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308 Semi Auto Values

Discussion in 'Rifle Discussion' started by Sonic Cruiser, Nov 27, 2010.

  1. Sonic Cruiser

    Sonic Cruiser South Puget Sound-Kent Member

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    If you had to balance wants vs needs in regards to money, and you had to lean towards the lower ranges of expense, like $1000 and below instead of $1000 and above....what semi auto makes makes and models are out there for a new guy? I see a lot of really interesting rifles but my experience level is like 0. Any thoughts?
     
  2. jdub75

    jdub75 PNW Well-Known Member

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    DPMS LR 308 is what I have now (just sold a FAL, another good choice) and I prefer the LR308 for the commonalities to my AR15.
    Saiga has a pretty loyal following if you like AK-ish ergonoimics.
    Go to M4carbine.net & check out their 'beyond 5.56' forum. Alot of good info (albeit a bit 'snobby' about anything under $2k).
     
  3. moriarty689

    moriarty689 Oregon New Member

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    A buddy has a Saiga 308, loves it. Don't know much about them, be worth looking into for sure.

    If you want accuracy, AR types win hands down. More $$$ though...
     
  4. trainsktg

    trainsktg Portland OR Well-Known Member

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    A PTR 91 is also an option, and a good one, but it is a heavy, awkward platform compared to an AR10.

    Keith
     
  5. e28rusty

    e28rusty Newberg Member

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    hk91/cetme vs. fal vs. ar10 vs. saiga
    All can be had for $1000 or less. It really depends on what you'll be using it for and what fits you best. I would try to find someone who will let you shoot one or at least handle one of each in a shop before you make any decisions.
     
  6. madcratebuilder

    madcratebuilder Ardenwald, OR Well-Known Member

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    There are a lot of AR10 platforms on Gunbroker for under 1K, ArmaLite's included.
     
  7. usmc

    usmc oregon Active Member

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    the PTR 91 is a great weapon, very accurate and very very simple action.2 pins and the entire assembly comes apart.its easy to clean, and always reliable.also there are tons of parts for them and upgrades. i sent mine to a trigger man and he took all the creep out of the trigger and dropped the trigger pull to 4 lbs,all for 55 bucks.they also have fluted chambers which allow for cold weather operation and eating all kinds of ammo, ar10's can be finicky.it is heavy, but when it comes to off hand shots give me a heavy rifle any day.i would also check out fn fal's or DSA arms.they have newly manufactured FN FAL's.everyone is crazy about ar10 platforms ,but they are complicated and have lots of moving parts.as far as SHTF weapon i'd go ptr 91 all the way.there just isnt alot to go wrong with them.im not kicking them in the crotch,they are a fine weapon, but i like simplicity. food for thought.
     
  8. Sonic Cruiser

    Sonic Cruiser South Puget Sound-Kent Member

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    Thanks for the above guidance, I'll research the rifles named and try to find one to heft at stores as e28rusty suggests. I guess my wants is higher than my needs, but 308 semi auto seems like one I want to have and shoot for fun.
     
  9. 1stklass

    1stklass salem oregon Well-Known Member

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    I definitely agree with USMC. I own a PTR-91 and absolutely love it. although i typically see them going for around 1200 i have seen a few advertised (lightly used, less than 100 rounds) for around 800. I sighted mine in last year with Hornady 168 grain ammo at 200yds and shot a 3 shot 3/4 inch group. Only 2 bits of advice when buying one. Make sure to get the 18 inch heavy barrel, and plan on buying an adjustable stock(around 250 bucks) as the oem stocks seem to be made for midgets, both side folding, or fixed.
     
  10. 1stklass

    1stklass salem oregon Well-Known Member

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    Oh one more thing, DO NOT SETTLE FOR A CETME WITHOUT AT LEAST HOLDING A PTR!!!
    Once you hold the two side by side you'll feel the HUGE HUGE HUGE difference in quality.
     
  11. galtsghost

    galtsghost Silverdale, Washington Member

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    I am selling a CETME / HK91 clone that is a recent build (9.5/10), all black furniture.
    No grinding on the bolt and fires very well.
    PM me if you are interested. I am in Kitsap County


    GG
     
  12. Sonic Cruiser

    Sonic Cruiser South Puget Sound-Kent Member

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    What does grinding on the bolt mean? Is it something you can see? Where do you look? Is a ground bolt related to misfiring or slam fire? Can you only tell with a feeler gauge or a gunsmith appraisal?
     
  13. trainsktg

    trainsktg Portland OR Well-Known Member

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    The roller delayed blowback design needs a tad bit of space (bolt gap) so that the rollers can 'squeeze down' properly when forcing the bolt carrier back. If its too narrow it puts a huge amount of stress on the receiver. Grinding the bolt face makes an otherwise too-narrow bolt gap appear to be OK.

    Here's a quick Q&A on the design.https://www.robertrtg.com/g3qa.html

    For a picture of this, go about half way down the page to the 'roller delayed' paragraph and look at the diagram to the right. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blowback_(firearms)

    Keith
     
  14. unionguy

    unionguy Portland Active Member

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    Read Boston T. Party's gun bible...great book...but he rated the FAL and the M1A as the top ones, the G3 next, and the AR10 varieties last. He looked at a bunch of issues to rate them.

    I went the FAL route and love them...lots a variety, good parts availablity, rugged designed, accurate enough for a battle rifle, and reliable.
     
  15. Iceberg

    Iceberg Forest Grove Active Member

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    The G3 (Hk91, PTR 91, etc.), FAL, M1A, & AR10 (DPMS LR-308, Armalite AR-10, etc.) are all heavy weighing about 10 lbs empty. My favorite AR10 type weapon is the LMT MWS and it weighs almost 13 pounds.

    I'm a Hk fan so I would buy a PTR91 GI. The are not really clones since they are built on Hk equipment. You can buy one from CDNN or Atlantic Arms for around $900. Atlantic will also give you a discount if you belong to the HkPro forum (excellent Hk forum you can join for free).

    This is a great gun that has a light GI contour bbl that will reliably shot all types of commercial & surplus ammo. G3 type rifles rival AR15s for available assys (barbies for men); 20 rd mags can be had for under $5 ea & like new surplus German Hensoldt 4x scopes w/ claw mounts are available for around $400.

    PTR 91 GI Rifle $899 AtlanticFirearms.com

    I would run away from any Century Arms, Hesse & Fedral Arms built G3 or CETME "parts gun" rifle. There is a reason why they are cheap and rarely do they run well w/o work (mags don't fit, sights are offset, rough action, improper bolt fit, etc., etc.).

    PTR, Inc (formerly JLD) makes the excellent quality PTR-91 rifles on original Portuguese Hk licensed equipment.
     
  16. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    OK I just went to google and couldn't really find a link telling me the difference between the FAL and the G3
    I mean I found 15692 threads on the subject,telling which was better,but not the differences

    Pics are cool too
    Thanks
     
  17. billcoe

    billcoe PDX Platinum Supporter Platinum Supporter

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    Not sure I can give you the differences, but a heads up. The "G3" mentioned above (that is the German military full auto version of the HK91) made by JDL is called the PTR 91 is an awesome rifle. Tight groups for a battle rifle, very easy to break down and clean, dirt cheap Mil-surplus mags and other parts made by HK: BUT, there have been some that are finicky about the ammo and jam. They list the stuff you DO NOT want to use on the web site: Welcome to PTR 91 Inc. Home to the PTR-91 Series of Rifles

    Mines been 100% on federal but jams if I put the wrong stuff in there, including Winchester White box. It's a bloody pisser I'll tell ya. You can research that on the HK Forums as the PTR91 is the closest thing to an HK without the HK stamped on the side that you can get.

    BTW, if you get one, check out the Hensoldt Fero German army sniper scopes (Hensoldt is the military wing of Zeiss and these scopes kick A**) which go for under $400 with the authentic Stanag mount and are calibrated for the ballistics of the .308. A good place to peruse that stuff (some of these parts will come and go, so buy now if it's available) I remember when the mags were .99/each. Thats CENTS! WOOT! RTG has them currently listed for 10 mags for $29 or you can get the "104-Pack Beat up mags for $89", or .86/cents each. Go price out a single extra 20 round mag for a DPMS or AR10 for comparison. Gun Parts - RTG International Surplus Gun Parts and Militaria

    I have a DPMS Panther .308 and an AR10 as well. Good luck with your choices.