.357 mag for blacktail

[Cape_hunter]

Interesting comment. There must be something in the air. I've been thinking of pulling the scope off my dad's 94 and installing a Williams peep sight on it.

Must be. Talked to a few people recently doing similar.

 

[wmr1949]

Ahoy there,

I have a buddy with a winchester 1894c lever action in .357 mag. He thinks it is adequate for blacktails within 150 yards. What do you guys think?

The frontiersman and cowboys did it with less

 

[OldBroad44]

I just checked out data at Buffalo Bore on their .357 mag 180 grain hard cast flat nose heavy outdoorsman ammo. They say the muzzle velocity from an 18" Marlin is above 1800 fps and nearly 1300 ft. lbs. And at 150 yards its still going at about 1,350 fps with about 730 ft. lbs. So a rifle shooting this ammo would be hitting a deer at 150 yards with the same or more clout as a handgun would do at the muzzle.

Seems to me that, assuming your buddy can hit a deer reliably with good placement at 150 yards, the problem is not whether the bullet can do the job. It's bullet drop. Buffalo Bore says the bullet drop of that ammo from an 18" barrel at 125, 150, and 175 yards is about 5", 9", and 14" respectively. I know I wouldn't be able to judge the distances at more than 100 yards well enough by eyeball. I'd need a range finder. (And would need a scoped gun at this point. I mostly get a kick outta being an old broad. But my vision ain't what it used to be.)

 

[DeanMk]

I think most would agree that 150 yds is pushin' it for any handgun round in a lever gun.
50-75 yards is the more appropriate range....of course, whenever you're hunting, the closer you can get, the better.

 

[OldBroad44]

I think most would agree that 150 yds is pushin' it for any handgun round in a lever gun.
50-75 yards is the more appropriate range....of course, whenever you're hunting, the closer you can get, the better.

No. We dont. As I and others pointed out, the .357 mag fired from a rifle barrel hits with about the same or more power at 150 yards as the .357 mag round fired from a pistol has at the muzzle. No one doubts the efficacy of the .357 mag round fired from a pistol against deer at muzzle distance. The .180 grain outdoorsman load, at about 1300 ft lbs at the muzzle, actually exceeds the power of a .44mag at the muzzle, which is normally about 1200 or under.

The only issue is whether the shooter is accurate and reliable enough for the hundred yard shot. I think many people here could make that shot easily and reliably if the gun were scoped and they were shooting from sitting or prone position and knew the range or are using a range finder. Some people here could doubtlessly make that shot reliably with open sights, but I'm not one of them.

 

[DeanMk]

YOU don't. Most of us feel otherwise.

 

[JRuby]

I personally do not feel a 357 magnum is a cartridge I would hunt deer with especially at 150 yards. There are much better choices starting with a 243 and going up. Break the piggy bank and buy a deer rifle.

 

[OldBroad44]

In hunting in the modern context, what caliber is best or even most efficient for the job is not the only issue. Or allows the most people possible to do the job. If that were the only issue, OP's friend would not be using a lever action rifle. And there wouldn't be any handgun hunters. And there wouldn't be any hunters using bows or muzzle loaders.

Very few of us are dependant on hunting to survive. And hunting is not the most efficient or economical to provide our families with meat. For us, hunting is a sport. And for a sport we choose a level that presents a satisfying challenge. Back when I was doing my deer hunting, it pleased me to do my hunting with my edc, a Colt 4" .357 mag in those days. I was an excellent woods woman, and was hunting an area that had plenty of deer. In 6 years of hunting I always got my deer on morning of opening day, though I had given up one morning and actually got my deer on the way back to my car. And it took me most of the morning to get my deer except for one time. In other words, using a 4" .357 mag made the sport enough of a challenge so that I felt a good bit of satisfaction when I got my deer. And it was a more meaningful challenge for me because I did a lot of hiking and camping in those days. And if I actually needed a gun either to put a rabbit in my stew or for SD, that Colt is what I would have had.

 

[Bobbygun]

And hunting is not the most efficient or economical to provide our families with meat.

Shush! Of course it is. Geez, take it easy will you? My wife may be reading this.

I SAVE THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS EVERY YEAR BY PROVIDING MEAT THROUGH HUNTING. (repeat after me)

 

[orygun]

There is a lot to be said for a 4" 357 revolver in general.

 

[JRuby]

Using enough gun means respect for the game and hopefully a quick kill. I have stood six feet from a doe that thought I could not see her, if it was legal I would have reached for my model 28 instead of my rifle. So yes in certain instances a handgun is a valid option but for me I will always choose a proper rifle / cartridge instead of trying to make a pistol cartridge something it isnt. Just my opinion.

 

[oremike]

I have a customer that hunts both Deer and Pigs with 158gr JSP (not JHP) ammo that I make for him. He says the JSP will shoot thru a pig and that's what he wants. I believe he has a Marlin and a Rossi that he and is wife use.

 

[OldBroad44]

Shush! Of course it is. Geez, take it easy will you? My wife may be reading this.

I SAVE THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS EVERY YEAR BY PROVIDING MEAT THROUGH HUNTING. (repeat after me)

RIGHT! For anyone who may be listening, HUNTING IS ESSENTIAL TO YOUR FAMILY'S ECONOMIC HEALTH!

Actually, I believe there is a relationship between hunting and the family's economic health, though these days it may be indirect. A story. Once upon a time when I was Young Broad, I took my Toyota van in for service to the best place for such cars in Corvallis at that time, London's. The waiting room and office area walls were lined with trophy heads, trophy quality, from the coastal mountains and eastern Oregon. Someone was a very good hunter. But I instantly realized this display meant more. It was a guy proclaiming his willingness and ability to take care of his family, come what may...whether he needed to start and run the best auto shop in Corvallis or hunt the food himself or anything in between. My turn came, and I saw from the name on his shirt the guy behind the counter was London himself. I asked, "Who's the hunter?" "I am," he said quietly. I turned back and looked at the display again. Then turned back to him and bowed formally. Neither of us said a word. But his eyes were shining. I could tell he knew I got it...completely.

 

[Nosferatu]

RIGHT! For anyone who may be listening, HUNTING IS ESSENTIAL TO YOUR FAMILY'S ECONOMIC HEALTH!

Actually, I believe there is a relationship between hunting and the family's economic health, though these days it may be indirect. A story. Once upon a time when I was Young Broad, I took my Toyota van in for service to the best place for such cars in Corvallis at that time, London's. The waiting room and office area walls were lined with trophy heads, trophy quality, from the coastal mountains and eastern Oregon. Someone was a very good hunter. But I instantly realized this display meant more. It was a guy proclaiming his willingness and ability to take care of his family, come what may...whether he needed to start and run the best auto shop in Corvallis or hunt the food himself or anything in between. My turn came, and I saw from the name on his shirt the guy behind the counter was London himself. I asked, "Who's the hunter?" "I am," he said quietly. I turned back and looked at the display again. Then turned back to him and bowed formally. Neither of us said a word. But his eyes were shining. I could tell he knew I got it...completely.

Hunting is good for MY health. Any other renumerations are ancillary.