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As a citizen, Isn't it your "duty" to lend a hand?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by BEN LILLY, Jan 22, 2016.

  1. BEN LILLY

    BEN LILLY Lincoln City, OR NRA LIFE MEMBER Bronze Supporter

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  2. clearconscience

    clearconscience Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    As a citizen? No, but as a human being. Yes.

    That guy exemplifies what being a Veteran should be. He will serve and fight until his last breath.

    God Bless him.
     
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  3. IheartSig

    IheartSig Beaverton Diamond Supporter Diamond Supporter Platinum Supporter

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    I believe it is a human beings responsibility to help when they can, like Clearconcscience stated. I also believe as a citizen, a neighbor etc, it is our duty to help when we can. I feel like the world would be a little better place if more people said "Hey I can help" instead of "Not my problem".

    I have found that in life, most things that are "not my problem" usually, eventually, become my problem or impact me in some way the more I try to ignore it.
     
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  4. USMC-03

    USMC-03 Moscow on the Willamette (i.e. Portland, Oregon) Well-Known Member

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    I understand the premise here but please allow me to broach a philosophical point...

    The concept of duty is essentially the basis for the many forms of collectivism; meaning that at birth others have claim on our actions. Kant was one of the major proponents of social duty but I reject this and his other anti-individualist views. So no, as a citizen there is no duty to lend a hand in that sense of the word.

    Properly used, duty is not automatic, but instead both a voluntary choice and morally right. It's based in benevolence to your fellow human, but never compulsory.

    All that being said: Bravo, sir!
     
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  5. Stomper

    Stomper Oceania Rising White Is The New Brown Silver Supporter

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    Duty is merely what one ought to do. ;)


    It's not my problem... that I help where helping is due. :D
     
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  6. IheartSig

    IheartSig Beaverton Diamond Supporter Diamond Supporter Platinum Supporter

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    Kant also surmised that there were perfect and imperfect duties though, a perfect duty like not murdering for personal financial gain for example will always prove true and is thus mandatory. Things like donating to charity or what the man in the article are doing he termed imperfect duties and reasoned were flexibly applicable based on situation, circumstance etc.

    Would you agree that humans should, when living amongst other humans be held to "perfect duty" situations?

    I am a fan of Kantian ethics to a point. He DID say something about sex and sexual activity being degrading and diminishing to humans, I cant get behind that part.
     
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  7. Sgt Nambu

    Sgt Nambu Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Good on him! It's great to see such a positive attitude! It's ones duty as a good neighbor to help each other out! I'm tight with my neighbors, 'course I've lived here for 38yrs.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2016
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  8. U201491

    U201491 Well-Known Member

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  9. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    I feel a strong obligation to help others of my own free will. I feel a strong aversion to being forced to help others against my will. I dont think duty has any collectivist insinuations above those given by those trying to force you to do something which is not actually "duty" but demand and coercion.
     
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  10. Caveman Jim

    Caveman Jim West of Oly Springer Slayer 2016 Volunteer

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    I agree, as a human being I feel compelled to do the right thing in any given situation but with limited physical abilities there is only so much I can do but I will do something!!! If even to calm and prep for the EMT's, I am at least doing something to help.:)
     
  11. The Heretic

    The Heretic Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Close.

    I take the concepts of responsibility and obligation and "duty" very seriously.

    These words infer the idea of owing something to somebody.

    I strongly believe that a person does not owe anything to anybody simply due to their existence (of either person). No person has the right to one iota of my life (time, effort, wealth or other aspect) if I have not done something to incur that debt. Yes - I use the word "debt" in these contexts because that is what an obligation is - something that you incur through your actions, but that isn't inherent to your simple existence.

    So my answer is no - I have no duty to help someone, or to make their life better, or otherwise give them some of my time, effort or wealth.

    I have been called "selfish" and "mean hearted" and so on, when I share this philosophy.

    But that just shows to me that those who call me names don't understand these concepts, and/or they don't take them seriously. Generally, many don't take their own responsibilities seriously. E.G., I personally know a number of people who never pay their debts, people who put their own needs before those of their children and/or their family, people who insist that you must give them something simply because they need it.

    I take my responsibilities seriously. When I tell a person I will do something for them, I do it. When I borrow money I pay it back before I buy something for my own enjoyment. I take my responsibility to my children very seriously and I recognize that it is a lifetime commitment, that it doesn't end when they become adults - as long as I am alive and able, I will be there for my child.

    When someone tries to take my time, my effort or my wealth from me, they are impairing my ability to meet my obligations to my family and other people I actually do owe something to. I have never owed a penny that I didn't repay. I can't say the same for many other people.

    That said, I do voluntarily give of my time and effort and money to those in need. Yesterday I gave money to a fund raising for a sick colleague. Previously I gave vacation time to another sick colleague. I have given money to friend in the hospital to pay his rent and tuition. I spent four years in the USCG, usually away from my family, risking my life to save and protect the lives of others. I give money to charities.

    I don't have a duty or obligation to do these things. They are gifts to others. They make the world a better place and I benefit from that. I get enjoyment from it - seeing that others are better off.

    So when someone tells me that I have this duty, or that obligation, or that I owe someone something, I take it very seriously - and in general, they are usually wrong in that assertion. That doesn't mean I won't help someone. It does mean I know the difference between something I owe and something I give.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2016
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  12. Sgt Nambu

    Sgt Nambu Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    This!!! Well said Monster!
     
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  13. BEN LILLY

    BEN LILLY Lincoln City, OR NRA LIFE MEMBER Bronze Supporter

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    My belief: If are a citizen of the United States, you incur a duty, obligation to protect and defend the constitution. If you do not accept this obligation, then in my opinion you are no more than those illegal aliens who leach the benefits of this great country without any regard to the sacrifice of the founding fathers and servants of the common good.
     
  14. erudne

    erudne The Pie Matrix PPL Say Sleeping W/Your Rifle Is A bad Thing? Bronze Supporter

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    There is a huge difference between voluntary, charitable service to your ingroup and servitude to a governmental force who is already thriving on the taxes you pay with the understanding that they provide for your ingroup's general welfare (instead of taking that wealth for thinly disguised fraud and graft).
     
  15. Certaindeaf

    Certaindeaf SE Portland Well-Known Member

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    That was certainly feelgood. May God continue to bless his soul.
    like
     
  16. Dyjital

    Dyjital Albany, Ore Flavorite Member Bronze Supporter

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    As a citizen: No. It's also not my responsibility to open a door for somebody with two hands full of kids, groceries etc. Nope, it is NOT my problem.

    But.. the one who dwells in me says it is my problem if I don't lend a hand.
     
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  17. lonegunman

    lonegunman Eastern Washington Active Member

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    It is nice to be able to contribute. If it even nicer to contribute to a neighborhood full of decent people and help. But NO it is not my "duty" to shovel your snow, feed you, cloth you or provide you a home, heat and free education. That is YOUR "duty".

    I chaff at the concept that I am somehow "obligated" to pay the freight on the nation's sick, lame, drug addled and lazy. Or that it is "our duty" to let criminals cross our borders illegally and cripple the social welfare system and schools of our country because they used to live someplace that sucked.
     
  18. etrain16

    etrain16 Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    My question would be, duty to who?? And if so, under what authority/obligation? Just reading this thread, what I see over and over are personal beliefs and opinions - none of which obligate anyone to anything. A duty, by definition, means you are obligated either to some authority or to some moral requirement that you yourself hold. And while I agree that being helpful to those in need is indeed a very American value, I don't know if it crosses the line into some form of obligation.

    For me, I was raised by parents that demonstrated the value of helping others. I learned that from an early age. To this day, I can't pass by an accident, ignore a fight or pass by someone clearly in urgent need without stopping to do something. But really, the only obligation is to myself and my personal convictions. I hold religious beliefs that similarly inform those convictions. And yes, as an American, I hold the belief that it is my responsibility to help protect and defend this country and the Constitution if I'm called to do so.

    But are any of these things my duty/obligation? I think I would stop short of that. But that's just my opinion, for what it's worth.
     
  19. 2506

    2506 Seattle Well-Known Member

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    "The job of a good citizen is to keep his mouth open." - Gunter Grass, German poet,

    novelist, and playwright, 1999 Nobel Prize for Literature.
     
  20. PaulB47

    PaulB47 Hillsboro Well-Known Member

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    The concept of duty is very friendly to the rulers, and probably was invented by them.

    There are no duties to do anything. The only obligations are those willingly and explicitly entered into. The rest is (hopefully enlightened) self-interest.

    It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest. - Adam Smith
     
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