Fundamental Differences in Firearms?

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I've been a PC Technician for a number of years and I always get asked what the difference between brands is and my standard answer is always - nothing. All PC's are made with the same parts from the same suppliers, assembled by people and sold under a variety of brands. A Dell, Gateway, Compaq, Acer, HP; they're all the same internally, just a different outer package.

So how does this apply to handguns? I mean really - what is the difference between Polymer Pistols from one manufacturer to another? Why is an HK 9mm Compact twice the cost of a Taurus? Why is a Kahr more than a Ruger? Or 1.5 times the cost of a Springfield? Sure, a Kel-Tec or High Point is a piece of crap and that's reflected in the lower than $150 price tag. But once you get into the $400 pistol market - what is the difference? If these firearms weren't safe we couldn't buy them so it can't be a safety issue.
 

Kimber Custom

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Think of it as Dodge, Ford and Chevy. Some really do x better than y but for the most part they will all get you down the road with a very similiar set of specs. There are also die hard followers of each. I think each has also had its share of lemons.
 
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All2kool
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I would lose that Kel-Tec & Hi-Point is POS thing first off. As an FFL I sell most makes & models of guns. I sell a large amount of Cobra, Hi Point, Jimenez & Phoenix Arms guns & I can tell you I have had less warranty returns on All of the cheaper guns combined than I have had with S&W & I have sold far fewer S&W guns.
Outstanding quality those Hi-Points can be. I've also heard of parts going down range on firing a Jimenez. Maybe Kel-Tec is the winner of the bottom of the barrel firearm category?
 
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Outstanding quality those Hi-Points can be. I've also heard of parts going down range on firing a Jimenez. Maybe Kel-Tec is the winner of the bottom of the barrel firearm category?
What model Kel-Tec is that?

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The "Feedback Score" is low by 4, not everyone posts it I guess.

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There are differences in guns. For example H&K cost more becuase it is twice the gun Tarsus is.
Keltec is not a POS. Yes there are some issues from time to time, but the support is really good for an inexpensive polymar that works.
Hi-Point, the 150.00 45acp while ugly, unwieldy is from reports a great fun beat it death gun,
Most often in the higher priced guns it is features or feel that makes the differences.

in expensive guns it is materials. guality. design and beauty that add a few zeros to the price.

Firearms are truly a case of "If it feels good do it" or BUY it since it has to feel right to you. And nobody is going to laugh or mock your choices, unless it's a GLOCK :)
 
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That's because hard use users do not buy them or else you'd be returning them daily.
That would be fine with me, I have a policy of paying for postage & insurance first time back to the factory. Also I would think offhand that out of the many hundreds of these Sat Night Spec's I have sold at least one of those guy's might enjoy shooting just a lil' bit...
 
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All2kool, pistols are definitely not equal. HK and Glock 9mm are the standouts when it comes to the polymer pistol race. S&W M&P's are pretty new on the scene and is still having growing pains, but promises great potential. I like Glocks because they have the simplest design. Kahr makes a good gun but are expensive due to supply and demand, they are probably the best in that size category. I personally steer clear of the XD, Ruger and Taurus. However, all have there pro and cons. All I can say is research and more research.
Oh Yeah, Glocks are so great, I haven't seen a pic of one exploding in hours
 
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I would lose that Kel-Tec & Hi-Point is POS thing first off. As an FFL I sell most makes & models of guns. I sell a large amount of Cobra, Hi Point, Jimenez & Phoenix Arms guns & I can tell you I have had less warranty returns on All of the cheaper guns combined than I have had with S&W & I have sold far fewer S&W guns.
Well this is easily explained. If I buy a POS gun for $150 then why bother sending it in? Chock it up to experience.
Now I spend $700 on a S&W? Heavens to Murgatriod,yes I'm warranting that gun.

They're still POS' (not the S&Ws)

Fit and finish. Go to the gun counter and work the different brands.You can feel the fit and the inside finish. Some of the cheaper ones will have a gritty feeling,while the nicer guns have smoother actions.
The material that the parts are made of too

Does the bullet fly slower and do less of a job? Still gets you to the same web site,but it may take a few more clicks before you hit the right spot.
 
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Well this is easily explained. If I buy a POS gun for $150 then why bother sending it in? Chock it up to experience.
Now I spend $700 on a S&W? Heavens to Murgatriod,yes I'm warranting that gun.

They're still POS' (not the S&Ws)

Fit and finish. Go to the gun counter and work the different brands.You can feel the fit and the inside finish. Some of the cheaper ones will have a gritty feeling,while the nicer guns have smoother actions.
The material that the parts are made of too

Does the bullet fly slower and do less of a job? Still gets you to the same web site,but it may take a few more clicks before you hit the right spot.
Yes -- well, there is that
Also S&W pays the shipping both ways under warranty
 
OP
All2kool
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Well this is easily explained. If I buy a POS gun for $150 then why bother sending it in? Chock it up to experience.
Now I spend $700 on a S&W? Heavens to Murgatriod,yes I'm warranting that gun.

They're still POS' (not the S&Ws)

Fit and finish. Go to the gun counter and work the different brands.You can feel the fit and the inside finish. Some of the cheaper ones will have a gritty feeling,while the nicer guns have smoother actions.
The material that the parts are made of too

Does the bullet fly slower and do less of a job? Still gets you to the same web site,but it may take a few more clicks before you hit the right spot.
This was my thinking as to why those firearms aren't returned as well - why bother?
 
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Outstanding quality those Hi-Points can be. I've also heard of parts going down range on firing a Jimenez. Maybe Kel-Tec is the winner of the bottom of the barrel firearm category?
QUOTE]

So why do you post a picture of a Hi-Point 40 S&W and make a comment about Kel-Tec? Can you explain why this gun is in two pieces? Was it the gun, bad handload, or something else entirely? Curious minds want to know.

I'm not going to bash one brand over another, as price is hardly the main determining factor as to whether the gun is any good or not. Manufacturers have their own philosophy about the guns they make and sell. Some can sell a product because they have great brand recognition which affords them a better profit margin. Some, because of their business philosophy, don't feel the need to compete on price at all, and instead of focus on a product they feel meets their understanding of the customer's needs. Some sell to price points, quality secondary, but folks avoid those anyway, unless that's all they can afford. If that's all they can afford, I can completely understand. Any gun is better than no gun, regardless of what it costs.
There are expensive guns that I don't drool over, and inexpensive ones that I do. There are some really nice guns out there that, no matter what, won't fit into how I live, defend myself, or pay the bills. It's a package deal to me, and I search for a gun that fits my needs, then work out how to afford it. For most, it's not exactly an easy search, unless you gotta have the biggest, baddest, most prestigious, most tacticool thing there is, and then of course everyone KNOWS you gotta go get an Umpty-Fratz model 8HIT or something.

That said, a gun is a personal statement, and as much as the car you drive and the home you live in. Personally, I don't give a rat's pink pucker what anyone else says about what I ought to spend my money on, and you shouldn't either.
 
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All2kool, pistols are definitely not equal. HK and Glock 9mm are the standouts when it comes to the polymer pistol race. S&W M&P's are pretty new on the scene and is still having growing pains, but promises great potential. I like Glocks because they have the simplest design. Kahr makes a good gun but are expensive due to supply and demand, they are probably the best in that size category. I personally steer clear of the XD, Ruger and Taurus. However, all have there pro and cons. All I can say is research and more research.

Not sure what you have against the XD. I've owned mine for several years and have put it through it's paces and after ~1500 rounds through it I've never had a single problem. The XD is the Croation HS2000 with the Springfield name on it. It's been the service pistol for the Croation military and police since 2000-2001. It's firing system is actually simpler than the Glock but unlike the Glock it's a single action, not a double action.

As a gunsmith I see a lot of firearm come through my hands. Some I would buy, some I wouldn't. Taurus is hit or miss. I love my Taurus revolver but I recently had a PT92CS that I wouldn't have bought because the fit and finish just wasn't there.

I won't buy a Kel-Tec. I just don't like or trust their design to really hold up. I would love to see some torture testing done. They purchased the designs from a company called Security Arms out of Nevada that went belly up. I had the displeasure of working on a SA pistol some time ago that was so poorly made that it's hammer/trigger bar connection would only last about 5 shots. Kel-Tec is now making it.

Hi-Point pistols are heavy and a pain in the butt to take apart, BUT Iraqvertan8888 on YouTube proved they are made tough. And if you can't shoot your enemy with it you could club them to death with it. :s0112: Sure there's a pic of one here that is broke in half, but watch the vids from YT, I'm amazed what they did to it and got away with.

Oly seems hit or miss. I love my Oly KB3 and it has proved itself tough. But the carry handle was made wrong and was actually very slightly cocked. I replaced it with a DPMS carry handle and it is much improved. Also, I wanted a chrome lined 1:7 twist which Oly doesn't make, so I replaced the barrel with a CMMG.

Frankly a lot of the big name high priced guns have a better track record for quality and fit/finish, but you're also paying extra for the name. There are some lesser expensive guns that are great, you just have to try them out and find a good one.

But back to the OP. Not all handguns are the same. While many will share common characteristics, they are different. Fit and Finish is a key factor but also internal designs. The Smith M&P is very similar to the Glock and shares some systems, but it's also different. Just like the insides of all computers aren't exactly the same. As I recall some Dell models still use Rambus RAM, unlike every other manufacturer.
 
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If you have a good firearm design that works the only reason it will fail is poor manufactureing, all things being equal of course (good ammo etc). Manufacturers seem to cut corners to make a buck and most of the time you are sending the gun back it's their fault in my opinion.

jj
 
OP
All2kool
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Not sure what you have against the XD. I've owned mine for several years and have put it through it's paces and after ~1500 rounds through it I've never had a single problem. The XD is the Croation HS2000 with the Springfield name on it. It's been the service pistol for the Croation military and police since 2000-2001. It's firing system is actually simpler than the Glock but unlike the Glock it's a single action, not a double action.

As a gunsmith I see a lot of firearm come through my hands. Some I would buy, some I wouldn't. Taurus is hit or miss. I love my Taurus revolver but I recently had a PT92CS that I wouldn't have bought because the fit and finish just wasn't there.

I won't buy a Kel-Tec. I just don't like or trust their design to really hold up. I would love to see some torture testing done. They purchased the designs from a company called Security Arms out of Nevada that went belly up. I had the displeasure of working on a SA pistol some time ago that was so poorly made that it's hammer/trigger bar connection would only last about 5 shots. Kel-Tec is now making it.

Hi-Point pistols are heavy and a pain in the butt to take apart, BUT Iraqvertan8888 on YouTube proved they are made tough. And if you can't shoot your enemy with it you could club them to death with it. :s0112: Sure there's a pic of one here that is broke in half, but watch the vids from YT, I'm amazed what they did to it and got away with.

Oly seems hit or miss. I love my Oly KB3 and it has proved itself tough. But the carry handle was made wrong and was actually very slightly cocked. I replaced it with a DPMS carry handle and it is much improved. Also, I wanted a chrome lined 1:7 twist which Oly doesn't make, so I replaced the barrel with a CMMG.

Frankly a lot of the big name high priced guns have a better track record for quality and fit/finish, but you're also paying extra for the name. There are some lesser expensive guns that are great, you just have to try them out and find a good one.

But back to the OP. Not all handguns are the same. While many will share common characteristics, they are different. Fit and Finish is a key factor but also internal designs. The Smith M&P is very similar to the Glock and shares some systems, but it's also different. Just like the insides of all computers aren't exactly the same. As I recall some Dell models still use Rambus RAM, unlike every other manufacturer.
Firearms can be like computers! Any other examples of this re-branding?
 
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This was my thinking as to why those firearms aren't returned as well - why bother?
Honestly, as I said before my warranty includes my paying to get a purchaser's handgun back to the manufacturer at no charge the First time, yet nobody seems inclined to send back anything but Taurus & S&W guns. I can only guess that in my 5 years of selling guns of any price I have yet to find many sendbacks in the Saturday Night Specials area because they must work??
 

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