What does As new mean to you

[boattail]

Not to derail the OBO thread I thought I would ask what everyone's definition of "as new" is currently for firearms. I may have told the story here about a gun I bought "as new" a while back.

So when does an item stop being as new and cross over into used territory?

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[eightyeight mag]

As soon as a round is fired in it.
I would not count factory testing of course.
My .02

 

[OrPackrat]

View: https://youtu.be/KJHadAPNAo4?si=ojoCQlcy_hgkTsb6

 

[CamoDeafie]

If there's still metal shavings/chips from the machining, and drips of cutting oil on other parts....
Once a gun has been fired by a customer, it is no longer "as new" IMO.

There is also the thing about "barrel breakin period"; so I would say 'used but not broken in" if less than 500 rounds?

 

[Andy54Hawken]

I am selling my Uberti 1851 "London" Navy as new....
I bought it new...and it is still unfired.
If I still had the box...it would be as new , unfired , in the box.

As new to me at least...means...unfired...and not handled very much.
Andy

 

[GWS]

Less than 5000 rounds through it.
Dropped on concrete no more than 10 times
Cleaned less than once.

 

[Tlock]

I am selling my Uberti 1851 "London" Navy as new....
I bought it new...and it is still unfired.
If I still had the box...it would be as new , unfired , in the box.

As new to me at least...means...unfired...and not handled very much.
Andy

New from 1851.....damn your old!

 

[gearhead]

To me, I'd say "old stock" and unfired. Handled? Sure. Modified? Perhaps. Fired? No.

 

[boattail]

The story behind my question was about a 686+ I bought "as new". It was in the same area as new firearms, and it looked really nice. I read the as new on the tag and figured it was an older unfired gun. When I received it all to take home I just grabbed the case and left the store. Out in my vehicle I opened it up and the case was old and dirty, missing just about everything a new firearm would have in the case as well. I looked the gun over better and only then noticed the scratches, the wear, and the obvious signs it had been shot a lot.

I was not too happy but I decided it was on me for missing the little details. I took it to the range and that is where I found out it was worn out, out of time, at the ejector star. I took the gun back the next day and pitched a little fit over the As New designation and showed them the wear and out of time issue. The shop did not focus on the As New part at this time but offered to send it back to S+W for repairs. When the gun came back it had a new ejector star and was still a tad late on timing with enough drag. The salesman took me to the new guns and showed me a new one that was timed the same. That is when the As New thing came up again. Because the gun looked as new under their lights it was sold that way. I just happened to be the dummy that did not do my due diligence when buying...I got a whole lot better and checking out firearms after that.

One Ca. specific forum had an overwhelming amount of members say As New could mean used....I disagree and as new to me means unfired and not handled but could be older.

 

[66PonyCar]

I prefer "like new" which to me means that is in excellent condition, showing minimal signs of wear or use, and often appears as if it has just been purchased. I always keep the original box, manual and all other stuff that comes with it. Then it's "like new in the box."

 

[boattail]

I prefer "like new" which to me means that is in excellent condition, showing minimal signs of wear or use, and often appears as if it has just been purchased. I always keep the original box, manual and all other stuff that comes with it. Then it's "like new in the box."

Yup, like new is not the same as "as new".

 

[gearhead]

The story behind my question was about a 686+ I bought "as new". It was in the same area as new firearms, and it looked really nice. I read the as new on the tag and figured it was an older unfired gun. When I received it all to take home I just grabbed the case and left the store. Out in my vehicle I opened it up and the case was old and dirty, missing just about everything a new firearm would have in the case as well. I looked the gun over better and only then noticed the scratches, the wear, and the obvious signs it had been shot a lot.

I was not too happy but I decided it was on me for missing the little details. I took it to the range and that is where I found out it was worn out, out of time, at the ejector star. I took the gun back the next day and pitched a little fit over the As New designation and showed them the wear and out of time issue. The shop did not focus on the As New part at this time but offered to send it back to S+W for repairs. When the gun came back it had a new ejector star and was still a tad late on timing with enough drag. The salesman took me to the new guns and showed me a new one that was timed the same. That is when the As New thing came up again. Because the gun looked as new under their lights it was sold that way. I just happened to be the dummy that did not do my due diligence when buying...I got a whole lot better and checking out firearms after that.

One Ca. specific forum had an overwhelming amount of members say As New could mean used....I disagree and as new to me means unfired and not handled but could be older.

Nowhere close to "as new" in that condition. I would think a reputable firearms dealer would have caught those conditions prior to acceptance/sale. Disingenuous at best IMHO.

 

[CamoDeafie]

@boattail
"As new" M16A1 kit from Apex gun parts (more like newly imported, newly released but certainly not new)




Edit.the actual listing says "good" but the same image could be found on Gunbroker I think.

 

[66PonyCar]

Yup, like new is not the same as "as new".

Agree, "as new" means to me that it is new. Although I've seen "new, old stock" for older firearms which may be out of production.

 

[Cavedweller]

Less than 5000 rounds through it.
Dropped on concrete no more than 10 times
Cleaned less than once.

So, you mean French Army milsurp?

 

[66PonyCar]

So, you mean French Army milsurp?

If it's French Army milsurp, it's just been dropped once!

 

[boattail]

Nowhere close to "as new" in that condition. I would think a reputable firearms dealer would have caught those conditions prior to acceptance/sale. Disingenuous at best IMHO.

Reputable is the key word. I have never stepped foot in that gun shop again. I also sold that revolver to another shop with full disclosure and turned over all my paperwork to show them the paper trail. I only lost $50 on the whole deal and was happy to be rid of the gun. The only reason I sold it after it got fixed was the poor design of the gun. The ejector star legs were not designed well enough for the heavy 7 shot cylinder and the issue was going to come back as they only swapped out the star...the cylinder had wear as well but was not replaced because it was "good enough" with just the new star.

I really look at the ejector stars closely for how they are designed because they need driving legs and stopping legs suitable for the weight of the cylinder. Since most manufactures stopped pinning those stars the legs become very important.

This is the gun......look how worn those legs are...one photo shows cylinder held to the right and one to the left.. a 16th inch difference.

 

[raftman]

I'd give something the pass for being either "as new" or "like new" if any use at all has been so minimal that it would difficult, if not impossible, to distinguish from something actually brand new. In theory, this could allow for something to even have been fired but in practice this is somewhat unlikely.

 

[Bobbygun]

If I'm buying - Pristine, never been fired, never been handled without gloves.

If I'm selling - No visible damage.

 

[Cavedweller]

If it's French Army milsurp, it's just been dropped once!

By the same guy.

On a serious note, "as new" means to me that the appearance and function cannot be distinguished from a new, unused firearm of the same type. There should be no signs of usage or wear. This is one notch below "new in box" (NIB) which would mean to me that although the box may have been opened and the firearm handled, it has never been fired and it is sold in the original packaging with all accessories and manuals that came with it included.