I was wrong about the Sig P320

[WillametteWill]

Im just a random person, not a leo, but Im fully aware of the difference in roles. I held out with my trusty 1911 for years until only more recently succumbing to the pressure of gun control measures like 114 did I "modernize" before it was too late. I went with a custom Glock style platform, essentially safetyless with a trigger safety. They shoot as well as my 1911s and can say first hand, for my experience, the manual safety does not slow me down but I can say Im very methodolocical (slow) reholstering my strikers. My opinion but I think its bogus for anyone to say a thumb safety gets in the way, but the benifits are very real comparing the two designs espeically for administrative handling. There really is no reason to not want a thumb safety on a carry gun. As just a random person, as I use, carry, store, secure, arm/disarm etc. my carry guns I have my own routine with the mindset that Im human and someday will make a mistake so Ive built redundancies into my civilian gun rountines in life, but with my strikers... I have one less redundancy.

I'm with you. All my carry guns for the past...forever...have featured mechanical safeties. (Sans revolvers.) I think some who are mindful and train (easy example is @1775usmc ) will be fine without a safety; I lose no sleep over folks who get it. What I really hate is when gun shop people try to talk someone out of a gun with a safety when that's what they want when they walk in. 40% (from my little survey) is a decent percentage who carry with a safety.

 

[1775usmc]

Im just a random person, not a leo, but Im fully aware of the difference in roles. I held out with my trusty 1911 for years until only more recently succumbing to the pressure of gun control measures like 114 did I "modernize" before it was too late. I went with a custom Glock style platform, essentially safetyless with a trigger safety. They shoot as well as my 1911s and can say first hand, for my experience, the manual safety does not slow me down but I can say Im very methodolocical (slow) reholstering my strikers. My opinion but I think its bogus for anyone to say a thumb safety gets in the way, but the benifits are very real comparing the two designs espeically for administrative handling. There really is no reason to not want a thumb safety on a carry gun. As just a random person, as I use, carry, store, secure, arm/disarm etc. my carry guns I have my own routine with the mindset that Im human and someday will make a mistake so Ive built redundancies into my civilian gun rountines in life, but with my strikers... I have one less redundancy.

As a left handed shooter safeties are the devil. Sure some ambi ones are decent. In regards to concealed carry I don't think safeties are necessary in a QUALITY holster and the proper gun handling skills that have been tested under stress. For a brand new shooter or someone new to clearing a holster/reholstering I think a safety is good. But it's only good if they actually use it. Personally, safeties (outside of a trigger safety) are dependent on the role/duty the gun will play.

But if people want them I think it's a good thing. On a duty holster I personally would require it for myself if carrying with a WML. Without a light I would be completely comfortable with a Glock in a level 3 holster. It all comes down to whether or not the trigger is protected properly. Before I would have argued that a Glock with a light in a Safariland level 3 holster would be good to go. The more I observe the more I change my mind.

Elements, people, objects, etc are out of our control. Life isn't a flat range. Don't treat it as such. That's simply naive.

 

[Koda]

I'm with you. All my carry guns for the past...forever...have featured mechanical safeties. (Sans revolvers.) I think some who are mindful and train (easy example is @1775usmc ) will be fine without a safety; I lose no sleep over folks who get it. What I really hate is when gun shop people try to talk someone out of a gun with a safety when that's what they want when they walk in. 40% (from my little survey) is a decent percentage who carry with a safety.

yes, after learning the new striker guns they can be ran safe with training but I'm aware more than others who may have never grown up with a thumb safety that its one less redundancy. My opinion is that... and perhaps more so in the role of the armed citizen is that the odds of needing any millisecond speed draw difference is nowhere near the odds of being human especially as we age and get used to routines from blind muscle memory.
I have also observed experienced gun owners adamantly suggesting new gun owners to -not- get a gun with a safety and it perplexes me just how they know someone so well to suggest what the person doesn't need.

 

[Koda]

As a left handed shooter safeties are the devil. Sure some ambi ones are decent. In regards to concealed carry I don't think safeties are necessary in a QUALITY holster and the proper gun handling skills that have been tested under stress. For a brand new shooter or someone new to clearing a holster/reholstering I think a safety is good. But it's only good if they actually use it. Personally, safeties (outside of a trigger safety) are dependent on the role/duty the gun will play.

But if people want them I think it's a good thing. On a duty holster I personally would require it for myself if carrying with a WML. Without a light I would be completely comfortable with a Glock in a level 3 holster. It all comes down to whether or not the trigger is protected properly. Before I would have argued that a Glock with a light in a Safariland level 3 holster would be good to go. The more I observe the more I change my mind.

Elements, people, objects, etc are out of our control. Life isn't a flat range. Don't treat it as such. That's simply naive.

Left handed is a very valid point, its much more practice for me with my off hand to manipulate thumb safeties. I also agree with everything your saying here, I dont believe in making anything mandatory and support having the option to choose whats best for the individual. My strikers do not have thumb safeties, so I learned new routines and they are just fine with training. I have 2 WMLs and this whole Sig 320 debacle was really valuable for me to follow along so I exercise caution with those holster systems for them.... I cannot imagine that without at least a trigger tab anyways, my best guess so far is this is the culprit in the 320 saga, something got in the holster.

 

[1775usmc]

@DirectDrive I appreciate the video. Tabbed trigger install went smooth.

 

[spookshack]

The 320 FCU is a good bit easier to work on than the 365. The 365 is crammed full with small parts that don't like to stay in place.

 

[sobo]

There really is no reason to not want a thumb safety on a carry gun.

I must just agree to disagree on this point...

 

[sobo]

In regards to concealed carry I don't think safeties are necessary in a QUALITY holster and the proper gun handling skills that have been tested under stress. For a brand new shooter or someone new to clearing a holster/reholstering I think a safety is good. But it's only good if they actually use it.

It all comes down to whether or not the trigger is protected properly.

Elements, people, objects, etc are out of our control. Life isn't a flat range. Don't treat it as such. That's simply naive.

I must agree on these points...

 

[sobo]

after learning the new striker guns they can be ran safe with training

I have also observed experienced gun owners adamantly suggesting new gun owners to -not- get a gun with a safety and it perplexes me just how they know someone so well to suggest what the person doesn't need.

I must agree on these points...

 

[orygun]

Good thing, the aversion to eating blue.... cuz mixed with green it makes yel... no wait, JELLO!

Mixing blue and green made the ugliest color in that 64 box of crayons.

 

[Stomper]

Mixing blue and green made the ugliest color in that 64 box of crayons.

Wasn't that the one that had the sharpener built into the back of the box?

 

[orygun]

All carry guns should have an external frame mounted safety...

Nope. Another poster mentioned revolvers. Some of us carry them.
Also the comment about a 1911 cocked and locked with the grip safety removed, or deactivated seems wrong. With the safety on, that trigger does not pull, that hammer will not drop. Of course all of my 1911's are unmolested in that area and I only carry them C&L.

FYI, I don't carry a striker at all.

Wasn't that the one that had the sharpener built into the back of the box?

Yup! Mom wouldn't buck up for one, but there was one at Grandma's house.

 

[Stomper]

Nope. Another poster mentioned revolvers. Some of us carry them.
Also the comment about a 1911 cocked and locked with the grip safety removed, or deactivated seems wrong. With the safety on, that trigger does not pull, that hammer will not drop. Of course all of my 1911's are unmolested in that area and I only carry them C&L.

FYI, I don't carry a striker at all.


Yup! Mom wouldn't buck up for one, but there was one at Grandma's house.

You got stuck with the 48 count box, huh?

 

[orygun]

You got stuck with the 48 count box, huh?

It wasn't that big. 24, maybe?

 

[WillametteWill]

I must just agree to disagree on this point...

I must agree on these points...

I must agree on these points...

I'm starting to feel like I'm at the coliseum and @sobo is standing above, draped in Hawiian robes either giving us the thumbs up or thumbs down

 

[WillametteWill]

Also the comment about a 1911 cocked and locked with the grip safety removed, or deactivated seems wrong. With the safety on, that trigger does not pull, that hammer will not drop. Of course all of my 1911's are unmolested in that area and I only carry them C&L.

I think some of us have made the point (in many threads) that a striker fired gun, specifically those with light triggers approaching or below #4.5, is similar to carrying a 1911 with the grip safety taped and the thumb safety removed. That would be crazy, but with a SF gun it is called Tuesday for many. I've said all along that this is one of the issues with 320s, (the ones without thumb safeties).

 

[spookshack]

I'm starting to feel like I'm at the coliseum and @sobo is standing above, draped in Hawiian robes either giving us the thumbs up or thumbs down

 

[sobo]

I'm starting to feel like I'm at the coliseum and @sobo is standing above, draped in Hawiian robes either giving us the thumbs up or thumbs down

You mean like this?

 

[User 1234]

I think some of us have made the point (in many threads) that a striker fired gun, specifically those with light triggers approaching or below #4.5, is similar to carrying a 1911 with the grip safety taped and the thumb safety removed. That would be crazy, but with a SF gun it is called Tuesday for many. I've said all along that this is one of the issues with 320s, (the ones without thumb safeties).

Except that unlike a Glock, a 1911 has a fully charged spring ready to send the firing pin forward with sufficient force to ignite the primer.

 

[spookshack]

I saw a recent YT video of a guy showing that the "partially" cocked striker of a Glock can indeed ignite the primer.