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Fundamental Differences in Firearms?

Discussion in 'General Firearm Discussion' started by All2kool, Apr 20, 2011.

  1. All2kool

    All2kool Portland, OR Active Member

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    I've been a PC Technician for a number of years and I always get asked what the difference between brands is and my standard answer is always - nothing. All PC's are made with the same parts from the same suppliers, assembled by people and sold under a variety of brands. A Dell, Gateway, Compaq, Acer, HP; they're all the same internally, just a different outer package.

    So how does this apply to handguns? I mean really - what is the difference between Polymer Pistols from one manufacturer to another? Why is an HK 9mm Compact twice the cost of a Taurus? Why is a Kahr more than a Ruger? Or 1.5 times the cost of a Springfield? Sure, a Kel-Tec or High Point is a piece of crap and that's reflected in the lower than $150 price tag. But once you get into the $400 pistol market - what is the difference? If these firearms weren't safe we couldn't buy them so it can't be a safety issue.
     
  2. Kimber Custom

    Kimber Custom Vancouver, WA Bronze Vendor Bronze Vendor

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    Think of it as Dodge, Ford and Chevy. Some really do x better than y but for the most part they will all get you down the road with a very similiar set of specs. There are also die hard followers of each. I think each has also had its share of lemons.
     
  3. billdeserthills

    billdeserthills Cave Creek, Arizony Well-Known Member

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    I would lose that Kel-Tec & Hi-Point is POS thing first off. As an FFL I sell most makes & models of guns. I sell a large amount of Cobra, Hi Point, Jimenez & Phoenix Arms guns & I can tell you I have had less warranty returns on All of the cheaper guns combined than I have had with S&W & I have sold far fewer S&W guns.
     
    Blitzkrieg and (deleted member) like this.
  4. All2kool

    All2kool Portland, OR Active Member

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    Outstanding quality those Hi-Points can be. I've also heard of parts going down range on firing a Jimenez. Maybe Kel-Tec is the winner of the bottom of the barrel firearm category?
     
  5. deen_ad

    deen_ad Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    What model Kel-Tec is that?

    Eight U.S. Presidents have been NRA members. They are: Ulysses S. Grant,
    Theodore Roosevelt, William Howard Taft, Dwight D. Eisenhower,
    John F. Kennedy, Richard M. Nixon, Ronald Reagan and George Bush

    80 MILLION gun owners didn't shoot anyone today, a few criminals did!

    ----------------------------------------------------------

    The "Feedback Score" is low by 4, not everyone posts it I guess.

    Deen
    NRA Benefactor/Recruiter
    Washington Arms Collector member
    South West Washington Arms Collector member
     
  6. MarkAd

    MarkAd Port Orchard Well-Known Member

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    There are differences in guns. For example H&K cost more becuase it is twice the gun Tarsus is.
    Keltec is not a POS. Yes there are some issues from time to time, but the support is really good for an inexpensive polymar that works.
    Hi-Point, the 150.00 45acp while ugly, unwieldy is from reports a great fun beat it death gun,
    Most often in the higher priced guns it is features or feel that makes the differences.

    in expensive guns it is materials. guality. design and beauty that add a few zeros to the price.

    Firearms are truly a case of "If it feels good do it" or BUY it since it has to feel right to you. And nobody is going to laugh or mock your choices, unless it's a GLOCK :)
     
  7. billdeserthills

    billdeserthills Cave Creek, Arizony Well-Known Member

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    That would be fine with me, I have a policy of paying for postage & insurance first time back to the factory. Also I would think offhand that out of the many hundreds of these Sat Night Spec's I have sold at least one of those guy's might enjoy shooting just a lil' bit...
     
  8. billdeserthills

    billdeserthills Cave Creek, Arizony Well-Known Member

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    Oh Yeah, Glocks are so great, I haven't seen a pic of one exploding in hours
     
  9. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    Well this is easily explained. If I buy a POS gun for $150 then why bother sending it in? Chock it up to experience.
    Now I spend $700 on a S&W? Heavens to Murgatriod,yes I'm warranting that gun.

    They're still POS' (not the S&Ws)

    Fit and finish. Go to the gun counter and work the different brands.You can feel the fit and the inside finish. Some of the cheaper ones will have a gritty feeling,while the nicer guns have smoother actions.
    The material that the parts are made of too

    Does the bullet fly slower and do less of a job? Still gets you to the same web site,but it may take a few more clicks before you hit the right spot.
     
  10. billdeserthills

    billdeserthills Cave Creek, Arizony Well-Known Member

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    Yes -- well, there is that
    Also S&W pays the shipping both ways under warranty
     
  11. All2kool

    All2kool Portland, OR Active Member

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    This was my thinking as to why those firearms aren't returned as well - why bother?
     
  12. CarlMc

    CarlMc Safely north of Seattle Active Member

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  13. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    Ya laugh and say "yeah Freddy told me not to buy that POS" and hang it on the wall for story time.
     
  14. Blitzkrieg

    Blitzkrieg WA Well-Known Member

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    I've owned 4 Glocks (still have 3) and shot many others over the last 23 years and I have yet to see one blow up, or even jam unless the shooter limp wristed it
     
  15. Celtic Armory

    Celtic Armory Port Orchard, WA Member

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    Not sure what you have against the XD. I've owned mine for several years and have put it through it's paces and after ~1500 rounds through it I've never had a single problem. The XD is the Croation HS2000 with the Springfield name on it. It's been the service pistol for the Croation military and police since 2000-2001. It's firing system is actually simpler than the Glock but unlike the Glock it's a single action, not a double action.

    As a gunsmith I see a lot of firearm come through my hands. Some I would buy, some I wouldn't. Taurus is hit or miss. I love my Taurus revolver but I recently had a PT92CS that I wouldn't have bought because the fit and finish just wasn't there.

    I won't buy a Kel-Tec. I just don't like or trust their design to really hold up. I would love to see some torture testing done. They purchased the designs from a company called Security Arms out of Nevada that went belly up. I had the displeasure of working on a SA pistol some time ago that was so poorly made that it's hammer/trigger bar connection would only last about 5 shots. Kel-Tec is now making it.

    Hi-Point pistols are heavy and a pain in the butt to take apart, BUT Iraqvertan8888 on YouTube proved they are made tough. And if you can't shoot your enemy with it you could club them to death with it. :bluelaugh: Sure there's a pic of one here that is broke in half, but watch the vids from YT, I'm amazed what they did to it and got away with.

    Oly seems hit or miss. I love my Oly KB3 and it has proved itself tough. But the carry handle was made wrong and was actually very slightly cocked. I replaced it with a DPMS carry handle and it is much improved. Also, I wanted a chrome lined 1:7 twist which Oly doesn't make, so I replaced the barrel with a CMMG.

    Frankly a lot of the big name high priced guns have a better track record for quality and fit/finish, but you're also paying extra for the name. There are some lesser expensive guns that are great, you just have to try them out and find a good one.

    But back to the OP. Not all handguns are the same. While many will share common characteristics, they are different. Fit and Finish is a key factor but also internal designs. The Smith M&P is very similar to the Glock and shares some systems, but it's also different. Just like the insides of all computers aren't exactly the same. As I recall some Dell models still use Rambus RAM, unlike every other manufacturer.
     
  16. Just Jim

    Just Jim Well-Known Member

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    If you have a good firearm design that works the only reason it will fail is poor manufactureing, all things being equal of course (good ammo etc). Manufacturers seem to cut corners to make a buck and most of the time you are sending the gun back it's their fault in my opinion.

    jj
     
  17. All2kool

    All2kool Portland, OR Active Member

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    Firearms can be like computers! Any other examples of this re-branding?
     
  18. billdeserthills

    billdeserthills Cave Creek, Arizony Well-Known Member

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    Honestly, as I said before my warranty includes my paying to get a purchaser's handgun back to the manufacturer at no charge the First time, yet nobody seems inclined to send back anything but Taurus & S&W guns. I can only guess that in my 5 years of selling guns of any price I have yet to find many sendbacks in the Saturday Night Specials area because they must work??
     
  19. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    Or they were dropped already?
     
  20. raftman

    raftman Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Umm... where are you finding new Kel-Tecs for less than $150?