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If its a pistol that was turned into an SBR all the owners has to do is take the stock off for interstate travel.
Maybe, sorta... but missing a critical factor to be true.

From the alphabets FAQ:

Q: If I remove the short barrel or stock from my SBR or SBS, may I move the firearm across state lines without the submission of ATF Form 5320.20, Application to Transport or to Temporarily Export Certain Firearms?

A: If the registrant retains control over the parts required to assemble the SBR or SBS, the firearm is still subject to all requirements of the NFA.
 
Maybe, sorta... but missing a critical factor to be true.

From the alphabets FAQ:

Q: If I remove the short barrel or stock from my SBR or SBS, may I move the firearm across state lines without the submission of ATF Form 5320.20, Application to Transport or to Temporarily Export Certain Firearms?

A: If the registrant retains control over the parts required to assemble the SBR or SBS, the firearm is still subject to all requirements of the NFA.
By retains control they mean in your possession.
 
No, the "stamp" made it an SBR ( Theres no stamp ) . With any SBR that started as a pistol you can just take the stock off and voila, its a pistol again.
The context was SBRs with free stamps. You were talking about SBRs that had never been pistols. I'm sure that your point is valid. I was simply pointing out that they were outside the scope of the conversation.
 
There is no legal requirement to notify the ATF of
The context was SBRs with free stamps. You were talking about SBRs that had never been pistols. I'm sure that your point is valid. I was simply pointing out that they were outside the scope of the conversation.
I was ttrying to talk about pistols that had been made into SBR's. Perhaps I blundered. Hardly anyone does rifles into SBR's any more
 
I think this may bave been brought up but its important to note that SBR's are only SBR's when in SBR configuration in ALL ways.

If it started as a pistol you take the stock off its a pistol again. It can also be sold as a pistol without notifying the ATF at all. They "like" you to notify them but its not an actual legal requirement at all. You can also travel interstate with no 5320.20 . You can let someone borrow it etc. Put the stock on its an SBR again. If you sell it to someone its a good idea to tell the ATF in case the person that bought it puts a stock on it and gets busted with an SBR and then tries to roll over on you to save his @ss but thats just a conjecture thing. Also if they try to register it and its already in the registry the ATF will call you. Ive been called before. They get bent out of shape but no law was broken.

If it started as a rifle you cant take the stock off but you can put a full length barrel on it.
 
I think this may bave been brought up but its important to note that SBR's are only SBR's when in SBR configuration in ALL ways.

If it started as a pistol you take the stock off its a pistol again. It can also be sold as a pistol without notifying the ATF at all. They "like" you to notify them but its not an actual legal requirement at all. You can also travel interstate with no 5320.20 . You can let someone borrow it etc. Put the stock on its an SBR again. If you sell it to someone its a good idea to tell the ATF in case the person that bought it puts a stock on it and gets busted with an SBR and then tries to roll over on you to save his @ss but thats just a conjecture thing. Also if they try to register it and its already in the registry the ATF will call you. Ive been called before. They get bent out of shape but no law was broken.

If it started as a rifle you cant take the stock off but you can put a full length barrel on it.
Couple things.

If you take the stock off, ATF says it's still an SBR if you keep the gun and the stock.
If it was originally a rifle, you can take the stock off if it's still over 26" OAL.

Of course, that's just how I understand it to be. Don't use that as advice.
 
Couple things.

If you take the stock off, ATF says it's still an SBR if you keep the gun and the stock.
If it was originally a rifle, you can take the stock off if it's still over 26" OAL.

Of course, that's just how I understand it to be. Don't use that as advice.
Its still an SBR if you maintain control of the stock. That means you have it in your possession i.e. with you if you travel or in your home if you are there but who cares , your'e home so being an SBR is OK. If you sell it without a stock you do not have control of it any more so its not an SBR..

Yes, SBR's are rifles. They have stocks. Over 26" its a firearm. Some guns like AK's its hard to get over 26" sometimes even with a 16" barrel and no stock or a folded stock. You pretty much have to have a full length barrel, .
 
@wired Well, regarding AR platform; it's simply 2 pins to swap into a short barrel upper to a rifle lower with stock, I'd wager that more AR15 rifles have been registered as SBRs for that reason, than just "AR pistols" converted to SBRs, although granted you could order stripped AR15 lowers and they're "registered" through 4473s as "other", so it could go either way.

It's also true that ATF says it's OK to go Pistol to Rifle to Pistol (as long as not NFA configurations unless registered as SBR), but not Rifle to pistol to rifle.
 
@wired Well, regarding AR platform; it's simply 2 pins to swap into a short barrel upper to a rifle lower with stock, I'd wager that more AR15 rifles have been registered as SBRs for that reason, than just "AR pistols" converted to SBRs, although granted you could order stripped AR15 lowers and they're "registered" through 4473s as "other", so it could go either way.

It's also true that ATF says it's OK to go Pistol to Rifle to Pistol (as long as not NFA configurations unless registered as SBR), but not Rifle to pistol to rifle.
Yep. I think were saying the same thing here but good point about the "other" category. For all legal purposes other is the same as pistol.
 
If DOJ/ATF gets smacked down by SCOTUS.. if. Congress could try to amend GCA68 definitions to include what they want to include, and to update and pointedly define AR15 and AK based and similar stripped receivers as all "Rifles" and this would entail the stopping and eventual removal of AR/AK and similar "pistols/others". This is a route I can easily see Congress trying, especially with an addition/amendment to GCA to include "assault weapons" and to insert "short barreled weapons without stocks that are larger than duty handguns" into NFA categories :rolleyes:
 
If DOJ/ATF gets smacked down by SCOTUS.. if. Congress could try to amend GCA68 definitions to include what they want to include, and to update and pointedly define AR15 and AK based and similar stripped receivers as all "Rifles" and this would entail the stopping and eventual removal of AR/AK and similar "pistols/others". This is a route I can easily see Congress trying, especially with an addition/amendment to GCA to include "assault weapons" and to insert "short barreled weapons without stocks that are larger than duty handguns" into NFA categories :rolleyes:
We will see if the Republican Party can survive the next two election cycles. As long as Rs remain in charge of at least either the House or The Senate I dont think it will have much of a chance of success., Even if they don't Democrats are stupid but theyre not so stupid to actually push for more gun control just so they can lose power. Power is what they want. They talk tough when they know they have no chance of success .

In the end though yeah, they want to radically expand the NFA. Its the gun control the government and the courts want. Possibly witht he tax reduced to something more in line with the AOW tax rate and a more. realistic approval process and the elimination of travel restrictions.
 
By retains control they mean in your possession.
That kind of goes without saying doesn't it? But thank you for defining the definition. ;)

Contextually, the impression I had, from the same question that has been brought up and asked time and again is... "if I want to transport an SBR over state lines without having to ask permission can I simply disassemble it?"

The likely assumption being that it is the intent of the person to try and transport it legally, but then reassemble it at their destination over a state line as an assembled SBR. (And assuming that possession of an SBR is legal in that state.) No... you can't do that.

"Yes. You can take the short barrel and/or stock off." can be pretty misleading. "Only if your SBR has been converted to a non SBR configuration and there is no constructive possession." would seem to be a whole let less so.
 
That kind of goes without saying doesn't it? But thank you for defining the definition. ;)

Contextually, the impression I had, from the same question that has been brought up and asked time and again is... "if I want to transport an SBR over state lines without having to ask permission can I simply disassemble it?"

The likely assumption being that it is the intent of the person to try and transport it legally, but then reassemble it at their destination over a state line as an assembled SBR. (And assuming that possession of an SBR is legal in that state.) No... you can't do that.

"Yes. You can take the short barrel and/or stock off." can be pretty misleading. "Only if your SBR has been converted to a non SBR configuration and there is no constructive possession." would seem to be a whole let less so.
Hahaha. Try being the moderator on a FB page advising newbies to the NFA . No, it really doesn't go without saying. Ive seen so many clueless questions come up in the last year or so regarding the NFA and one of the things Ive seen come up frequently is the constructive intent setup ( that hardly ever occurs ) Yes, you can still own the stiock you just cant have it with you. . The ATF has always been very clear that you cannot have the parts with you but that did not mean you couldnt still own the parts. Leave them at home or wherever other than with you. Yes, you can take the stock off and transport the SBR as a pistol but if you are so stupid to think that you only had to take the stock off and throw it in your gun bag while you drive somewhere, your reading comprehension and life survival skill are so bad you get what you get. Most people who get into the NFA game do it with a little research before doing so. That used to be true anyway. Now its a free-for-all.
 
If the ATF has gotten to this point with your charging docs your fudge is well and good packed and they are aiming for you to see very little sunlight for a long, long time
I know. Its really not a real problem. You have a much better chance of getting hit by lightning than of getting charged for constructive intent. Its truly hard to get a real feel for what the numbers are though as a whopping 97% of federal charges get pled down so the original charges get lost in the pile.
 
In the end though yeah, they want to radically expand the NFA. Its the gun control the government and the courts want.


Possibly witht he tax reduced to something more in line with the AOW tax rate and a more. realistic approval process and the elimination of travel restrictions.
:s0140: :s0140: :s0140: :s0064: :s0064: :s0064:

Which Party was it that proposed an increase in NFA tax prices? ($500 proposed in 2018, 50% in 2021 and then increase annually with Fed Cost Of Living Adjustment)
 
:s0140: :s0140: :s0140: :s0064: :s0064: :s0064:

Which Party was it that proposed an increase in NFA tax prices? ($500 proposed in 2018, 50% in 2021 and then increase annually with Fed Cost Of Living Adjustment)
Yeah they propose all kinds of stuff when they know they dont stand a chance of passing anything. Kind of like when Republicans posture on the budget and spending cap then cave when the room gets hot.
 

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