C&R License Question

Bigbaddude · Mar 3, 2011

Just got my license and I was wondering if I bought a old gun and didn't like it could I
sell it and not have to worry about getting busted by the ATF?
I was thinking it might take a few guns to find the right one to add to my collection.

mosincoyote · Mar 3, 2011

you can only sell a small amount of firearms using your license to transfer them. this is explained as thinning your collection by the atf. if you try to sell more than the specified by the atf they will nail you other than that the number resets every year i believe but if you just got your license would it not be prudent to read any and all legal matters pertaining to said license kind of like reading the dot drivers manual before driving a car? anyway enough with the flaming hope someone with more info finds this post and helps you on your merry curio and relic adventures

madcratebuilder · Mar 4, 2011

There is no set number of C&R guns you can sell. By regulation you can sell for the betterment of your collection. This does not mean you can buy four No4's from SOG, keep the best and sell the other three. That's not the intent of the license. Keep your bound book up to date and selling a few C&R's each year should not be any problem.

coop44 · Mar 4, 2011

madcratebuilder said:
There is no set number of C&R guns you can sell. By regulation you can sell for the betterment of your collection. This does not mean you can buy four No4's from SOG, keep the best and sell the other three. That's not the intent of the license. Keep your bound book up to date and selling a few C&R's each year should not be any problem.

sorry but that is pretty close to what I do, there is no telling what you will get from a supplier, plus I only put in my book the guns I use my license to buy. You can actually "dispose" of as many guns as you like as long as you are not "engaged in business", if you are broke and need the money they cannot keep you from selling off your collection, just don't make a monthly habit of it.

One-Eyed Ross · Mar 5, 2011

What the original poster wants to do is fine, legal and what they expect you to do....sell the ones you don't want to get ones you do. What you have to sell?

As for only putting those in your bound book that you use your license to purchase, you should think about reading the books again....Any C&R you acquire, whether purchased with your license, received as gifts or purchased with a 4473 need to be entered into your book....

Trlsmn · Mar 5, 2011

Bigbaddude said:
Just got my license and I was wondering if I bought a old gun and didn't like it could I
sell it and not have to worry about getting busted by the ATF?
I was thinking it might take a few guns to find the right one to add to my collection.

Yes you can, what you can't do is buy in guns with your C&R for the purposes of selling and making a profit.

OK here is an example of what you can do, it you have a C&R and see a deal for say 5 Tokarevs at a bulk discount, you can buy them in, keep the best gun, and then sell off the others at cost plus any reasonable expenses to people but delivering them to the other people through a regular FFL.

Reasonable expenses could include shipping to you, shipping or transportation costs to the FFL and a reasonable fee for your time to deal with the transaction.

Another scenario, if you bought a Mosin Nagant for $69 and Obama banned them and suddenly they went up to $1000 you could sell it for $1000 and not be considered doing the transaction as a business because the increase is incidental and not part of a plan to profit.

This advice is however worth equal or lessor than you paid for it. :s0112:

Trlsmn · Mar 5, 2011

mosincoyote said:
you can only sell a small amount of firearms using your license to transfer them. this is explained as thinning your collection by the atf. if you try to sell more than the specified by the atf they will nail you other than that the number resets every year i believe but if you just got your license would it not be prudent to read any and all legal matters pertaining to said license kind of like reading the dot drivers manual before driving a car? anyway enough with the flaming hope someone with more info finds this post and helps you on your merry curio and relic adventures

There is no specified number you can sell, a reasonable number for a person is really dictated by their bank account. A person with an extra 100 grand of discretionary spending could turn over hundreds of guns a year as a collector and still be within the terms of the law. Always remember that which is not written in the law as illegal is legal.

CavVet · Mar 5, 2011

Trlsmn said:
Yes you can, what you can't do is buy in guns with your C&R for the purposes of selling and making a profit.

OK here is an example of what you can do, it you have a C&R and see a deal for say 5 Tokarevs at a bulk discount, you can buy them in, keep the best gun, and then sell off the others at cost plus any reasonable expenses to people but delivering them to the other people through a regular FFL.

Reasonable expenses could include shipping to you, shipping or transportation costs to the FFL and a reasonable fee for your time to deal with the transaction.

Another scenario, if you bought a Mosin Nagant for $69 and Obama banned them and suddenly they went up to $1000 you could sell it for $1000 and not be considered doing the transaction as a business because the increase is incidental and not part of a plan to profit.

This advice is however worth equal or lessor than you paid for it.

Exactly as I understood it, and I am OCD for attention to detail and reading and understanding rules.

EMP9596 · Mar 5, 2011

Keep your Bound Book in order as required.
When I first aquired my 03 I directed my questions to the ATF office in Seattle as I am a firm believer that the use of second hand information if wrong is still my mistake. They were informative, Polite and very helpfull and took their time in answering.

Blitzkrieg · Mar 5, 2011

EMP9596 said:
Keep your Bound Book in order as required.
When I first aquired my 03 I directed my questions to the ATF office in Seattle as I am a firm believer that the use of second hand information if wrong is still my mistake. They were informative, Polite and very helpfull and took their time in answering.

From what I have heard it is not advisable to take phone advice from ATF as they are often wrong. Get it in writing

EMP9596 · Mar 5, 2011

Blitzkrieg said:
From what I have heard it is not advisable to take phone advice from ATF as they are often wrong. Get it in writing

That is why one keeps a telephone log.
Ask them to give you the Chapter and Definition and explain any sub articals refered to in said artical or articals.
Over the years I have had good luck with them. My own attorney cannot sort some of it out.

Only call the Seattle office.