match that particular rifle without having to worry about clearing the magazine.

The last thing is that there is virtually no crap brass out there in 6.5x55 and Norma is abundant.

Now consider it in Ackley form and loaded to modern pressures...

 

[RVTECH]

I'm not ashamed to admit that I am confused.

Heck I only SKIMMED the OPs post and am confused as well.....

 

[P7M13]

The OP (the post, not the individual) comes across like syphilis afflicted recto-babble - no wonder some of you are konfuzed.

Have two mountain rifles, 260 Rem and 7mm/08. Both are a skosh over 7lbs with glass.
Both shoot lights-out with mono coppers.

Also have a 35 Rem and 300 Savage throwing 200gr and 150gr cast bullets respectively.
If I could, I'd add a Steyr Scout in 308 or Sako 85 Carbonlight in 260 Rem, 7/08 or 308.

Have 2x 6.5x55 AI, but they are not in configurations that are conducive as a mountain rifle. As far as comparing them to the CM, there simply is NONE - the AI stomps all over that kool-aid shyte.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

Once again TLDR warning so move along if you don't give two cold s**ts

.308 mostly, but that's what I have the most experience with.
6.5 kind of because of the 6.5 x 55
The .308 in the Remington 788 (both versions) as well as multiple battle rattles.
The 6.5 in too many rifles to detail properly but included a Md 70 and a Surplus Swede/Mauser.

Actually neither.

The 35's. This includes every 38 Spl , .357 Mag pistol bullet. This includes every loading of the 35 Remington. This includes everything .357-.358".

Now pick your rifle brass. I'd stay with the short action and expand LC .308. Better yet there is a fair argument to Improve the chamber although it's another step. Then again, .35 Remington is already there if not available in stores near you.

There's a bump in the road, however. There are some pistol bullets that will not stay in one piece at extended velocities with a 1:9 -1:10 twist. The first that comes to mind are the 125gr Silvertips. There are some heavies, 250gr plus, that also won't stabilize.

Why?

Bullet selection. My favorites were the 125gr, truncated cone, semi-jacketed, flat point at some predictable node over 2,200 to 2,400. Much faster and you detonate small game at short ranges.
Most any 158gr loaded down to reasonable cast boolit velocities. Same for 200gr Lyman.
Whatever that 225gr was that Nosler put on the Whelan.
Share rifle and pistol caliber. Add a .357 lever gun or 35 Remington (141) and a revolver and you're covered. At that point if you have something like the Remington 141 do you really need a reach out and touch little things far away bolt gun?
At this point .358 bullet selection just might be second only to .308 and possibly greater.
.35/.308 AR10. What a novel concept. You know it's been done. Think of all the rail space you'd have to clown it up! Or not and stay high speed low drag. Consider barrel weight/length carefully here. 16" is no better an answer than 24" so use your head and get the result you want.

Why not?

Because you asked 6.5 or .308.
Expanding .308 is not a one operation deal and should include an anneal step and results in a somewhat thinner neck.
Because you don't see the convenience in having the same rifle and pistol bullet diameters.
Because you have no interest in detonating pests at close range with pistol bullets traveling 1,000 ft/sec faster than they were designed for.
Because you don't agree with a rifle in a caliber that allows you to go between a 125 varmint round and 250gr bear poison in seconds.
Because you have no need to share rifle and pistol caliber.
Because you don't see the utility of having a 250gr soft point to distract a bear.
Yes, I said distract. I've had to convince a bear and myself that the bear was indeed dead. The trouble is the bear figured this out some time after I did. The bear never got within 30 yards, but he knew where I was and was headed in my direction. I don't think multiple 6.5's could have been a viable talking point. I'm not sure a .308 mono/solid would have been convincing. I am sure that of the 4 hits, two 250gr 35 round nose were placed well enough to be a convincing argument and the third ended it.

Sights

I'd use a LPVO and have. It's one of the many 4X prism scopes. Works well. ACOG, sure why not. I just don't see the need here for big tube big mag FFP clown scope. Only reason I'd use an optic now is my eyes. Up to the last few years I'd have been happy with micro click diopter irons.

So TLDR from some greybeard that likely knows nothing or something to think about. It's up to you I didn't force anyone to read it.

Note, I answered this for a friend last week, so it was on my mind. I left it on the 'hide and I'll get smoked for it for sure. I'll probably leave it on THR as well since I haven't posted there in a year or so. Thought I'd share.

Read the first part and no clue what you are talking/asking? about. Skimmed middle part and still don't understand.

 

[NOC]

When I think of a "mountain rifle" I think light weight. For years I debated the merits of different actions, calibers stocks and scopes for the purpose of hunting antlered game. My wife it turns out was listening more closely than I imagined. I ended up with one of the last full custom NULA rifles (they were purchased by Wilson and offer more limited chamberings). I am truly the most fortunate of men who married my college sweetheart who approves of my hobbies and is more conservative than am I (smarter too.)

My rifle is on the NULA short action in 6.5 x 55. Short action works because the magazine is 3". Rifle weighs 5 lbs w/o scope, 22" light taper barrel. Scope is a Leupold vx3 with the Boone and Crockett reticle my Dad bought before he passed. Weapon weighs 5 3/4 lbs unloaded. Forbes sighted it in for the 156 grain Lapua round. 1 in 8 twist. Shoots right at 1 inch for me. Sight in target from Forbes was .62 for three rounds but he's a better shot. Recoil not much more than a standard Remington 700 in 6.5 creedmore my nephew shoots. I think 6.5 Swede is a great choice and more available than a lot of folks might think, especially in Canada ( I want to try my hand at caribou some day.). I doubt I would take a shot longer than 300 with my set up, certainly not one of those cross canyon shots where it takes a good part of the day to get to your downed animal. I don't think I am up for a sheep hunt, besides I like to hunt something I will eat. This is something I won't be selling especially given how it was acquired.


The big pain for me in terms of getting this sort of rifle is the fact that I am a southpaw. If not I could have acquired a kimber for about half. (Ironically that ultra light Kimber is built on Melvin Forbes' earlier machinery from when he sold his prior firm to Colt.) Long rant, bottom line 6.5 Swede is a decent choice for a mountain rifle along with some of the other choices mentioned.

 

[Kruel J]

Yes, doing quite well now. I was in pretty rough shape when originally diagnosed. I celebrated my 40th bday with a first dose of chemo. Now, after bone marrow transplant (stem cell) and much treatment, I'm in remission and leading a normal life. Thank you!

Wow, that's so good that you are in remission. I had no idea you went through all that, brother.