Oregon Measure 114 litigation

[1911Fanatic]

Because I'm most hands, at most distances, in most circumstances, 9 is easier to shoot and will be more accurate than other cartridges due to the shootability

I'd rather have to shoot them less times. Even with a vest with a trauma plate, a heavy enough bullet traveling at a higher velocity, can mean hydrostatic damage that can separate great vessels from their attachments with organs the same way that hitting a person in the chest with a full size sledge hammer might.

At legally defensible distances, you can do your first or second shot to the body and then one to their face, but may not have to with say something like a 41 or 44 magnum. A 357 magnum is more likely to be a one shot stop than a 9mm. A 45 ACP is more likely to be a one shot stop than a 9mm.

If you only have time to get off one sighted shot, shoot em in the face or dick. With the 45, a face shot is going to have an exit hole that is huge, and a crotch shot is going to destroy the wedding tackle if your dead on. A little to the right or left, and you're going to get his femoral artery, and he will be on the ground either bleeding to death, or unable to stand if your dead on and break the pubic smyphisis.

I'm just as accurate with a 1911 in 45 as I am with my Beretta or Glock in 9mm..

 

[1911Fanatic]

If it's properly concealed it won't matter. How is the cop gunna know you're carrying? You have the 4th Amendment.

With that being said if you have to use your firearm is a defense setting and it has a mag in it that holds more than 10 they will try and crucify you. Not like that isn't already on the table.

Risk vs. reward.

A "high capacity" mag is only a misdemeanor.

The first time. I read in there somewhere that a second time is a felony. But you would have to be really unlucky to have that happen twice. Most of us carry for years and decades and never have to draw or even reveal our weapon.

 

[156256Hunter]

I prefer 45, but 10 rounds of 357 sig in a G32 isn't a bad choice so long as you can find ammo

 

[ilikegunspdx]

We're not talking about bubbleguming around at the range here. I have a Beretta 92FS and M9A3. That hold 15 or 17 rounds in their respective magazines. That's a big gun to conceal anyway, but it just doesn't seem worth it to me when my full size, and Commander size, 1911's are so much less bulky.

I can get 7, 8, or 10 rounds in the gun, depending on the mag used. Why not shoot the more powerful cartridge with the bigger bullet if you are neutered down to ten rounds?

Also, if I want even more power, I have a 357 magnum revolver. Yes, even less shots, but you are only going to have to hit an assailant once, most likely, to make their attack stop.

Just carry a 10 rounder on your person. It's not like there is zero seconds between needing to shoot and needing to talk to someone about the shoot.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

I prefer 45, but 10 rounds of 357 sig in a G32 isn't a bad choice so long as you can find ammo

I'm pretty blown away by the power of .357 Sig. I always thought of it as a 9mm plus a little more penetration. Boy was I wrong. 9mm range ammo is like 320ish ft lb energy (fpe). .357 sig range ammo out of a 6" barrel is 640fpe, so about double. Glock 22 .357 sig shoot-uh (about 10,000 fpe total for 15 rounds).

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• ilikegunspdx
• Nov 12, 2024

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• ilikegunspdx
• Oct 31, 2024

 

[1775usmc]

The first time. I read in there somewhere that a second time is a felony. But you would have to be really unlucky to have that happen twice. Most of us carry for years and decades and never have to draw or even reveal our weapon.

I'll probably drop down to 10 rounds and just carry a spare mag. But I don't expect everyone to do the same.

Call me a boot licker. I'd rather have my ducks in a row if I ever have to use deadly force. Especially in this liberal sh!t hole.

 

[CamoDeafie]

I'll probably drop down to 10 rounds and just carry a spare mag. But I don't expect everyone to do the same.

Call me a boot licker. I'd rather have my ducks in a row if I ever have to use deadly force. Especially in this liberal sh!t hole.

Weren't you the one saying "do what you want. Just be prepared for consequences" or some such? Or "free men don't need permission"?

 

[ac807016]

I'll probably drop down to 10 rounds and just carry a spare mag. But I don't expect everyone to do the same.

Call me a boot licker. I'd rather have my ducks in a row if I ever have to use deadly force. Especially in this liberal sh!t hole.

This. I'm going from one 17 round mag, to 10 and 10 for carry. Practice those reloads

 

[1775usmc]

Weren't you the one saying "do what you want. Just be prepared for consequences" or some such? Or "free men don't need permission"?

Yea. People and their opinions can change. I also used to not care about printing. I do now. As I get older I have more to loose and my mentality on things has changed.

People are free to do as they wish. I'm pretty sure I still stand very firmly on that fact.

 

[PiratePast40]

Asking for a friend here, IF this hot garbage get put into place due to failed appeal or other. IF a person were to just continue to carry standard cap mags and were stopped by leo, does the whole gun get confiscated or just the mag?

3075 says that surrendering the magazine to LEO qualifies as an affirmative defense. Sort of like kids on the school bus. They're not supposed to be eating but, if caught, might be able to slide by with giving the gummy bears to the driver. However, if you tell the driver to f-off and grind them into the floor, you might be in for a different experience.

 

[Jcon268]

A large majority of the testimony submitted is in opposition. Encouraging!

...Which makes me question the whole process of how M114 got on the ballot and was passed to begin with. Where are all those "yes" voters now? Or do they not stand behind their votes in the form of testimony and were just moving with the herd mentality?

 

[Jcon268]

3075 says that surrendering the magazine to LEO qualifies as an affirmative defense. Sort of like kids on the school bus. They're not supposed to be eating but, if caught, might be able to slide by with giving the gummy bears to the driver. However, if you tell the driver to f-off and grind them into the floor, you might be in for a different experience.

Unfortunately, it's going to take someone telling them to F off to get this into a court battle that might be the key to overcoming it in the end. Who wants to be the test subject though?
Hate to say it but people with families/children and a lot of life left on the clock aren't going to put up that fight and the antis know it.

 

[Jcon268]

I prefer 45, but 10 rounds of 357 sig in a G32 isn't a bad choice so long as you can find ammo

Honestly, even some of the loads of 9mm nowadays are ultra-lethal. Defense round R&D has come a long way in the last decade.

But let's not pretend like they'll be done coming after our rights after this year. I just learned recently that the state of New Jersey has banned hollow-point ammunition for years now. The more effective it is at defense use, the more they hate it. It appears they just want their citizens/subjects as vulnerable as possible.

 

[SCARed]

I'd rather have to shoot them less times. Even with a vest with a trauma plate, a heavy enough bullet traveling at a higher velocity, can mean hydrostatic damage that can separate great vessels from their attachments with organs the same way that hitting a person in the chest with a full size sledge hammer might.

At legally defensible distances, you can do your first or second shot to the body and then one to their face, but may not have to with say something like a 41 or 44 magnum. A 357 magnum is more likely to be a one shot stop than a 9mm. A 45 ACP is more likely to be a one shot stop than a 9mm.

Lol. Your ballistics knowledge appears to be from 20+yrs ago.

Plenty of recent (20+yrs) data from actual bodies show there's really no difference between getting hit with a 9 or 45.
9mm has had a lot if development over the years and is on par with or exceeds most .357.

 

[1911Fanatic]

Is a 367 magnum 10 more than a 357 magnum?

Just asking for a "friend"....

Damn thumbs….

 

[1911Fanatic]

I'll probably drop down to 10 rounds and just carry a spare mag. But I don't expect everyone to do the same.

Call me a boot licker. I'd rather have my ducks in a row if I ever have to use deadly force. Especially in this liberal sh!t hole.

If I have to carry my Glock 19X I will have one 10 rounder in the gun with one chambered and two more Teners on my belt. But that only provides 6 more shots with three mags total on the Glock with 31 total vs 3 mags total and one chambered with the 8 round mags X 3. So, I guess do whatcha like.

 

[arakboss]

I'd rather have to shoot them less times. Even with a vest with a trauma plate, a heavy enough bullet traveling at a higher velocity, can mean hydrostatic damage that can separate great vessels from their attachments with organs the same way that hitting a person in the chest with a full size sledge hammer might.

At legally defensible distances, you can do your first or second shot to the body and then one to their face, but may not have to with say something like a 41 or 44 magnum. A 357 magnum is more likely to be a one shot stop than a 9mm. A 45 ACP is more likely to be a one shot stop than a 9mm.

If you only have time to get off one sighted shot, shoot em in the face or dick. With the 45, a face shot is going to have an exit hole that is huge, and a crotch shot is going to destroy the wedding tackle if your dead on. A little to the right or left, and you're going to get his femoral artery, and he will be on the ground either bleeding to death, or unable to stand if your dead on and break the pubic smyphisis.

I'm just as accurate with a 1911 in 45 as I am with my Beretta or Glock in 9mm..

If 6 rounds was good enough for Harry, it's good enough for me

 

[1911Fanatic]

Lol. Your ballistics knowledge appears to be from 20+yrs ago.

Plenty of recent (20+yrs) data from actual bodies show there's really no difference between getting hit with a 9 or 45.
9mm has had a lot if development over the years and is on par with or exceeds most .357.

They need to compare 9mm Winchester Ranger T series +P in 9mm and 45ACP or Federal HST +P in 9mm and 45ACP. I will try to find some gel tests for either of those rounds in their respective calibers.

 

[sobo]

If 6 rounds was good enough for Harry, it's good enough for me

Yeah, or was it only 5? So you gotta ask yourself one question...

 

[spookshack]

Let's stay on track folks. This is not a ballistics thread…..