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Discussion in 'General Firearm Discussion' started by aboveandbeyond, Dec 12, 2012.
Not much I can say to add
No matter WHAT you do, you will not change someones mind, until... its to late.
And thats been floating around FB for a couple days, probably a repost/share.
Uh oh. I'm chewing Copenhagen right now... But seriously, baseball bats should be regulated and taxed. The black colored "assault" bats should be banned all together.
Comparing firearms homicides to accidental falls works very well when confronting someone who thinks gun deaths are a serious problem. People think deaths due to accidental falls are extremely rare, so when you tell them that they are twice as likely to die by a fall than by a gun, they see how misinformed they were on the facts.
Their interpretation of the data is slightly off:
All homicides (including firearms-related) was 16,799.
Firearms-related was 11,493.
Data is here: FASTSTATS - Homicide
at 11,500 homicides that is far too many!
How many of those 11k were of the justifiable variant?
And did the data include intentional suicides or accidental (or negligent) firearms deaths?
Darwinism...Back Of The Herd, Clyde...
I've always hated this argument, even as a gun owner. Cars and baseball bats weren't designed to kill. People choose to drink or smoke. These comparisons are just ridiculous.
Not at all. I have a few dozen gun "designed to kill people" that have never hurt anyone. The WORST thing you can say about guns is that they make it easier to do mayhem. This is true. This SAME thing also makes it easier for someone who is smaller, weaker, older or slower to defend themselves against a physically superior opponent.
There are something on the order of a million defensive gun uses in this country every year. That dwarfs the number of murders by nearly 10,000-1.
The reason you put up blunt instruments under weapons is to compare and show that lots of people are murdered every year by objects that are NOT guns.
Evil people will do evil things. Sometimes even good people will do evil things. But that's their decision, not some magical mojo that only happens because there is a gun around.
I question the original graphic with regard to the statement about baseball bats. Check out this data from the FBI's website:
FBI — Expanded Homicide Data Table 7
Especially in a country of 311 Million people. So, that equates out to be .0037% Horrendous and a carnage.
I question it also, but if you look closely the graph is showing firearm homicides which is being compared to violent crime using a baseball bat.
1.) My Remington 870 Wingmaster with a modified choke and 30" barrel is not designed to kill people. A lot of my guns are not designed to kill people. My Ruger .380 for example. It is designed to put little shallow holes in people. Although it is statistically and scientifically possible to kill people with these guns, it is not likely to happen, and is not what they were designed for.
2.)Medical errors 195,000 deaths. I would argue that the present state of health care IS designed to kill people, and not of their own free will.
Death is death. Still just as final.
And my normal response to that argument is that if guns were designed to 'kill' then they are the greatest engineering failures in the history of mankind. Considering the ratio of how many firearms are fired versus the number of deaths from being shot, I think the ratio would be rather small, even if restricted to just the US. It gets even worse if you try the number of shots being fired versus the number of rounds striking people who died as a result.
While they may have been initially intended to replace archers and crossbowmen, they found that the level of inaccuracy and ineffectiveness against any sort of protection relegated them to area denial weapons (ie they scared the horses and infantry and caused a some wounds and maybe a few deaths - more out of luck than anything). Jump forward a few hundred years and look at the amount of rounds fired, even in wartime. In order to reach the level of carnage of the civil war, many rounds were fired for each hit. In the 'old west', I recall reading about a posse chasing a bank robber through town. He finally died after being struck by over 40 rounds. These days, they've gotten a lot more effective due to accuracy and consistency but the still follow their basic function: throw a projectile at whatever the operator is aiming towards. It is merely a force multiplier, not some magical death machine and not designed to 'kill'
Roughly 2/3rds of that is criminals shooting other criminals, FWIW.
I think im gonna go spit my chew out now !
Tried to ship a long gun at Fedex tonight and they refused. I am not happy. If my children did not live here, I would move to Texas!!