Conscripted service, good idea for young folks?

[mrblond]

I would not want anyone fighting with me that did not want to be there.

I used to think that we should get all the welfare folks out in the fields doing the work the illegals are doing.. then I thought about the poor farmers who would have to try to deal when them.

 

[PaulB47]

Since I don't believe in rights at all, I certainly don't imagine that everybody has a right to vote. Even the founders agreed at least on the latter point. The franchise was extended over time because it seemed like the nice, decent thing to do; however, that did not save it from being wrong. Only those with skin in the game should be able to participate in directing it. Otherwise you run into the problem, well known about democracies, that the people will "vote themselves largess from the treasury".

Please hold the lecture about this being a republic, not a democracy. We're talking about people voting.

 

[mrblond]

Funny, i was reading up on how it was done back in Greece. they pretty much put names in a hat and drew them to see who was going to serve in the .gov.. seems like a good idea atm, sure get rid of the life time politicians.

 

[CamoDeafie]

Since I don't believe in rights at all, I certainly don't imagine that everybody has a right to vote. Even the founders agreed at least on the latter point. The franchise was extended over time because it seemed like the nice, decent thing to do; however, that did not save it from being wrong. Only those with skin in the game should be able to participate in directing it. Otherwise you run into the problem, well known about democracies, that the people will "vote themselves largess from the treasury".

Please hold the lecture about this being a republic, not a democracy. We're talking about people voting.

We have people voting electors to vote for us

 

[The Heretic]

Since I don't believe in rights at all, I certainly don't imagine that everybody has a right to vote. Even the founders agreed at least on the latter point. The franchise was extended over time because it seemed like the nice, decent thing to do; however, that did not save it from being wrong. Only those with skin in the game should be able to participate in directing it. Otherwise you run into the problem, well known about democracies, that the people will "vote themselves largess from the treasury".

Please hold the lecture about this being a republic, not a democracy. We're talking about people voting.

The founders believed in the right of the people to govern themselves. Simple logic equates that with each person having a voice in how the government is run; i.e., voting for representatives/executives.

As fro democracies; the founders intended for us to have a representative republic with limited government power, not a pure democracy where the people could vote anything into existence. Unfortunately, very early in our government's history, those in power stepped outside of that framework, infringing on our Natural Rights - e.g., the Alien Sedition act of 1798 and other acts, including those of appropriation and spending ( Not Yours to Give | ).

The Founders were not perfect and neither is the US Constitution, much less the popular understanding of the principles of Natural Rights and proper exercise of governmental power. This does not mean that Natural Rights do not exist - at least in the sense of what works best and what doesn't - IMO.

So given that, no, I do not support, and have resisted, conscription. I served, but only voluntarily and I will not support the idea that a proper government can force anyone to serve the country against their will for any period of time - it is akin to slavery, which we abolished some time ago.

 

[PaulB47]

The founders believed in the right of the people to govern themselves.

No they didn't, unless you consider women, and those without property, not to be part of "the people".

Anyway, people governing themselves is also known as "anarchy". I mean anarchy in a good sense - not those commie bums setting fires and looting in Portland.

Anarchist Theory FAQ Version 5.2

 

[Ruger Rich]

I lived in a small agricultural community when I was drafted, that was Dec 1965. As Springstein sung, "they wanted me to go kill the yellow man". In my town only the guys from blue collar families were drafted. Son's of more wealthy parents were able to get deferments for a variety of maladies, and they bragged about it. It did not set well with me and remains a sore to this day. During basic I found that I was going to become a Drill Instructor as I had college behind me. I re-enlisted and became regular Army and therefore extended my time beyond the 2 years that a draftee would normally serve. At that time in the Army a distinction was made between draftee's and regular Army. My Army ID originally began with "US", meaning I was drafted. After I re-enlisted that prefix was changed to "RA". I am proud I served and there were many maturation benefits I derived from the Army as well as training that later in civilian life provided me with a very decent job. At the time I considered the draft servitude and I remember wondering at the time why women were not drafted.