Washington WA/ID sales FTF

[Tinman357]

Can a Washington resident do a face to face sale to an Idaho resident while in ID?

I dug into it but didn't find a solid answer.

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[drstrangelove]

If the Idaho resident is receiving the gun, have to follow ID and federal rules. If no BRC required in ID for FTF purchase, next you need to understand Federal law prohibits interstate private transfer of handguns without FFL 4473 in the recipients state. WA prohibits assault weapon transfer to WA resident… but no problem for WA selling out of state. FTF shotgun or bolt/lever rifle… no problem in ID either way.

I'm no attorney, but that's my understanding.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

If the Idaho resident is receiving the gun, have to follow ID and federal rules. If no BRC required in ID for FTF purchase, next you need to understand Federal law prohibits interstate private transfer of handguns without FFL 4473 in the recipients state. WA prohibits assault weapon transfer to WA resident… but no problem for WA selling out of state. FTF shotgun or bolt/lever rifle… no problem in ID either way.

I'm no attorney, but that's my understanding.

Agree. However, for some perspective, I think the requirement to complete a 4473 started in 1968. Since 1968 to 2014 or whatever, how many guns were sold face to face with no 4473 form? Many millions I would guess. Note that 4473 does not transfer interest. It is only a background check and for ATF record keeping. Guns are not titled property like a car or house. I'm speaking of title 1 guns here, not NFA guns.

 

[Richo877]

Really, we all live in Idaho when you think about it...

 

[Tinman357]

Yes, I know about the transfer between WA residents. Good info on interstate transfer, thats where I'm getting hung up. FTF is legal in ID, but the interstate thing throws shade on that. Maybe a call to a FFL in ID is in order.

The underlying issue is that I need to condense my collection to the basic minimum. Most of what I want to sell/give away can't be transferred in WA state.

Thank you.

 

[Richo877]

Yes, I know about the transfer between WA residents. Good info on interstate transfer, thats where I'm getting hung up. FTF is legal in ID, but the interstate thing throws shade on that. Maybe a call to a FFL in ID is in order.

The underlying issue is that I need to condense my collection to the basic minimum. Most of what I want to sell can't be transferred in WA state.

Thank you.

Hopefully you can give a bona fide gift to an immediate family member that's moving to Idaho soon.

 

[gmerkt]

4473 or no, federal law prohibits transfer of a handgun under the circumstances described. We've discussed this on another thread. If you want to do this, you'd need to run it through an FFL dealer while in Idaho to the Idaho resident to stay legal.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

I don't see anything about being required to go through an ffl in Idaho.

 

[bpyycpyy]

As a few has mentioned above, any sales of firearms between different state residents are federally required to be transferred via a licensed FFL in the purchasers state of residence even if the state itself allows FTF sales (if the state allows FTF sales, these FTF sales are only federally allowed between that same states residents).

Lifted from the interwebs (https://rocketffl.com/firearm-transfers/):

"Since the Gun Control Act of 1968 (GCA), firearms that travel interstate (across state lines) must be transferred using a Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL). This is true even if the purchaser has a handgun or firearm permit. This means that firearm transactions (gift, loan, sale, etc.) that happen within the same state don't require an FFL."

 

[Alexx1401]

You have to ask a couple of things. Are the guns you wish to sell papered to you? As in if they trace them back are they going to end up on your step? If so are they hand guns? If so Fed law says you can't take them across state lines to sell like that. Now if you do anyway chances are no one will know or care but, if buyer later sells them or they somehow end up at some crime, Police may show up on your step to ask where the gun you bought is. At that point what are you going to say? The "risk" here is not high but how much risk vs making a little more money do you really want to take? If it was me? I would run the sale through an FFL for just this reason. I have no doubt a LOT of people still sell face to face all the time. I would not.

 

[Tinman357]

ALEXX. never said I wanted to do anything illegal . As a point of fact, my entire post was to ensure that I am completely legit and well wirhin the law.

But thank you for your input.

 

[Alexx1401]

ALEXX. never said I wanted to do anything illegal . As a point of fact, my entire post was to ensure that I am completely legit and well wirhin the law.

But thank you for your input.

You may find this hard to get your head around here but "you" are FAR from being the only person reading this. These are called threads. A LOT of people read them. They also last for a LONG time on the site. So a LOT of people will read this. A LOT of people will no doubt have the same questions. I missed the part where I suggested you were wanting to do something not above the law. A LOT of people will proudly tell anyone who will listen that they do, handle sales this way though. So when this is brought up over and over again, as you just did, many will lay out the warning yet again for those who may be reading them. A LOT of people read this site who are not even members so can't post here. Again this is the net, you are far from the only one reading it.

 

[Member 86767]

An FFL in WA can buy or consign your (illegal in WA) firearms and sell them out of state. We do it all of the time. We also sell (illegal in WA) firearms to Idaho and put them on gunbroker, but we run them through an Idaho (or other) FFL.

 

[Alexx1401]

An FFL in WA can buy or consign your (illegal in WA) firearms and sell them out of state. We do it all of the time. We also sell (illegal in WA) firearms to Idaho and put them on gunbroker, but we run them through an Idaho (or other) FFL.

This is the "best way" to do this for those who have things they don't want anymore. As soon as the net came along these kind of questions started to happen over and over on sites like this. I have LONG warned people the net is a VERY poor place to seek legal advice since anyone can say anything. This question or some version of it is asked thousands of times. Answers are now EASY to find on Gov sites. Often someone asking knows the answer, they don't like the law, so they seek someone to tell them what they want to hear.
That's all great until someone gets in a jam. I have long warned people if you end up in front of a black robe they are not going to care what someone on the net told you.

 

[Member 86767]

As a private citizen I could also sell an (illegal in WA) firearm to someone in a state where it was legal, but only through an FFL in that state. I would just give the FFL my drivers license and they would enter it into their book under my name, and when the FFL transferred it to the other person, they would have their records with a 4473.

 

[arakboss]

As a few has mentioned above, any sales of firearms between different state residents are federally required to be transferred via a licensed FFL in the purchasers state of residence even if the state itself allows FTF sales (if the state allows FTF sales, these FTF sales are only federally allowed between that same states residents).

Lifted from the interwebs (https://rocketffl.com/firearm-transfers/):

"Since the Gun Control Act of 1968 (GCA), firearms that travel interstate (across state lines) must be transferred using a Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL). This is true even if the purchaser has a handgun or firearm permit. This means that firearm transactions (gift, loan, sale, etc.) that happen within the same state don't require an FFL."

This is the correct answer.

 

[Alexx1401]

As a private citizen I could also sell an (illegal in WA) firearm to someone in a state where it was legal, but only through an FFL in that state. I would just give the FFL my drivers license and they would enter it into their book under my name, and when the FFL transferred it to the other person, they would have their records with a 4473.

Yep selling ANY guns these days its "wise" to use an FFL if the gun is papered to you. Chances are slim the gun is going to end up at some crime but not zero. If it does and LEO show up on your door asking how your gun ended up at xyz crime it could be "uncomfortable" or worse. Guns have been so demonized by the left and its really sad how successful they have been with this.
This again is why I have for decades warned people about taking legal advice about them off the net. Most of the time its people who have at least a real good idea what the laws say. They just want someone to tell them what they want to hear to make it easier for them. Chances are those who do stuff they should not will never hear any more later but, now and then one gets in a jam. Then of course they scream it was not their fault.

 

[Alexx1401]

This is the correct answer.

Again this kind of thing can be risky.

"Since the Gun Control Act of 1968 (GCA), firearms that travel interstate (across state lines) must be transferred using a Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL). This is true even if the purchaser has a handgun or firearm permit. This means that firearm transactions (gift, loan, sale, etc.) that happen within the same state don't require an FFL."
While this is the way it works for Fed law, many reading this "may" think, great just what I wanted to hear and sell a gun to someone in this state without going through an FFL. After all they read on the net they were fine. Problem of course is that they were NOT fine and they just violated the law.

 

[arakboss]

Again this kind of thing can be risky.

"Since the Gun Control Act of 1968 (GCA), firearms that travel interstate (across state lines) must be transferred using a Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL). This is true even if the purchaser has a handgun or firearm permit. This means that firearm transactions (gift, loan, sale, etc.) that happen within the same state don't require an FFL."
While this is the way it works for Fed law, many reading this "may" think, great just what I wanted to hear and sell a gun to someone in this state without going through an FFL. After all they read on the net they were fine. Problem of course is that they were NOT fine and they just violated the law.

What's risky? If a WA resident wants to sell a firearm to an ID resident, they should take it to an ID FFL and do the transfer there. That is the legal way to do it and shouldn't be risky.

 

[Alexx1401]

What's risky? If a WA resident wants to sell a firearm to an ID resident, they should take it to an ID FFL and do the transfer there. That is the legal way to do it and shouldn't be risky.

Do you even read the stuff you post?
you posted this :This means that firearm transactions (gift, loan, sale, etc.) that happen within the same state don't require an FFL.":