Washington Driving with a CPL

[UserUnknown]

Is it legal to drive with a loaded handgun in the vehicle if the handgun is not directly on my person.
My car has racing seats and I like to slip the gun/holster in between the console and seat while I'm driving since it would be incredibly uncomfortable to sit in the seats while still wearing it.
This is in Washington and I have a current CPL

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[1911Fanatic]

Well, it could become an air borne instrument of death if you are in a crash. In a holster on your person is probably safer in such a situation.

 

[UserUnknown]

Well, it could become an air borne instrument of death if you are in a crash. In a holster on your person is probably safer in such a situation.

Thanks for answering a question I didn't ask.

 

[1911Fanatic]

Thanks for answering a question I didn't ask.

Sorry don't know about Washington. Legal in Oregon. Sorry to have irked you.

 

[Alexx1401]

Is it legal to drive with a loaded handgun in the vehicle if the handgun is not directly on my person.
My car has racing seats and I like to slip the gun/holster in between the console and seat while I'm driving since it would be incredibly uncomfortable to sit in the seats while still wearing it.
This is in Washington and I have a current CPL

(2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.
(b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor.

Now and then I have "heard" of someone being given a bit of trouble about this when stopped and not having the pistol "on them". A LOT seems to depend on how the person stopped is acting to the LEO.

 

[1775usmc]

Yes, it's legal. No, I'm not a lawyer.

At the end of the day it is not a smart way to carry a pistol. I'll leave it at that.

 

[ivan_drago]

I screenshotted William Kirk's (Washington Gun Law) comment to his video on the subject. He said it was legal to carry it in the center console, doesn't have to be physically on the person.

 

[salmon creek gary]

All hair-splitting interpretation to the contrary, the written words of the law says it is not legal to carry a loaded firearm anywhere in a vehicle except on your person. Arguably, there's a little word "or" in the pertinent sentence that might mean it's maybe OK to have a loaded firearm elswhere in the vehicle if you are present. Push comes to shove, you get to argue that "or" with the court, not the cop on the street who doesn't know "or" from "oar" or "ower" and doesn't have time or desire to play word games with you. Choose your own level of risk (or paranoia).
1. To look up the actual wording of current Washington Law, click this link to https://leg.wa.gov/state-laws-and-rules/
2. At the site, see this section (at top-right):
Find state laws (RCW), then click the link for
all current state laws (RCWs).
3. At that page, scroll to: Title 9 CRIMES AND PUNISHMENTS click on that Title 9; it is a link to CRIMES AND PUNISHMENTS. (!!)
4. On that page, scroll down to; 9.41 Firearms and dangerous weapons. Click 9.41 to find yet another page.
5. On that 'nother page, scroll down to 9.41.050 Carrying firearms. There, you can click whichever display choice tickles your fancy, but the part you want is pasted below (especially the part highlighted in red).

RCW 9.41.050:Carrying firearms. (1)(a) Except in the person's
place of abode or fixed place of business, a person shall not carry a
pistol concealed on his or her person without a license to carry a
concealed pistol.
(b) Every licensee shall have his or her concealed pistol license
in his or her immediate possession at all times that he or she is
required by this section to have a concealed pistol license and shall
display the same upon demand to any police officer or to any other
person when and if required by law to do so. Any violation of this
subsection (1)(b) shall be a class 1 civil infraction under chapter
7.80 RCW and shall be punished accordingly pursuant to chapter 7.80 RCW and the infraction rules for courts of limited jurisdiction.
(2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any
vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol
and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is
within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the
licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the
vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.
(b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor.
(3)(a) A person at least eighteen years of age who is in
possession of an unloaded pistol shall not leave the unloaded pistol
in a vehicle unless the unloaded pistol is locked within the vehicle
and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.
(b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor.
(4) Nothing in this section permits the possession of firearms
illegal to possess under state or federal law.

 

[User 1234]

All hair-splitting interpretation to the contrary, the written words of the law says it is not legal to carry a loaded firearm anywhere in a vehicle except on your person. Arguably, there's a little word "or" in the pertinent sentence that might mean it's maybe OK to have a loaded firearm elswhere in the vehicle if you are present. Push comes to shove, you get to argue that "or" with the court, not the cop on the street who doesn't know "or" from "oar" or "ower" and doesn't have time or desire to play word games with you. Choose your own level of risk (or paranoia).
1. To look up the actual wording of current Washington Law, click this link to https://leg.wa.gov/state-laws-and-rules/
2. At the site, see this section (at top-right):
Find state laws (RCW), then click the link for
all current state laws (RCWs).
3. At that page, scroll to: Title 9 CRIMES AND PUNISHMENTS click on that Title 9; it is a link to CRIMES AND PUNISHMENTS. (!!)
4. On that page, scroll down to; 9.41 Firearms and dangerous weapons. Click 9.41 to find yet another page.
5. On that 'nother page, scroll down to 9.41.050 Carrying firearms. There, you can click whichever display choice tickles your fancy, but the part you want is pasted below (especially the part highlighted in red).

RCW 9.41.050:Carrying firearms. (1)(a) Except in the person's
place of abode or fixed place of business, a person shall not carry a
pistol concealed on his or her person without a license to carry a
concealed pistol.
(b) Every licensee shall have his or her concealed pistol license
in his or her immediate possession at all times that he or she is
required by this section to have a concealed pistol license and shall
display the same upon demand to any police officer or to any other
person when and if required by law to do so. Any violation of this
subsection (1)(b) shall be a class 1 civil infraction under chapter
7.80 RCW and shall be punished accordingly pursuant to chapter 7.80 RCW and the infraction rules for courts of limited jurisdiction.
(2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any
vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol
and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is
within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the
licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the
vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.
(b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor.
(3)(a) A person at least eighteen years of age who is in
possession of an unloaded pistol shall not leave the unloaded pistol
in a vehicle unless the unloaded pistol is locked within the vehicle
and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.
(b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor.
(4) Nothing in this section permits the possession of firearms
illegal to possess under state or federal law.

We've had this discussion in other threads. The statute is disjunctive, so any of the three options are independent lawful situations. If the loaded pistol is in the vehicle and the licensed carrier is maintaining control over that pistol from within the vehicle, then it does not have to be on their person.

There are many debates about whether off body vehicle carry is smart in certain situations, but WA's statute does not categorically ban it.

 

[Joe13]

I've never been asked and the times I've been pulled over (no tickets) I've not volunteered that I have a pistol in the vehicle with or on me.

If they don't ask then don't tell and don't ride around with a pistol where someone can see it or your inviting someone to call it in as brandishing and then get pulled over, loose your pistol and have your home combed thru for any other firearm you have.

Then spend the time and money it costs to get your guns and rights back.

Sounds maybe too far fetched? It happened recently….

 

[Alexx1401]

I've never been asked and the times I've been pulled over (no tickets) I've not volunteered that I have a pistol in the vehicle with or on me.

If they don't ask then don't tell and don't ride around with a pistol where someone can see it or your inviting someone to call it in as brandishing and then get pulled over, loose your pistol and have your home combed thru for any other firearm you have.

Then spend the time and money it costs to get your guns and rights back.

Sounds maybe too far fetched? It happened recently….

I have not been pulled over in decades. Have had a couple "interactions" with LEO's over break downs. Both times I had ID (and permit) in hand. Both times they were waved off with "just checking on you". When I said AAA on the way they left. I have to assume they had already run tags and knew who I was. Did have one co worker who was moving after work get the "line". It was 3:00 in the am. LEO was easy to see just doing checks to see if someone had just left some bar. Guys truck cab was full of stuff. LEO ran him and asked about a gun as he had a CPL. Guy said yes there's a couple of them back there somewhere in all this stuff. LEO gave him the line that "its supposed to be on your person". Since he was not arguing with him and of course was sober he just sent him on his way. A LOT will have to do with your way of acting when the LEO walks up to your window.

 

[Joe13]

A LOT will have to do with your way of acting when the LEO walks up to your window.

I think that is key.

I've been pulled over for 10 over the limit, expired tags (I totally forgot to register that year and got a warning) etc but the last time I was pulled over was quite a few years ago.

Rain or shine, day or night - I roll all of my windows down, turn the interior light on and make sure the LEO can see me take my keys out of the ignition and put it on the dash in a very visible spot. Then I wait with my wrists on the tip of the wheel and do nothing else until asked to.

I wear long sleeve shirts 99% of the time so my full upper body of tattoo's are not visible and I treat LEO as humans but with the respect their profession deserves.

I may bend the rules occasionally but not acting like a thug seems to go a long way.

Over decades I have had multiple pull overs and never once have I been asked if I have a weapon or gun on me.

 

[Alexx1401]

I think that is key.

I've been pulled over for 10 over the limit, expired tags (I totally forgot to register that year and got a warning) etc but the last time I was pulled over was quite a few years ago.

Rain or shine, day or night - I roll all of my windows down, turn the interior light on and make sure the LEO can see me take my keys out of the ignition and put it on the dash in a very visible spot. Then I wait with my wrists on the tip of the wheel and do nothing else until asked to.

I wear long sleeve shirts 99% of the time so my full upper body of tattoo's are not visible and I treat LEO as humans but with the respect their profession deserves.

I may bend the rules occasionally but not acting like a thug seems to go a long way.

Over decades I have had multiple pull overs and never once have I been asked if I have a weapon or gun on me.

YEP! Its a job, being an LEO. There is a VERY small percentage of people in the job who have no business in the job. The vast majority are just trying to do a job. Act like an asshat when one interacts with you and you are begging to make it worse. Even if you really did "nothing wrong" the side of the road is not the place to try to make your case. A shocking number of gun owners have a HUGE chip on their shoulder when they deal with them and it accomplishes nothing.

 

[1775usmc]

I always just say there is no gun on me or in the vehicle. Whether there is or isn't. No need to add more stress to the situation.

 

[Joe13]

I always just say there is no gun on me or in the vehicle. Whether there is or isn't. No need to add more stress to the situation.

I'm not sure I'm 100% onboard with that but everyone does it a little differently.

I tell my wife never to put a firearm in her purse or glovebox where she will have to tell the officer "I am going to open my purse to get you my ID but there is a loaded gun in there as well"….

 

[Alexx1401]

I'm not sure I'm 100% onboard with that but everyone does it a little differently.

I tell my wife never to put a firearm in her purse or glovebox where she will have to tell the officer "I am going to open my purse to get you my ID but there is a loaded gun in there as well"….

YEP! If asked I would say yes but, last couple times I had CPL in hand so it would have been easy. I have LONG warned people to NOT put a gun in a place you have to reach for ID for just that reason. The guy standing there has no way of knowing for sure they are safe if they see you reach for something where a gun is. WAY too many seem to not even stop to think from the point of view of the LEO. They of course watch the news and when they see a report of some scum shooting at one of them at a stop how could it not be on their mind when they pull someone over. Is there a few, as in VERY few people who are LEO's who should not be? Yes of course. Again though the side of the road is not the time or place to make a scene. Body Cams have been a GREAT thing for this reason. If one is being stupid they can be weeded out.

 

[1775usmc]

I'm not sure I'm 100% onboard with that but everyone does it a little differently.

I tell my wife never to put a firearm in her purse or glovebox where she will have to tell the officer "I am going to open my purse to get you my ID but there is a loaded gun in there as well"….

That's fair. I always have my gun on my person. I don't store it in consoles/glove boxes or leave it in the open. If I were to get searched/patted down I would disclose it but a simple question of is there a gun in the car I answer with "No sir."

I'm not advising others to do this just saying what I personally do. I am respectful, tactful, and disclose only what is needed.

The last time I was ever pulled over/had interaction with LE was over a decade ago. So I really don't worry about it much.

 

[kloudzabove]

Is it legal to drive with a loaded handgun in the vehicle if the handgun is not directly on my person.
My car has racing seats and I like to slip the gun/holster in between the console and seat while I'm driving since it would be incredibly uncomfortable to sit in the seats while still wearing it.
This is in Washington and I have a current CPL

Yes, this comes up a lot in WA. Here's the deal:


If you have a valid Concealed Pistol License (CPL) in Washington, you can have a loaded handgun in your vehicle—but the law (RCW 9.41.050) says it has to meet one of three specific conditions:

1. The pistol is on your person (e.g., in a holster you're wearing)
2. You stay in the vehicle while the gun is inside
3. If you leave the vehicle, the gun must be locked up and hidden from view

So if you're just driving and the gun is not on your body (like stuck between the seat and console), it's kind of a gray area. Technically, it's not on your person, which means you're not satisfying condition #1. Condition #2 is about staying in the vehicle, but the law doesn't say you can just have it laying loose nearby. That's where it gets dicey.


TL;DR: With a CPL, it's safest (and most clearly legal) to either:

• Keep it on your person while driving, or
• If it's not on you, make sure it's locked up and hidden, especially if you leave the car.

Wedging it next to your seat while driving probably isn't worth the legal risk, even if it's for comfort.


Hope that helps — stay safe and carry smart.

 

[ivan_drago]

Part of the problem with all of y'all's non lawyer interpretations is you only look at the text of the statute. You do your best to intrepret the commas and conjunctions, as cryptic as the legislature threw them together. The law is broader than the pure texts of statutes. Precedent decisions, established practices of courts and prosecutors and things like that also determine what the actual law is, like it or not. Simply reading the RCW is not enough to inform a person how to behave in compliance with the law. So I'd defer to actual lawyers like William Kirk and his various colleagues.

 

[tdemore1743x]

Part of the problem with all of y'all's non lawyer interpretations is you only look at the text of the statute. You do your best to intrepret the commas and conjunctions, as cryptic as the legislature threw them together. The law is broader than the pure texts of statutes. Precedent decisions, established practices of courts and prosecutors and things like that also determine what the actual law is, like it or not. Simply reading the RCW is not enough to inform a person how to behave in compliance with the law. So I'd defer to actual lawyers like William Kirk and his various colleagues.

Not only that, but the comment before you is literally a copy+paste from ChatGPT….