Modifying recipe for 124 gr. 9mm

[Forester]

I have been loading 124 grain 9mm using polymer coated bullets and W231 powder.

Recently I have tried some factory 115 grain and prefer how fast the gun returns. Much more snappy.
I am planning to switch to 115 but have a couple thousand 124 to still load.

My question is if I can replicate the snappy return with the 124 grain by increasing powder volumes.

I am currently at 130 power factor.

Any input is appreciated

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[DizzyJ]

How far from max are you currently at with the 124gr?

 

[Forester]

How far from max are you currently at with the 124gr?

I'm using 4.6 grains and getting 1050 FPS
Not sure where the max is but I'm pretty sure I have lots of room

 

[DizzyJ]

Here's what Hornady says. If you don't have a manual, I'd highly recommend getting one.

 

[red442joe]

+2 on reloading manuals.

Joe

 

[PNWReloading]

Load data is your friend my friend.

 

[Forester]

Understood. Much appreciated
I did the research when I developed my load. Then just repeated for 65K rounds

 

[Forester]

Here's what Hornady says. If you don't have a manual, I'd highly recommend getting one.

View attachment 2222382 View attachment 2222383

Looks like the combination of 115 grain with W231 maxes out at 1100 FPS.
Just makes 125 Power factor

 

[WillametteWill]

I'm using 4.6 grains and getting 1050 FPS
Not sure where the max is but I'm pretty sure I have lots of room

FYI, looking at the 2025 Hodgdon manual for 125 gr lead (they do not have 124 gr lead with 231 powder, their max is 4.4 grains, so you are .2 above their max already. Although it sounds like it's been working for you for 65,000 rounds. Notice in @DizzyJ 's posted Hornady manuals how the max has been downgraded from 5.3 to 4.7.

I attribute lower maximum loads in manuals as time passes to two factors: attorneys and better load testing by the companies. Not saying you are doing anything wrong (I too have loads that I've been using for years that were blessed by 1980s manuals that are now over max), just wanted to throw it out there.

 

[Forester]

FYI, looking at the 2025 Hodgdon manual for 125 gr lead (they do not have 124 gr lead with 231 powder, their max is 4.4 grains, so you are .2 above their max already. Although it sounds like it's been working for you for 65,000 rounds. Notice in @DizzyJ 's posted Hornady manuals how the max has been downgraded from 5.3 to 4.7.

I attribute lower maximum loads in manuals as time passes to two factors: attorneys and better load testing by the companies. Not saying you are doing anything wrong (I too have loads that I've been using for years that were blessed by 1980s manuals that are now over max), just wanted to throw it out there.

I appreciate the input. I did alot of research when I developed the load, referred to published data and ran it over a chronograph. I havent reviewed it since I have been replicating it for some time.
Always good to re visit what I am doing to reevaluate.

Thanks.

 

[NeoBlackdog]

What discipline are you competing in that you're worried about the power factor? IDPA or USPSA?

 

[Forester]

What discipline are you competing in that you're worried about the power factor? IDPA or USPSA?

Both. Started with IDPA, migrating to USPSA but still do both. I am also interested in having my training rounds similar to my carry ammo. which is 124 grain.
I recently have found that a quicker recoil is allowing faster splits which is why I am interested in either swithcing to 115 grain or modifying what my 124

 

[Ben B.]

My electronic version of 11th Hornady manual doesn't list W231 or HP38 9mm 124, for some reason.

DizzyJ's picture of whatever edition Hornady shows W231 with 4.7 minimum and 5.3 max with a lead bullet at a stubby 1.090" length. .

The current Hodgdon reloading data site says 4.4 gr W231 with a Berry's bullet at 1.150" is Max, listed at 31,900 PSI for 1,037 fps, or 128 PF.

Dang, a lot of discrepancy there, .9 of a grain.

I load my 9mm to be ~130 PF, so that none of the slowest rounds dip below 125 PF, but I load 147s and haven't used W231 in 15-20 yrs. Still, I am surprised that max data with a 124 gr lead bullet is right at PF.

All this is interesting and I do understand going after an edge, but I'm reminded of the saying, "splits for show, transitions for dough". A powder change might be needed to get 115s above PF because they feel faster cycling, and….is it worth it?

 

[NeoBlackdog]

Have you looked at using Titegroup with your 115's?
Check the Hogdgon website.

 

[Forester]

I have some tite group and would be willing to use that if it is a better option. What started this process is when I tried some factory 115 grain and preferred the cycle rate.
The gun comes back on target significantly faster. Im not interested in "pushing the limits" on any recipe.
The experience of the 115's demonstrated that there is a better cycle rate than what I have. My goal is to reproduce that with safe reloads.