National Court Ruling on ATF Rule Change re Bump Stocks

[Caveman Jim]

Yeah all this is because one bubblegum-hole in Las Vegas went nuts and killed a bunch of people, but it's the Damned tool that the fool used that's the problem.

 

[PNWguy]

I don't own any bump stocks and never felt the need for one. But, a coworker of mine has at least a couple and said he refuses to turn them in.

I suspect most owners will do the same and ignore the new idiotic laws being passed.

 

[Gbirk]

I don't own any bump stocks and never felt the need for one. But, a coworker of mine has at least a couple and said he refuses to turn them in.

I suspect most owners will do the same and ignore the new idiotic laws being passed.

I get keeping it in hopes the courts reverse the law, or you are planning to move out of state, but other than that you are asking for a felony. I think it sucks, and I may have to soon make a similar choice with my "assault rifles" if the governor gets her way, but is a stupid bump stock worth a felony charge? You will just have a piece of plastic in your closet you can't use, and could get you guns taken as well as ruin your life.

I guess it is a "pick your battles" kind of thing.

 

[Caveman Jim]

I get keeping it in hopes the courts reverse the law, or you are planning to move out of state, but other than that you are asking for a felony. I think it sucks, and I may have to soon make a similar choice with my "assault rifles" if the governor gets her way, but is a stupid bump stock worth a felony charge? You will just have a piece of plastic in your closet you can't use, and could get you guns taken as well as ruin your life.

I guess it is a "pick your battles" kind of thing.

Every year it's a pick your battle with the progressive anti-gunner politicians going afoul of the constitution.
A man has to stand up for his rights at some point in his life, right?

 

[Gbirk]

Every year it's a pick your battle with the progressive liberal politicians going afoul of the constitution.
A man has to stand up for his rights at some point in his life, right?

I understand, I am just not sure I would become a felon and give up my gun rights, job, family and potentially freedom for a piece of plastic. I am just not sure this is the sword I would chose to fall on. Now the coming full gun ban may be a diffent story.

 

[Caveman Jim]

I understand, I am just not sure I would become a felon and give up my gun rights, job, family and potentially freedom for a piece of plastic. I am just not sure this is the sword I would chose to fall on. Now the coming full gun ban may be a diffent story.

Death by 1000 cuts is working very well for our enemies because people (gun owners that just sit back & take everything they throw at us) , it won't be long.

 

[Gbirk]

Death by 1000 cuts is working very well for our enemies because people (gun owners that just sit back & take everything they throw at us) , it won't be long.

I have no interest in my kids visiting me in my prison cell, and no big organization is going to come to your aid to fight for your bumpstock. Again, pick your battles, bump stocks are not the battle to fight and die for.

 

[Stomper]

You're already a captive... the key to your cage resides within.

 

[Jcon268]

Looks like they are waiting on Olympia to allocate the money State moving quickly on plan to buy up banned bump stocks | HeraldNet.com

So if someone in Oregon owned one, could they not then give it to a Washingtonian to turn into cash?

 

[Jcon268]

That Sleeping DOG is going to wake up pretty soon I think!!!

Oh he's awake alright. But it looks like he could use a good cup of Joe or two.

 

[awshoot]

So if someone in Oregon owned one, could they not then give it to a Washingtonian to turn into cash?

Playing with fire -- sale and manufacture are illegal right now: RCW 9.41.190: Unlawful firearms—Exceptions. (<i>Effective until July 1, 2019.</i>) Under state law, if you owned it before July 1, 2018, you can keep it until June 30, 2019 (and under Federal law until March 20-something, 2019).

Anyway, if your friend truly just gifted it to you, with no expectation of future payments/reimbursements and no trade (money isn't necessary to make a sale), then technically that might slip through -- but if you are making that argument, you're spending 1000s in legal fees by that point plus risking a felony on your record (goodbye guns), and prison time (goodbye job). The total potential upside which isn't even a certainty, is just $150. Not worth it. Stop thinking about it.

 

[KKG]

Oh he's awake alright. But it looks like he could use a good cup of Joe or two.

I'm a Tea Drinker but I've been told I make a Really mean Pot of Coffee and I have been known to Drink a Cup just to TEST the Pot. I lead two Crews on Projects, over the years and both have rated my Coffee Making pretty Highly. I would even continue to make it because I just might want a Second. So, I guess I have a Job in the Future, if needed.

 

[Jcon268]

Playing with fire -- sale and manufacture are illegal right now: RCW 9.41.190: Unlawful firearms—Exceptions. (<i>Effective until July 1, 2019.</i>) Under state law, if you owned it before July 1, 2018, you can keep it until June 30, 2019 (and under Federal law until March 20-something, 2019).

Anyway, if your friend truly just gifted it to you, with no expectation of future payments/reimbursements and no trade (money isn't necessary to make a sale), then technically that might slip through -- but if you are making that argument, you're spending 1000s in legal fees by that point plus risking a felony on your record (goodbye guns), and prison time (goodbye job). The total potential upside which isn't even a certainty, is just $150. Not worth it. Stop thinking about it.

I'm just saying if you had a friend on the Washington side, how do they know where the stock came from? Cash for stocks is all it is. Or do they check some sort of receipt of original purchase?

 

[Jcon268]

Not saying do or did ever have one...

 

[awshoot]

I'm just saying if you had a friend on the Washington side, how do they know where the stock came from? Cash for stocks is all it is. Or do they check some sort of receipt of original purchase?

Who knows but why risk a felony for a mere $150? Even at minimum wage, that's a mere day and half of value for the risk of a lifetime firearm ban, litigation costs, and prison time. There's no rational reason to take that chance.

 

[Gbirk]

Who knows but why risk a felony for a mere $150? Even at minimum wage, that's a mere day and half of value for the risk of a lifetime firearm ban, litigation costs, and prison time. There's no rational reason to take that chance.

I mean, your not taking taxes and travel costs in to account, so like two full days at minimum wage. Could be worth it then.

 

[Slobray]

I get keeping it in hopes the courts reverse the law, or you are planning to move out of state, but other than that you are asking for a felony. I think it sucks, and I may have to soon make a similar choice with my "assault rifles" if the governor gets her way, but is a stupid bump stock worth a felony charge? You will just have a piece of plastic in your closet you can't use, and could get you guns taken as well as ruin your life.

I guess it is a "pick your battles" kind of thing.

I understand, I am just not sure I would become a felon and give up my gun rights, job, family and potentially freedom for a piece of plastic. I am just not sure this is the sword I would chose to fall on. Now the coming full gun ban may be a diffent story.

I have no interest in my kids visiting me in my prison cell, and no big organization is going to come to your aid to fight for your bumpstock. Again, pick your battles, bump stocks are not the battle to fight and die for.

I would guarantee that when the next ban hit OR/WA, many people* here will be saying the exact same thing, but instead of bump stocks, it will be "high capacity magazines", "assault weapons", full registration, semi auto's, "sniper rifles", etc..............



Ray
* I'm not trying to single you out or trying to say you will or won't comply.

 

[Gbirk]

I would guarantee that when the next ban hit OR/WA, many people* here will be saying the exact same thing, but instead of bump stocks, it will be "high capacity magazines", "assault weapons", full registration, semi auto's, "sniper rifles", etc..............



Ray
* I'm not trying to single you out or trying to say you will or won't comply.

No offence taken, it is a conversation and an important one to have.

My stance on this is not about giving up, but bumpstocks are a battle we already lost, and fighting it by keeping your bumpstock makes you a felon. How effective are you going to be fighting for your rights from a cell? Fine, fight for your bumpstick, go to court, go to congress, talk to voters, but do it within the law. Keeping you bumpstock makes you a felon, giving up your bumpstock gives you standing for a legal case. We need to fight the battles we can win or try to win, and like it or not we lost the bumpstock battle. We need to fight smart, not like little children standing in the middle of the room yelling "No!" at the top of our lungs while we wait to get spanked by mommy. How well did that ever work out for you?

Sorry, but I am sick of the people posting "Will not comply" and "From my cold dead hands". You are not helping our position. You are making us look like criminals in defiance of the law. We are law abiding citizens with the founding documents of our nation on our side. If this is not a war we can win by exercising political and legal muscle then fine we go to war, but going to war by yourself is folly.

My children are the most important thing in my life "God!, Family!, Country!" in that order, so I make no apology if I plan to be there for them before I plan to be in a cell for a piece of plastic, guns (or my country).

Like you said there will be more bans coming. We need to focus on those because we still can. Those battle are not yet lost.

 

[CountryGent]

I don't own any bump stocks and never felt the need for one. But, a coworker of mine has at least a couple and said he refuses to turn them in.

If he's popped with it after March 26, 2019, he's looking at an NFA violation at the federal level. The penalty is as harsh as if he had an unregistered machine-gun, because that is how they are now classified. The penalty being a fine, mandatory federal prison time, a federal record after release, and loss of firearms rights forever (sans a Presidential pardon).

The ruling is one of the most intensely idiotic and unnecessary one's in recent memory. However, I hope your colleague is aware of the risk.

 

[Slobray]

No offence taken, it is a conversation and an important one to have.

My stance on this is not about giving up, but bumpstocks are a battle we already lost, and fighting it by keeping your bumpstock makes you a felon. How effective are you going to be fighting for your rights from a cell? Fine, fight for your bumpstick, go to court, go to congress, talk to voters, but do it within the law. Keeping you bumpstock makes you a felon, giving up your bumpstock gives you standing for a legal case. We need to fight the battles we can win or try to win, and like it or not we lost the bumpstock battle. We need to fight smart, not like little children standing in the middle of the room yelling "No!" at the top of our lungs while we wait to get spanked by mommy. How well did that ever work out for you?

Sorry, but I am sick of the people posting "Will not comply" and "From my cold dead hands". You are not helping our position. You are making us look like criminals in defiance of the law. We are law abiding citizens with the founding documents of our nation on our side. If this is not a war we can win by exercising political and legal muscle then fine we go to war, but going to war by yourself is folly.

My children are the most important thing in my life "God!, Family!, Country!" in that order, so I make no apology if I plan to be there for them before I plan to be in a cell for a piece of plastic, guns (or my country).

Like you said there will be more bans coming. We need to focus on those because we still can. Those battle are not yet lost.

If the past is any indication, all future 2A battles are already lost (at least in the PNW)...........

First it was SB 941 and many OR gun owners refused to fight - "Doesn't bother me, as I don't find this common sense law an infringement" and/or "this is not the hill to die on",

I-1491 and too many WA gun owners stated the exact same thing,

The "red flag" laws in both OR and WA - we heard the same thing with too many still refusing to fight, because this also was "not the hill to die on",

WA I-1639 - the majority still refusing to fight, because, you guessed it, "not the hill to die on",

Bump Stock ban - the majority still refusing to fight, because it's another "hill not to die on",

Look at some of the threads about laws being proposed and you'll find that those are "not the hill to die on" either,

Rinse and repeat,..........

So I have to ask the question to the majority of gun owners, are there any hills worth dying on?
Battles are not won by capitulating ............... Which seems to be the trend among PNW gun owners right now.



Ray