What went wrong here...

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So any and all theories on what may have happened here would be appreciated.

I've had this M&P Shield for a few years now. I have maybe put 500 rounds through it. I bought it used and the previous owner did have a trigger job done to it. On this day, I had put 59 rounds through the gun more or less just fine. On the 60th round I was very glad to still have my fingers in functioning order to type this post. I say more or less just fine, because this is the first time I've used this ammo. I was also using another pistol and carbine with the same ammo this same day. I noticed when loading the mags that my hands were getting very black and had golden flecks on them. Once when firing the 92FS I noticed a golden dust being ejected when firing.

I know I missed with that 59th round, so I'm reasonably certain that the bullet did leave the barrel. My current theory is that the primer was not the right load. Any idea what I do next? Any better theories as to what may have happened here?

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DLS

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First of all I'm glad you aren't injured! These are the reasons we wear eye pro!

Are you sure the barrel is clear of obstructions? If so am I seeing the case stuck in the chamber with a large hole blown out the rear?

If so that is a situation where the pressure spike was so fast and so over limits that it pinned the case against the chamber walls and blew out the bottom of the primer pocket.

You say the mags have soot and golden flecks on them as you are loading? What do the other fired cases look like. I'll bet more than one have the primer blown out and the flash hole enlarged causing the brass flecks to appear on the magazine.
 

ilikegunspdx

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Prob will need better photos and I would research this ammo brand. Reminds me a lot of a member here who had an ammo-based failure of an hk usp (not the same ammo brand). Perhaps looking at the other spent cases would tell something as well? 7BEDD2D8-6A3C-40C4-92A0-B15A0B3A0958.jpeg
 

Reno

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Glad you were not hurt!

1 of two things likely took place.

Way overcharged. By a lot.

Or

Squib followed by bang/boom, but you said you missed with the round prior, meaning it ejected the case. In my experience, squibs and undercharged don’t eject the case.

Did you have to manually extract round 59?
 

gmerkt

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My current theory is that the primer was not the right load
I don't think some issue with the primer would cause this destruction.

My opinion, more likely a double charge. Which would be possible in 9mm if relatively small volume powder of a flattened ball type were used.

The moss on the rear sight in picture #1 is noted.

"American Quality Ammunition" is apparently the brand name. There are comments here and there about it online. Cheaper than Dirt sells it. Some comments that this is probably reloaded ammo. Some of their .223 is loaded in LC cartridge cases. Some mention of very dirty burning powder in their .223.

I read the same comment on another web site that was posted in #6, above. That part about, that you can't find any contact info for the maker of this ammo. That isn't encouraging. You'd think that any legitimate firm would put an address on the box.

It's funny that on Cheaper than Dirt's website, there are zero reviews left for it.

grimmy999, if you bought this from Cheaper than Dirt, in my opinion, you should call them and see what they are willing to do about it. If you get the run-around from a customer service type, then you need to go to the legal department. Don't shoot any more of the ammo. Oh, and be sure to leave a review.
 
Save the box the ammo came in and get the lot number off of it. Take a picture of it. Could be a hot load at the factory. I would contact the ammo maker immediately with pictures of the pistol, the lot number and if you took a pic of the gold flecks on your hands/pistol. Don't get blown off, they will probably be very attentive tho. Document everything including any witnesses, time and date.

And if you have any marks on your hands take of picture of that also.


I have used American Quality Ammo before and have had no issues with it. I think it is a QC issue with the lot number
 
OP
grimmy999
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From the muzzle - what's it look like? Can you see (or feel) an obstruction (duh) but how far down?
You say you missed (your target?) with shot 59... And this was shot 60... are you sure 59 left the barrel?
I'm rather sure 59 left the muzzle and missed my target, but can't be 100% sure as shock has kind of jacked my memory a little. Muzzle is clear now. I was able to push a rod from all the way down the barrel and into the breach so i new the round was spend that's stuck in it.
 
OP
grimmy999
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I don't think some issue with the primer would cause this destruction.

My opinion, more likely a double charge. Which would be possible in 9mm if relatively small volume powder of a flattened ball type were used.

The moss on the rear sight in picture #1 is noted.

"American Quality Ammunition" is apparently the brand name. There are comments here and there about it online. Cheaper than Dirt sells it. Some comments that this is probably reloaded ammo. Some of their .223 is loaded in LC cartridge cases. Some mention of very dirty burning powder in their .223.

I read the same comment on another web site that was posted in #6, above. That part about, that you can't find any contact info for the maker of this ammo. That isn't encouraging. You'd think that any legitimate firm would put an address on the box.

It's funny that on Cheaper than Dirt's website, there are zero reviews left for it.

grimmy999, if you bought this from Cheaper than Dirt, in my opinion, you should call them and see what they are willing to do about it. If you get the run-around from a customer service type, then you need to go to the legal department. Don't shoot any more of the ammo. Oh, and be sure to leave a review.
I did get it from Cheaper than Dirt, and honestly, it really wasn't cheaper than dirt :( I sent them a message and we'll see what the next steps are. The moss is from the firearm deciding on it's own to jump out of my hand after the failure. I didn't throw it or anything... it just hit the dirt. Honestly, I had no feeling in my trigger finger at all and thought I lost the digit. I was extremely shocked to see the lack of blood. Some burning and a blood blister from getting pinched. Nothing to my face either.
 

gmerkt

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I did get it from Cheaper than Dirt, and honestly, it really wasn't cheaper than dirt :( I sent them a message and we'll see what the next steps are. The moss is from the firearm deciding on it's own to jump out of my hand after the failure. I didn't throw it or anything... it just hit the dirt. Honestly, I had no feeling in my trigger finger at all and thought I lost the digit. I was extremely shocked to see the lack of blood. Some burning and a blood blister from getting pinched. Nothing to my face either.
I was joking about the moss on the rear sight.

You don't have any science to pinpoint cause of failure. One thing you can do is send the pistol back to Smith & Wesson and have them do the forensic examination to determine cause. In the case of such catastrophic failure, I don't imagine that they charge a fee. Depending on the results of that, you may be able to go after Cheaper than Dirt and possibly the manufacturer of the ammo for reimbursement.

If you call Smith & Wesson customer service, they might furnish a pre-paid shipping label for return. Considering the nature of the problem.
 
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My guess is if its not a squib its overcharged ammo, was the ammo reloads or new?

So what to do with a gun like that now? If warranty doesn't replace it is it legal to just throw a gun away these days?
 
I'm thinking double charge on an already hot load.
Those brass specks previously found would be a good clue of this, especially if previously fired cases had primers smashed flat.

Glad you're able to tell about this. It could have been much worse.

I second the idea of contacting both S&W and Cheaper than Dirt. You might want to get the ammo manufacturer in on it, too.
 
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Squib, Live round and boom...
A lot of commercial re-loaders use the Dillons and remove the powder check buzzer because it's annoying as fock....
And this is what happens.

At least you don't have to go for a car ride and do the old eye for and eye thing with finger's.
But it could be fun to show up at the MFG of the ammo and beat azz with the left over gun ??
 
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# nwf.jpg

With my USP(.45ACP), it was locked in battery & stayed that way. Completely locked. You can see where the case blew out, right where it wasn't supported. I won't disclose the name of the company, because 1) They were very professional every step of the way(also replaced my gun) & 2) I'm of the impression that these things could happen to almost any ammo manufacturers.

I also contacted Heckler & Koch, they blamed the ammo manufacturer immediately. Most people I showed it to leaned towards ammo issue, but there were couple who weren't 100%. Ammo company had me return the entire batch back to them(few boxes), especially interested in the very box the particular ammo came in. They tested it, said couldn't find anything wrong with it, but would send me another USP.

Glad your hands are okay(mine were, too). I was seriously scared to shoot again there for while.
I've seen them blow out and not bulge, so not always.
Just depends on how far down it was.
Interesting. Did not know that.
 

po18guy

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Had a case head blow out on an HK91 decades ago. Blew the magazine floorplate, spring and follower plus a few rounds into my leg (sore but no blood). Bulged the sides of the receiver. Still have the mag, but the guys who sold me the ammo paid for the 91. That was a looooong time ago.

EDIT: Found the pics. HK uses both steel and aluminum mags. Very lucky that this was an alloy mag.

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IMG_2561.JPG
 
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