To lift or not to lift 2wd compact suv?

[41mag]

I did not grow up 4-wheeling like some of y'all did.

I grew up in the SW Idaho deserts in the 1950s-mid 60s....it was only creeping into the 63-64 epoch that any of us had $ to start feeding the 4x4 frenzy.

We learned how far such as 54 Plymouth/51 Ford/55 Oldsmobile/49 & 53 Cadillacs/55 Ford utility wagon could actually be relied upon in the sandy washes & sage brush trails. 41 Buick business coupe did pretty well. A 45 CJ2 was recruited. My personal favorite was Gertie, a 65 VW bug that actually did travel most of my favorite dirt bike trails....sometimes balanced on 2 wheels...

Someone discovered limited slip rear ends, someone else bought a 4x4 Suburban "Zero" and the race was on. The balance between traction, actual power, clearance, urge to do unnecessary dumb Outback Things, and the cash in your pocket till next pay day, was a never ending struggle. A 1928 Model A sedan had particularly good off road usefulness...if we could keep it running between outings.

 

[3MTA3]

Nyet - I've never undestood what a lift accomplishes unless it's so you can go to a larger diameter tire. Even then you are only increasing round clearance by 1/2 of the diameter increase. Otherwise a lift doesn't increase ground clearance and it raises your center of gravity making it less stable - it also changes the geometry of the drve train and places extra wear on the u-joints. I wouldn't even consider it for a 2WD vehicle.

 

[CamoDeafie]

@3MTA3 That's why I tried to find out just how big a traction tire I could find that didn't require a lift. It does seem that eventually, they add lift to them because of suspension/brake clearance issues with certain larger tire sizes? I mean, after going for say, a 235/75/R15s (just under 30" outside diameter?); they almost always need lift to provide suspension travel clearance and so on...but they also seem to need to cut away/modify the fenders and bumpers for the next size up tires...

Going that big a jump, I would probably not..... but if it does turn out that the TJ springs I'm picking up, gives me about 3-3.5" of relative lift on the back....that means a 225-235 traction tire on wheels that have smaller offsets/less backspace would work OK.... Again, it might be best to set them aside for a 4wd Sportage eventually and just run this one with 215s

 

[benchmark]

 

[CamoDeafie]

Ya know... chains used to be the only way to get real traction in deep mud until tire designs improved considerably.. even then, by WW2, the Germans made use of chains on their Kubelwagens for muddy areas when the standard deep tread tires didnt get enough traction.

 

[billdeserthills]

Can't say as to the alteration of your vehicle, but I've bought tires online from https://simpletire.com/winter-tires
a few times now & they have saved me a bunch of $$$
finding a mexican with a tire shop helps too

 

[Flymph]

I'm less worried about beating them up off road than I would be with a much newer vehicle for all the crap... it has been reliable to me. Granted, it's only got 135k miles on it right now with regular maintenance.... Then again, I haven't quite abused it off road anyhow (it pays to know my limitations)

I can't justify a Subaru, even after selling the Kia Not when I can get a Blazer, a Cherokee, a CJ-5, or really, any other 4x4 pickup/truck/SUV......

You're better off going for an older F-150 in that price range...
If you have 3k for a decent K5 Blazer and time/know-how they're worth it and will only go up as you fix it. Ya gotta have the money and time tho.

 

[Flymph]

Already replaced engine and clutch last year. so far the rear axle's gears are in good shape.

Yeah, my GParents had one of those... the engine blew around that milage. They got their money back after a vicious reputation campaign against him for not honoring the warranty initially.

 

[NW Backpacker]

How often will you use the vehicle in a situation where you will actually need higher clearance? If just wanting traction I'd go with chains, but if rear end is light, may need to throw some weight in the back, but not so much that the front is too light!

 

[CamoDeafie]

I've actually bottomed it out a few times on the forest service roads,.usually entering or leaving a camp site, or depending on the location, entering the main forest service road from the smaller short roads
Same exact argument could be used for dropping the cars or trucks down to the ground but really, its all compromises regarding suspension design and wear/tear. Ideally driveshaft as horizontal as possible to the differential.. ideally front axle half shafta should have least amount of deflection (another reason a solid front axle works best for such things); but again it depends. Body lift could work if I just want bigger tires and nothing else, however it still have the same steering issues mentioned in video.. and then theres the fuel tank filler tube, and all the brake line and fuel lines to work around from the body lift concept. And it would still require longer shocks, strut spacers, etc because of where they mount on the body vs the frame

 

[Flymph]

That's why you get aftermarket bumpers on a subaru...

 

[Unka-Boo]

Grab wheel/tire in size you want ( wrecking yard, craigslist, whatever ), put on vehicle, cycle suspension and look for interference. Next step is to cut, bash ( yes, as in big hammer ) the areas that rub. I would bet you could run a narrow 31" tire with minimal trimming and no lift. After that, see if there is a locker for it ( Lockright, ect ) and drive the heck out of it.

 

[CamoDeafie]

Grab wheel/tire in size you want ( wrecking yard, craigslist, whatever ), put on vehicle, cycle suspension and look for interference. Next step is to cut, bash ( yes, as in big hammer ) the areas that rub. I would bet you could run a narrow 31" tire with minimal trimming and no lift. After that, see if there is a locker for it ( Lockright, ect ) and drive the heck out of it.

Stock size is 205/70/r15. Thats around 26.3 inches with a section width of 8.1 inches.

If I go up to 225/75/15s, bumps up to 28.3" diameter and 8.9" section width. 235/75/r15s, the smallest 4x4 mud traction knobbies are 28.9" and section width of 9.3"

As noted, people have reported suspension rubbing issues running the 235s and need a little lift to clear as much of the wheel well as posisble, even with a little bit of trimming and cutting. I don't know what you really mean by narrow 31s, are you referring to the mil style bias plies?

 

[DuneHopper]

Studs, and also think Ice, not just snow. Lift will increase body sway, and well ice and snow both do not like that, as well the original suspension will still exist somewhat making it highly unstable. Id try and leave it as it sits and go studs since you do not want chains.

 

[DirectDrive]

Lifting that rig would be in violation of Man Law #17 Section 3

With a small motor especially, you have to watch TIRE WEIGHT when upgrading tires from stock.
You don't want to burden a small motor with having to turn heavy tires.
Also, tire noise. Don't unknowingly volunteer for tire noise just because you like a tread pattern.
Choose wisely.

And when moving to a tire that is beyond stock, your tire inflation rate in your glove box is now meaningless.
You have to do the CHALK TEST to determine proper inflation.

DD
Who is now accepting Bass Pro gift cards as well as the customary Cabela's gift cards for
his excellent internet answers.

 

[Unka-Boo]

BFGoodrich All-Terrain T/A KO2 215/75R15

Ok....solved your problem...

You also have a stupid common bolt pattern, just about every 5 lug half ton truck/jeep cj/samuri/scout used that pattern, which means there is an almost endless supply of wheel sizes and offset to choose from.

 

[USMC1911]

BFGoodrich All-Terrain T/A KO2 215/75R15

Ok....solved your problem...

You also have a stupid common bolt pattern, just about every 5 lug half ton truck/jeep cj/samuri/scout used that pattern, which means there is an almost endless supply of wheel sizes and offset to choose from.

Same thing I recommended. Great tires!

 

[CamoDeafie]

So it seems general consensus is to focus on the tires first and then see if a lift is really needed, then?
Been doing quite a lot of reading up and researching on tire options.. seems maybe I can get away with going to 205/75s or the 215/75s...
As a side note, my Kia's speedo has never been accurate. It does this. At indicated 40mph on the speedo, the speed traps w the numbers always says 35-36. So 4-5mph slower than indicated.

 

[USMC1911]

I just think most here believe it's a waste of resources/money. Run the tallest tire you can without a lift imo. If 215's fit go for it. 235's would only provide slightly more then 1/2 inch more clearance over the 215's and seems to need a lift per your research. Not something that seems worth the tradeoffs. Sometime less is more.

 

[Camelfilter]

Remember though, if you go upsized tires, you may not be able to run chains if you have wheel well/suspension clearance issues.

Me, I'd just eyeball Craigslist for some take off wheels and a set og Studded snows same size as you run now. Can then throw chains on if needs be. Real chains, not those z springy wire things.