Survival: So Simple it's Profound

[11Charlie]

This is the moral delimma we face...

Lets say youve prepped, your house survived.... 3 or more weeks go by and others have run out of food, shelter heat, medicine. They are starving, some are dead....

And here you are with a workable home, healthy and obviously fine. The longer this goes on, the more you and your home stands out as the place to go for help...... But do you?


Keep in mind that other than not prepping, these are otherwise good people. His wife is dead or dying, his 3yr old is dead or dying, hes either coming to you to beg for help, or rob you. How much longer can your preps last till infrastructure is restored? What would you do?

Pretty bleak picture actually...

It is a tough decision!! No way around it. You want to lean towards your human side and help especially the women and kids. But then your putting your family at risk. This is why my neighbors and I have scheduled a sit down to discuss these things. Like minded people are stronger as a group than individual. When it comes down to it you may be able to help some but helping everyone could be the death of you.

 

[MaxwellEdison]

So here's the ultimate SHTF transportation solution for those who have a truck/SUV and $10K to burn:



A powered paraglider can easily fit in a SUV or truck. Heck, they can fit into a Subaru. Take it out, set it up (takes about 15 minutes if you know what you're doing), and if the weather cooperates and you can find at least 100 feet of "runway", you can travel up to about 80 miles (or more if the wind cooperates) in whichever direction you choose. Damaged bridges and roads aren't a factor.

While unrealistic for most of us, it's not at all impossible. In fact, I know a guy in Sacramento who has one of these (different brand than the link above) in his SUV at all times. Not for emergency purposes, but simply because he flies a lot whenever he can. If you have the money and inclination, it's a possibility. You can get everything you need, including training, for under $10,000.

I've thought about these for a couple years now, simply for recreation. There's a group of powered paraglider pilots out towards Sandy, Oregon, and another group on the Oregon Coast around Newport. Especially during summer you can see these guys flying all the time. Looks fun!

 

[mjbskwim]

Well if the quake does effect 900 miles of the fault,I would ASSume it would become a world event. Might be some tsunamis after that. Japan's future could look bleak. A lot of great points in this thread,but I'd have to say car swapping ain't that good. Unless you are telling the other party they will be stealing your car,you can still be liable if something happens.
Or are you going to record the trade like they will?
I tell ya it's a bad scenario any way you look at it. Like the thread about surviving at home and talking about subfreezing temps. If it's raining out and maybe 40 or below,you have just as much chance at hypothermia. You go into a river and get soaked,if you make it out you'd better get dry fast.
Help and medical will just be a helicopter ride away also. They won't bring much to you,but to get you to a shelter.
It will be stuffed with people trying to transverse broken concrete and it shifting onto their legs.
Unless you have Safeway sized stores at your home,you will run out of food. Hopefully Red Cross will bring in supplies.
Heck I should make sure I get more stores here incase they divert stuff from us
And as far as a carry gun,maybe think like the masaad did. Use 10/22s with a can. That way you can take care or bad guys and knowone will suspect anything of you.

 

[WaGuy52]

Um.... I drive a Prius, which by the way gets 500 miles on an 8 gallon tank, (that's when my Ford king ranch 350 4x4 superduty power-stroke diesel quad cab long box is parked -that's not a joke), I'm packing too and most importantly; I'm nobody's conscript. Between my 6', 250# and/or glock, any so-sayer can KMA.

OK, keep it reality based:

1. I'm ALWAYS armed.

2. There's ALWAYS a gaggle of "Richard Craniums" (within arms reach) sitting in those "Honda cars" with the big #10 tin can screwed onto the tail-pipe playing Ricky-Bobbie @ Taledega, or Speed Racer on the Interstates.

3. Round up and conscript a ready-made work crew from said "Honda cars" to hand-move collapsed overpass debris to clear enough for a lane (@ gun-point if needed).

 

[MaxwellEdison]

And on a more probable note, I work 4 miles from my house. I'd say 95% of the time I'm within 6 or 7 miles of my house. I would simply attempt to walk home. Might be a long walk, but I wouldn't have too many barriers to navigate. Once home I would make due with whatever is left of my house. I do have food and water supplies for my wife and I, and our pets, for about 60-90 days. The biggest challenge would probably be personal security after the 2nd or 3rd day.

Someone once wisely said, "Polite, civilized society is only about 9 missed meals away from total collapse", and it's probably somewhat true. When people get hungry because they haven't eaten in days, they'll do things they wouldn't ever dream of doing during normal times. So personal security is a very important consideration.

If things were REALLY bad, I'd probably try to get my way back East as soon as possible. I have friends and relatives up and down the East Coast. I'm sure a few of them would let me and my wife stay there for a few months while we got back on our feet. I have enough long-term savings to get by for a few years if it comes to that. One thing to remember, a major event like this wouldn't just effect the local economy. In the short term it would likely be pretty disastrous on the entire economy. LOTS of products come into this country via PNW ports. Then again, the government would likely have to spend close to a trillion dollars to put everything back together, and that itself would provide economic stimulus. Think WWII. It was horrific in many ways, but ultimately great for the economy. Keynesianism isn't good economic policy for 'normal' times, but it's quite effective during bad times.

 

[Jnarowe]

how would you know? Plenty of left wingers own guns too... and plenty more suddenly turn pro gun when it suits them. I understand your sentiment and frustration with gun control but when SHTF politics are best set aside. Chances are if your the one on the other side of town trying to get home, your the one thats going to need help along the way...

Yes, they do. And during the Rodney King riots, my Leftist friends and relatives were quite dismayed they couldn't go buy a gun on the spot. Some of them wanted to bunk at my place. No skirt, no deal. You voted for that BS, now live with it. So perhaps I keep some politics in mind even in an emergent situation.

 

[MrMillspecer]

We live up in elevation over 900 ft. The flooding would seem catastrophic in itself. Does anyone have any idea of what water heights might reach around Portland. ? All those coastal towns and along the rivers would be devastated. Dam.

 

[albin25]

House is ...gone! business is...gone! etc.....
Where is the secondary (and even more) rallying points for you, your wife and kids?
Have you made arraignments with friends, neighbors or relatives to pick up kids at school? Will the school even release them to a guardian's custody? Can your wife get to the school? Are the kids going to meet you at home? Wife or you going to the school first? Your phones probably won't work...so you'll all need to follow a preplanned rallying plan without depending on any communications. Many people can no longer function without a functioning cellphone to make an on-the-fly decision these days.
Are your preps going to be buried in the rubble of your house? Is there somewhere on your side of the river(s) that you can get to. Do your family members know where you'll hole-up if that's the case? How long should they wait for you before they will move to safer location without you or each other? Remember...no phone. Have places to leave a message on a tree or pole advising "gone to the Johnsons" or "at the shelter" been discussed?
Is your family prepared to spend days or even weeks without you (or you without them)?

Preps are more than just bug out bags, guns, food and water.

 

[Caveman Jim]

I wonder about this, will most peoples instinct be to help out at first, or will it just instantly break down to looting and chaos? I would think at first most everyone will be desperately wanting to secure themselves and their loved ones. Then later when those that don't prep run out of supplies the chaos begins...

In big cities I can guarantee you that it will turn into chaos right off the bat, especially in downtown areas like Portland in Seattle. I shudder to think that good people get trapped in those s*** holes.
The greatest task for anyone trying to get home from the "city" is to figure out just who you come into contact with & to whom one should trust.....

Good luck out there people.

 

[WaGuy52]

If it's a "big one", down town Seattle will be gone. The "ground" (aka gumbo) it's built on will liquefy with the energy release of that magnitude.
Having been in some EOC meetings, studies not released to the public predict casualties even in the fortified EOC locations.
And yes, what's left will be chaos.

In big cities I can guarantee you that it will turn into chaos right off the bat, especially in downtown areas like Portland in Seattle. I shudder to think that good people get trapped in those s*** holes.
The greatest task for anyone trying to get home from the "city" is to figure out just who you come into contacy with & whom to trust.....

Good luck out there people.

 

[Jnarowe]

Add to that a hand-held ham radio that's preprogrammed with a bunch of local repeaters, at least some of which are likely to be working or fixed quickly in a disaster, and your communication prospects are likely better than just FRS (relatively short range and line of site) or cell phones (even if working, likely clogged up and overloaded). You can pick up an inexpensive BaoFeng for $25-40 on Amazon, and I'd be happy to help people with picking some good repeaters to program, along with info on how to program the radios (if you want to program yourself the easy way at home, then it's about another $10-15 for the USB programming cable).

I'd like to learn more about this.

 

[jbett98]

Don't forget the aftershocks.

 

[mjbskwim]

I'd like to learn more about this.

HAM Radio Starter Kit - Information for Beginners
Don't ask me for more info I just supplied the linky
I don't know shnit about it

 

[Libertas7]

Don't forget the aftershocks.

I actually did until someone said something about it earlier in the thread.

 

[Stomper]

Um.... I drive a Prius, which by the way gets 500 miles on an 8 gallon tank, (that's when my Ford king ranch 350 4x4 superduty power-stroke diesel quad cab long box is parked -that's not a joke), I'm packing too and most importantly; I'm nobody's conscript. Between my 6', 250# and/or glock, any so-sayer can KMA.

Take it easy there, mongo. I said "young Richard craniums in them Honda cars with the stupid 4" "cans" bolted on he tail-pipe (pseudo race-cars).... you don't fit the demographic I mentioned, so stop trying to pound your square head into the round hole of my scenario.

 

[MaxwellEdison]

A post above reminded me...here's another vital part of my SHTF kit:

An Anker "PowerPort" solar charger. While cell towers might be dead immediately after a big event, they'll also be one of the first pieces of infrastructure restored. I read that during a large-scale catastrophe, the telecom companies can now get replacement portable towers set-up in just a matter of days. They're called Cells on Wheels (COWs) and Cells on Light Trucks (COLTs), and they can either be driven in or flown in by helicopter. It's been a priority project for them since Hurricane Sandy because obviously, in terms of peoples' needs, communications will be right behind food/water, shelter and security.

But many people will have phones, and no juice to make them work. This solar charger can recharge two iPhones at the same time, and it works really well. I bought one last summer and tested it. In full sun I went from about a 50% charge to 95% charge in just a few hours; pretty impressive for a solar charger. It works in cloudy weather too, although it takes about twice as long to produce the needed power.

When you think about it, smartphones could help you manage a LOT of stuff in an emergency...assuming they work. Can't control how long it takes for service to be restored, but you can control whether or not you'll have power to use that service when it is restored.

 

[Koda]

your gps will still work without service. If you have an app like backcountry navigator you have a full blown mapset and navigation functionality. Must pre-download the mapset for off line use...

 

[Ura-Ki]

Every one you see is going to be scared sh!tless, Same as you and I. This works to an advantage, and a lot of the time, a person that takes charge can direct folks to help, be it walking toward home, rescuing others, providing aid, working on shelter and many other things! Be the one to take charge and you have some margin of safety around you! Gather those around you that would be heading the same direction you want to go, and you have a "team" that can help you while helping them!

 

[Ura-Ki]

your gps will still work without service. If you have an app like backcountry navigator you have a full blown mapset and navigation functionality. Must pre-download the mapset for off line use...

Question? Will it show 'AFTER The Event" or will it only show the pre existing maps?

 

[Koda]

Question? Will it show 'AFTER The Event" or will it only show the pre existing maps?

yes, but it will only show the mapsets (called "tiles") that you download to the phone before the network goes down. You can download as many types of maps as you want, for free (google street, USGS topo maps, satelliete, etc.) as much as your phone will store. Once the map tiles are downloaded, they are in your phone off line.