Ballistics truth, not theories

[Cerberus Group]

A highly recommended Primary and Secondary podcast with Doc Gary Roberts about ballistic facts.

I met Doc Roberts about 20 years ago when he presented a ballistic seminar at the Wa State LE firearms instructors association.

Had a chance to sit down with him and have him go over what I was witnessing.

View: https://youtu.be/h6MHG2cbZ7E?si=ei26sEsAK9tCiBpo

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[Flopsweat]

Ah, terminal ballistics. Not what I expected but important to know. Bookmarked for later when I have 2 hours.

 

[Cerberus Group]

No magic bullets...

View: https://youtu.be/0DFxaw1TAuY?si=t_ISrnx_5DbGO9d9

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

Lots of contradicting information over 2 hours:

Pistol bullets only poke holes.

Ok, so I need to use a rifle?

We shot a large animal with a rifle bullet going 6000fps and it just walked away.

More discussion about the superior wounding of .577 soft lead bullets.

Ok, so is this going to be a 230gr .45 fudd roundtable?

Some discussion about fluted bullets. Conclusion, not superior to JHP EXCEPT for 380 where hollow points often fail to expand.

Clear gel is no good, use 10% ordinance gel.

Back to rifles, yes you need speed, no speed does not matter, you want fragmenting and penetration or tumbling.

Those 2000fps Liberty 50gr 9mm bullets are crap. I shot one in clear gel, the petals expanded out and the base went 13 inches. 1 I thought clear gel was no good and 2 I thought that was what you wanted from rifle bullets, fragmenting and penetration.

The .357 magnum was not that great. The big flash and boom mostly caused a physiological stop. 40 s&w is better than. 357 magnum.

Even though 40 is better, most agencies should use 9mm.

What else, wadcutters should be used in .38 snubbies. I guess they have not seen the newer HST for the .38 that looks like a wadcutter.

Everyone likes buckshot over an AR-15 for home defense even though the AR is easier to use.

 

[TTSX]

The people in the panel look like fudd 1, fudd 2, a bald divorced guy who takes himself too seriously and a zz top extra.

 

[Cerberus Group]

Apparently this podcast is not for everyone.

Your information posted is incomplete on many of your points, which would give the impression that the people presenting the information are incompetent.

 

[Knobgoblin]

Without wading through the whole vid , what takeaways are there on fluted pistol bullets?
I keep wanting to really believe in the ARX style in 9mm . But they never took off in popularity. The low weight and easy to feed bullet profile set the hook for me. Just don't want to spend a ton of money on bulk if they're gimmick without substance.

 

[Cerberus Group]

Without wading through the whole vid , what takeaways are there on fluted pistol bullets?
I keep wanting to really believe in the ARX style in 9mm . But they never took off in popularity. The low weight and easy to feed bullet profile set the hook for me. Just don't want to spend a ton of money on bulk if they're gimmick without substance.

Watch the short clip I posted above...No magic bullets.

From what I've seen at autopsies, there's too much marketing scheme.

Present a product in such a way to make the public think they can't live without it...then go in for the monetary kill.

 

[Joe13]

I'll go with old school advice….




Honestly I don't have a dog in the fight… HP pistol rounds that worked 20 years ago still work.

Shotgun is #4 Buck.

AR is whatever I can afford.

AK is whatever is in the clipazine.

30-06 is Cor-Loct (spelling?)

.357 mag is "I wouldn't want to be you"…




Edit: Bullets are like ladies, I like most all of em and the end result is the same. I just happened to stay with the same lady for 30 years and I've gone through a lot of different bullets in those same years.

 

[Koda]

Theres no magic bullet, but some bullets are better than others. I just use the charts on Luckygunners website to compare "the best" but at the end of the day its all about marksmanship.

 

[Cerberus Group]

View: https://youtu.be/PrGL8wexJdA?si=gjel7zo8d8pR-O3a

 

[Koda]

Threads based on videos are most always slow to get discussion. I'm not certain what the subject is, when I think of "ballistics" I think of whats happening to the bullet only during flight. The last video about weapons for home defense, seems to focus more on "terminal effects" of bullets... that is, the classic "whats the best" for X defense etc.
5:05 in he mentions the AR15 is safest in an urban environment because its lightweight projectile has less penetration while still effective at incapacitation. Ive heard, iirc, that it penetrates walls less than a 9mm. Note: I think its safe to say he was referring to 556 or 223 caliber AR15s. He tends to favor the AR over a pistol or shotgun. I dont have any doubt of the "stopping power" of an AR rifle so Im curious... if its also "safer" then I think I could be convinced its better...
Does an AR15 have less wall penetration? How many walls does it go thru?

 

[Joe13]

Threads based on videos are most always slow to get discussion. I'm not certain what the subject is, when I think of "ballistics" I think of whats happening to the bullet only during flight. The last video about weapons for home defense, seems to focus more on "terminal effects" of bullets... that is, the classic "whats the best" for X defense etc.
5:05 in he mentions the AR15 is safest in an urban environment because its lightweight projectile has less penetration while still effective at incapacitation. Ive heard, iirc, that it penetrates walls less than a 9mm. Note: I think its safe to say he was referring to 556 or 223 caliber AR15s. He tends to favor the AR over a pistol or shotgun. I dont have any doubt of the "stopping power" of an AR rifle so Im curious... if its also "safer" then I think I could be convinced its better...
Does an AR15 have less wall penetration? How many walls does it go thru?

25 min long but I found it to be interesting. Fast forward past the bits you don't want to watch.

I am still completely comfortable with HP's in a 9mm in a pistol or 0000 buck in a shotgun.

Depends on what is happening and what I grab first and what the wife wants but the AR is he go to when I have the G17.

I prefer pistols for house clearing.

YMMV and to each his own.