rattlesnakes in the juniper

[dangerranger60]

I live in snake central [Central CA].
Every year I see and hear of people getting bit. almost to the person they were playing with it or stepped on it.
The worst I have seen was a 10 year old kid who was playing paintball with his friends. He was bit mid calf by a big rattler. From that point on he did almost everything wrong!
He took off running for home, on a 105 degree day. By the time his friends caught up with him he had pumped the poison all through his body. They were playing in a place they were not supposed to be so they did not want to admit where they were, So they walked there friend a couple miles home. By the time they called for help their friend was in bad shape.
He spent a couple months in the hospital, and Dr's cut away 50% of his leg. That has been years ago and his leg still looks mangled.
I have also seen a lot of dogs, horses, and cattle that have been bit. usually they survive, but loose some skin to necrosis. Our vet said to give them a high dose of Benadryl, and keep them still and as cool as possible.
For some reason horses almost always get bit on the face or nose! It leaves them with nasty scars.
I have never been bit or even close. About the closest I have come, I was moving hay bales, and as I picked one up two big ones shot between my legs! I was so surprised they were gone before I was sure what happened.

My own avoidance has me never putting my feet or hands where I cant clearly see.
carry a walking stick and probe the grass ahead of you
Wear tall boots, and wear gloves.
And if your dogs start acting stupid don't run over there, but call your dogs away. DR

 

[Caveman Jim]

I have been around quite a few in the Deschutes Canyon over the years when fishing.
Make plenty of noise when you're in "snakey areas".
Don't step or reach into areas that you can't see completely.

And listen for that rattle.
They don't all sound the same.
I had a big one make a rattle that sounded like the gas escaping a propane tank.
A loud hiss.

Don't let "Fear of the Serpent" get in your head or you won't be able to enjoy the East Side.
Be aware, not scared.

Caveman fooked…

 

[Flymph]

I had one swim around my ankle last year, full wrap around... it really worried the rafters when I screamed "FUDGE! THEY REALLY DO SWIM!"
Not that it was the only or first time I'd seen a rattlesnake swim on the deschutes.
They much prefer to sneak around ya on the john day, don't ask me why, but they always pop up from behind.

 

[Certaindeaf]

There's a lot of confusion, even amongst "authorities" (including ODFW) about rattlesnakes in Oregon, and what species or subspecies they are.
The species is the Western Rattlesnake. In Oregon this species is divided into two subspecies: the North Pacific Rattlesnake and the Great Basin Rattlesnake.
If you believe they are restricted to the east side of the state, Lake Oswego High School administrators may take issue. (A den was located there in the very recent past).

I have enjoyed the rare privilege of keeping a rattler in captivity far beyond what is noted for longevity, wild or captive (27 years: I understand the current record may be 32 years). A Western Rattler from the Baker City area (referred to there as Prairie Rattlers), he was captured sunning on a concrete back porch. No longer or larger than a Bic pen with one button on the rattler end, a newborn.

There are NO absolutes with wild animals, but I can relate some "rules" that were conveyed to me by Bocephus over the course of caring for hiim:

Under normal conditions, a rattler will NOT strike at anything it cannot eat or is not perceived as an immediate threat. (It is the second category that we as humans need to avoid, and the snake may take a different view of what constitutes a threat.)

This "rule" makes perfect sense, as striking at anything moving would deplete the venom reserves away from what is necessary for survival. Rattlers like to lay in wait near trails: If they struck at everything that walked by (deer, cows, coyotes, etc.,etc., etc.) they'd have no juice for the fat vole that came by later.

A Rattler will not eat anything it has not killed itself, and it must be a warm-blooded creature. A dead mouse tossed in the aquarium receives no more attention than a rock. If the snake is not hungry, a live mouse may coexist literally side by side with the snake until the snake's tummy rumbles.

The idea here, is to convey that Rattlers do NOT indiscriminately strike instantly at anything and everything. Baby snakes lack the ability to "regulate dosage" from their venom sacks. They are therefore perceived to be more dangerous than an adult that can actually bite WITHOUT delivering venom.

As to killing them in the wild, stockmen would argue vehemently against "live and let live", since a cow or horse CAN be perceived as a threat by a rattler (being bumped or stepped on). Anyone who walks regularly with a dog (bird hunters, houndsmen, sheep herders) in snake country will (and should, if they expect to return to that area) kill everyone they see. A Rattler discovered in a yard where children play should be disposed of without hesitation. While snakebite from a Rattler is rarely fatal in humans, it is a VERY serious matter as I can relate first hand from an experience where a friend was bitten by a wild one. Limb loss is a real possibility.

So, go confidently and aware. Also be aware that Bull Snakes (the only effective ground predator of Rattlers: they are immune to the venom) have evolved a "mimic" behavior borrowed from their lunch:

A Bull Snake when threatened will coil, flatten his head (to look like the wide triangular head of a Rattler), hold up his tail and vibrate its naked soundless tip. With mouth open, they will emit a sound (hiss) that is REMARKABLY similar to a Rattlesnake. I wondered when reading @DirectDrive's account of a sound described as "gas escaping" whether he made a positive ID there.

My practice in the wild is to kill any Rattler. Bull Snakes are the species that receive my respect and deference toward their efforts at rodent (and Rattler) control.

That "den" of rattlers in LO was brought over in/with a load of steel pipe from Eastern Oregon.

 

[DirectDrive]

A Bull Snake when threatened will coil, flatten his head (to look like the wide triangular head of a Rattler), hold up his tail and vibrate its naked soundless tip. With mouth open, they will emit a sound (hiss) that is REMARKABLY similar to a Rattlesnake. I wondered when reading @DirectDrive's account of a sound described as "gas escaping" whether he made a positive ID there.

Yes, positive I.D.
I had hung a steelhead in a tree so we could fish downstream and then come back and pick up the steelhead.
When I went to collect my fish, this rattler in question had moved in to a point near the fish.
That's when he went off and we clearly saw him.

 

[DirectDrive]

I had one swim around my ankle last year, full wrap around... it really worried the rafters when I screamed "FUDGE! THEY REALLY DO SWIM!"
Not that it was the only or first time I'd seen a rattlesnake swim on the deschutes.
They much prefer to sneak around ya on the john day, don't ask me why, but they always pop up from behind.

We've tossed them in the river and they do swim very well.
I've never had one naturally swim up to me.

One time we had some n00bs come through while we were playing with a decent sized rattler.
We were at Washout Rapids.
They had been fishing in cut-offs and tennis shoes.
We said "Come on over guys and take a look at this."
"You wanna watch out for these things."
"And this one swam right past me."

I was fibbin' but it had a nice effect on those n00bs in cut-offs.

 

[Bon Sauvage]

I didn't think there were any snakes other than garden snakes on this side of the mountain, let alone in the coast range. WOW!

Pray that you don't run into a pair of sandpacker snakes. They always travel in pairs. The first one wraps itself around your legs and trips you. The second one packs sand up your bum until you are dead. They are especially hazardous to the very young and the elderly.

 

[DirectDrive]

Pray that you don't run into a pair of sandpacker snakes. They always travel in pairs. The first one wraps itself around your legs and trips you. The second one packs sand up your bum until you are dead. They are especially hazardous to the very young and the elderly.

Fun fact :
That's why the Mormons wear that tight, mid-thigh underwear.
Sandpackers can't get through it.

 

[Jason Brown]

Oregon rattler and Pronghorn steaks for dinner, yum.

If you do get bit your screwed, dont try the bite kits or sucking the poison out it will make it worse. Keep the wound above the heart and get to a hospital asap is all you can do.

View attachment 1195748

According to the DFW website you would want to keep the bite below your heart to slow the venom from reaching it. Gravity.

 

[bionic knees]

well then here we go, clear as mud again!!

 

[3putts]

I have never seen one in all the years I hunted the John Day area, My friend that used the be stationed in John Day with the Forest Service had encountered many, including a huge den of the critters when they opened the ground up. His description of what he saw gave me nightmares.

 

[teflon6string]

Last century in the service, I rode mountain bikes all over San Diego County 2-3 times a week, mostly in canyons. Pedaled past random rattlers probably once or twice a month - always good to get my heart hammering hard. Every stinking time!

Imagine 3 guys on bikes, seriously skidding down a steep hill with no way to stop or veer (unless you like crashing face first in rocks and sagebrush). Rider Number One screams "SNAKE!" Rider Two rolls right over a fat monster in the middle of the single-track trail. And Rider Three (that would be me) also skids right over it - coiled up and buzzing in the 2 seconds this all took to transpire. Glad no one fell there - it would've been at least 30 minutes to get anywhere that Lifeflight might access.

Got a wild hair for a couple months and hunted them with a buddy who liked to make wallets, hatbands, etc. We pinned a few down to behead them, and only one of those buzzed while I dispatched him. That was my prize, which we grilled and ate (imagine if a fish and a chicken had a baby with hundreds of tiny ribs). 12 buttons on the rattle.

So out of seeing probably 40-50 snakes over a few years (actually engaging only 5-6 with my experienced "mentor"), I've heard exactly two rattlers give a warning buzz, and only when they were being seriously riled up/killed. YMMV.

- Keep any snake-bit appendage below the heart and exert minimal cardio effort.
- Know where they like to hide, and keep your hands/feet out of places you can't plainly see.
- Understand that they can appear to be dead/asleep (even when pelted repeatedly with gravel), and suddenly move VERY quickly, most likely away from you.
- Back in Oregon for 25 years now, I've not seen any. But I haven't gone looking either - though I do see warning signs at trailheads.

 

[Deavis]

Outskirts of Ashland are polluted with them.

Madras has a fair number.

Seen a few in Klamath Country.

 

[teflon6string]

 

[eb in oregon]

According to the DFW website you would want to keep the bite below your heart to slow the venom from reaching it. Gravity.

Yea, and with your arm below the heart gravity will pump the venom and blood from your arm through the body faster. Same reason if you have a bad wound you keep the wound elevated above the heart, to slow down the blood flow. From OHSU's information site.

WHAT TO DO IF YOU ARE BITTEN BY A SNAKE:

Do not panic; keep still and calm.

Call the poison center immediately by dialing the national, free Poison Help number - 1 (800) 222- 1222. The experts at the poison center have been specially trained to treat snakebites. Every snakebite is different, and the poison center specialist will tell you what you need to do next, based on your specific situation. If you need immediate medical care, the poison center specialist can tell you where to go and call ahead to the right medical facility to make sure you get the care you need, quickly. If the person who was bitten is having trouble breathing or losing consciousness, call 911 immediately.

If you are in a remote location and do not have mobile phone service, ask someone to drive you to the nearest emergency medical facility. Only drive yourself as a last resort. Call Poison Help at 1 (800) 222-1222 as soon as you have telephone service.

Keep the part of your body that was bitten straight and at heart-level, unless told otherwise by the specialist at the poison center.

Remove all jewelry and tight clothing.

Wash the bite with soap and water and cover the bite with a clean, dry dressing, if available, and if doing so does not cause delay.

Being able to describe the snake to medical professionals can help them decide on the best treatment for you, so try to remember the color and shape of the snake, but don't move closer to it. Only take a photograph of the snake if you can do so from a safe distance.

You do not need to bring the snake with you in order to get the proper medical treatment!

Note the time the bite happened.

 

[Jason Brown]

Yea, and with your arm below the heart gravity will pump the venom and blood from your arm through the body faster. Same reason if you have a bad wound you keep the wound elevated above the heart, to slow down the blood flow. From OHSU's information site.

WHAT TO DO IF YOU ARE BITTEN BY A SNAKE:

Do not panic; keep still and calm.

Call the poison center immediately by dialing the national, free Poison Help number - 1 (800) 222- 1222. The experts at the poison center have been specially trained to treat snakebites. Every snakebite is different, and the poison center specialist will tell you what you need to do next, based on your specific situation. If you need immediate medical care, the poison center specialist can tell you where to go and call ahead to the right medical facility to make sure you get the care you need, quickly. If the person who was bitten is having trouble breathing or losing consciousness, call 911 immediately.

If you are in a remote location and do not have mobile phone service, ask someone to drive you to the nearest emergency medical facility. Only drive yourself as a last resort. Call Poison Help at 1 (800) 222-1222 as soon as you have telephone service.

Keep the part of your body that was bitten straight and at heart-level, unless told otherwise by the specialist at the poison center.

Remove all jewelry and tight clothing.

Wash the bite with soap and water and cover the bite with a clean, dry dressing, if available, and if doing so does not cause delay.

Being able to describe the snake to medical professionals can help them decide on the best treatment for you, so try to remember the color and shape of the snake, but don't move closer to it. Only take a photograph of the snake if you can do so from a safe distance.

You do not need to bring the snake with you in order to get the proper medical treatment!

Note the time the bite happened.

Well I'm no doctor, but pretty much every single one of the various sources I've read claim you should keep the bite at or below heart level. Must be a conspiracy huh?

 

[Spitpatch]

View attachment 1200320

As noted earlier: They like to wait secluded by trails. In this case...for lawnmowers.

 

[Member 38805]

I used to do a lot of chukar hunting on the breaks of the John Day, and Deschutes rivers. Both had plenty of rattlesnakes up in the hills. A great majority I saw were near shale or rocky outcroppings as the snakes like the warm rocks to get their temperatures up early morning, or towards sunset.
But I also saw a few rattlers sitting up inside the sagebrush, and that gets your attention when you hear a rattle, but don't see anything on the ground! Then you keep looking and realize the darn snake is a couple feet away and wait high in the brush!
I used to carry my .357 on my hip with birdshot capsule charges, and used it numerous times to dispatch snakes, so I wouldn't use up my shotshells I needed for the chukar.

 

[eb in oregon]

I asked my doctor yesterday about keeping the bite wound at heart level or lower versus holding the affected limb above the heart in regards to bleeding. She said that the reason you hold it at heart level or lower it so that it will bleed and hopefully flush out some of the venom. I hadn't considered that but it makes sense. She also talked about cutting the wound a bit so it would bleed more but didn't recommend that. I've spent a lot of time in years past in Rattlesnake country hunting, hiking, biking, and during military training and I've seen but three rattlers. You leave them alone and they'll leave you alone in my opinion.