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Holy crow! Point blank ... at her head. Good thing he was slow.
Door opens in, hinges on the left. Maybe a right handed shooter, not very coordinated with his left hand?
Glad she'll live to tell her cautionary tale.
 
I actually used this vid to open a conversation with a left of center friend of mine on that very subject. The result was that in situations where a cop is needed a social worker doesn't fit. In situations where a social worker is needed cops don't fit. There is no way to accurately tell which is needed in each situation untill it develops. So; more training. Get officers trained in better deescalation tactics and social worker based skills. Which, of course, isn't helped by the defund movement.

Except, you don't call the police because someone needs counseling. You call them because there's something going bad and it needs to stop, typically, with physical intervention needed, and possibly a gun.

Sometimes, violence IS the answer.

A social worker would be effective if the perpetrator(s) sought them out during regular circumstances. When a situation has transpired to the point police are called, it's past the time for social work.
 
I definitely do not blame her for being complacent.

Cops are human, I wouldn't want every cop to be completely on edge as if a gun fight were to break out at any moment.

I don't wish to get pulled over and treated as if I were to automatically start shooting.

I hope cops can go about there day with some sense that is citizens will not start shooting at any given moment as well.

If none this can not exist, than I'm scared for our future.
It has nothing to do with always expecting to get in a gun fight. It has everything to do with be aware of your surroundings and the things that could possibly happen. You can do both (friendly/non complacent and aware) but it is a fine balance. At the end of the day The officer wants to go home to his/her family and should act accordingly with each call they are dispatched to. Even more so now with the hate towards officers and the media coverage and praise of cop killers.
 
Except, you don't call the police because someone needs counseling. You call them because there's something going bad and it needs to stop, typically, with physical intervention needed, and possibly a gun.

Sometimes, violence IS the answer.

A social worker would be effective if the perpetrator(s) sought them out during regular circumstances. When a situation has transpired to the point police are called, it's past the time for social work.
Violence of action. The go to answer.
 
i'll give her one thing. she was damn fast on the draw and did not hesitate.
i'll leave all the tactical stuff to those better trained, but i bet even jerry would be impressed with that draw and fire.
 
Except, you don't call the police because someone needs counseling. You call them because there's something going bad and it needs to stop, typically, with physical intervention needed, and possibly a gun.

Sometimes, violence IS the answer.

A social worker would be effective if the perpetrator(s) sought them out during regular circumstances. When a situation has transpired to the point police are called, it's past the time for social work.

In the context of the video OP posted it was a simple wellness check. What you'd send a social worker to. My point was that there are situations that evolve so quickly that you can not just send one or the other to a call. IF a social worker went to the call in the video they'd have gotten a new hole in their face answering a call perfectly suited to a social worker's skills.
 
Me thinks flashlight and voice gave her that minor delay, her actions saved her life.
1615213671034.png

they're there on a welfare check.
"Wife will give us the garage code if he doesn't answer." Seems he called the estranged ex in a despondent mode.
I actually used this vid to open a conversation with a left of center friend of mine on that very subject. The result was that in situations where a cop is needed a social worker doesn't fit. In situations where a social worker is needed cops don't fit. There is no way to accurately tell which is needed in each situation untill it develops. So; more training. Get officers trained in better deescalation tactics and social worker based skills. Which, of course, isn't helped by the defund movement.
When you live in a pretty confusing society that tolerates people going off the deep end and then coddles them after they create damage, you see more and more of it. If social workers and the Stasi showed up together with a wood chipper in tow, the bad actors would learn to keep a lid on it, or be weeded out pretty quickly.
 
5 cell MagLite :D
muzzle flash works too:s0092:
I guess that flew over your head. o_O


LOL.... 5-cell MagLites go THROUGH heads, not over them.



Me thinks flashlight and voice gave her that minor delay, her actions saved her life.
View attachment 839613

"Wife will give us the garage code if he doesn't answer." Seems he called the estranged ex in a despondent mode.
When you live in a pretty confusing society that tolerates people going off the deep end and then coddles them after they create damage, you see more and more of it. If social workers and the Stasi showed up together with a wood chipper in tow, the bad actors would learn to keep a lid on it, or be weeded out pretty quickly.



We got some weedin' to do, call in the Fargo-Squad!
 
In the context of the video OP posted it was a simple wellness check. What you'd send a social worker to. My point was that there are situations that evolve so quickly that you can not just send one or the other to a call. IF a social worker went to the call in the video they'd have gotten a new hole in their face answering a call perfectly suited to a social worker's skills.

That's true. I'm not sure about other parts of the country, but around Seattle the problem (in my opinion) isn't the social worker skills (or lack of social worker skills) of the police. It is the activist judges, prosecutors, defense attorneys and city government that have turned crime into a way of life and emboldened the scum of society by making it widespread knowledge that criminals won't be charged for a lot of crimes.
 
Hinges. It's all about the hinges. Determine how the door is going to open and stand on the opposite side. Force them to come to you and expose themselves if possible.
 
Her position was fine. There is no perfect position in a gunfight. It's fire and maneuver. She did both and lived to tell the tail.
Respectfully disagree. She was pinned in where she was standing and only had to move off the porch to give herself cover of the wall. Especially on a welfare check call which can go sideways quickly. As a field training officer, my trainee and I would be having a conversation after the call about this. The second is flashlight use. All he had to do was shoot at the flashlight (also a disadvantage of WML). Not saying WML are bad...but this is why you carry both. There may not be perfect positions, but there are definitely better positions.

I definitely do not blame her for being complacent.

Cops are human, I wouldn't want every cop to be completely on edge as if a gun fight were to break out at any moment.

I don't wish to get pulled over and treated as if I were to automatically start shooting.

I hope cops can go about there day with some sense that is citizens will not start shooting at any given moment as well.

If none this can not exist, than I'm scared for our future.
Let me begin by saying I critiqued her actions in my above statement as a learning tool (for myself) and not saying she is a bad officer. We learn much more when things don't go exactly right...I've caused my share of learning moments...we all have. We sharpen the sword by using it and learning from the nicks left in the blade.

It's not about being on edge, it about living in condition yellow and learning how to be comfortable with it. The fact is with every car stop, with every knock on the the door, you may have to start shooting. At any given moment someone may start shooting at you.

Although I've completed my career and now just train officers (and armed citizens) we are all in the same situation but just with far less exposure. But any of us sitting in a restaurant (if we are allowed to:mad:) my have to flip that switch as well. It's easier from a state of awareness. Thanks OP for the video and to everyone else for great thoughts!
 
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@WillametteWill alot of people don't understand or know that humans naturally shoot at light or flashes without even knowing it. Hence the reason people get shot in the hands so often. Depending on instructors we were taught to hold the light away from our body. I do like wml as well. But they have their downfalls depending on the situation. I agree with everything you posted above. You sound like a proficient and knowledgeable instructor.
 
Respectfully disagree. She was pinned in where she was standing and only had to move off the porch to give herself cover of the wall. Especially on a welfare check call which can go sideways quickly. As a field training officer, my trainee and I would be having a conversation after the call about this. The second is flashlight use. All he had to do was shoot at the flashlight (also a disadvantage of WML). Not saying WML are bad...but this is why you carry both. There may not be perfect positions, but there are definitely better positions.

We don't know what is on the other side of the wall. Maybe a window, maybe a fence, second story, or side yard where he could have come out and engaged the Officers. If she had been standing a few feet back and the shooter engaged from a window we'd be talking about how she should have had cover. There are a lot of variables not seen in the video. For a welfare check her position was fine. But that's all it was: fine. Not great. Not perfect. The most important part of a gunfight is fire and maneuver.... because bullets have a way of landing in even the most well thought out position.
 
We don't know what is on the other side of the wall. Maybe a window, maybe a fence, second story, or side yard where he could have come out and engaged the Officers. If she had been standing a few feet back and the shooter engaged from a window we'd be talking about how she should have had cover. There are a lot of variables not seen in the video. For a welfare check her position was fine. But that's all it was: fine. Not great. Not perfect. The most important part of a gunfight is fire and maneuver.... because bullets have a way of landing in even the most well thought out position.
Agree 100%, wasn't there, but normally you have at least a small gap between a porch and the first window in my experience. Upstairs windows...that's the job of the officers behind her to watch and if she is next to the building a shooter will see her partners first. Lots of maybes...but the main threat is the door they just knocked on.

I again respectfully disagree that the most important part of a gunfight is fire and maneuver; if the first shot is from the bad guy into my head I'm not getting a chance to do either of those. The most important part is avoiding a gunfight. I've have been in situations along with other co-workers that didn't do what bad guys were expecting, realized they were hosed, and gave up instead of fighting. She did good things, wasn't directly in front of the door, used a flashlight (might have saved her life), drew and shot very quickly, hit the threat (vital), moved in the manner she could, completely praise her for all of those. I'm just trying to examine and learn additional concepts when the opportunity arises.

@1775usmc humbled by your kind words. Thank you.

I learned looooong ago to be very careful Monday morning quarterbacking someone who is standing at someone's door at 2am risking their lives. I'm grateful for her being there, her actions, and willingness to serve the public is this less than ideal time to be in law enforcement.
 
A couple different data mining studies of gunfight outcomes showed that the #1 influencer in deciding if a person survived was the degree to which they effectively sought and used cover. Everything else was secondary.
 

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