Schweitzerische Schiessstand...

[maddog]

The Swiss also figure that if you are old enough to volunteer to give your life in defence of your country at age 18, then you are probably going to be OK with an alcoholic beverage, too.

tac

There is a lot we could learn from the Swiss.

 

[tac]

The yUK has the same rule re age and drinking alcoholic/spirituous beverages.

Except that you can join the Armed forces at seventeen, but are not allowed to get killed until you are eighteen.

tac

 

[BlackRyder]

Jeez, if we're going to adopt Euro-policies and procedures, why can't we have a few of those over here, instead of bringing over the crap ideas we currently do? Especially having a place to grab a cold one right there on-site.

Or their attitude regarding silencers!

 

[tac]

Here in yUK they have to be entered on your FAC but they are never refused.

If they are for an airgun they can be bought over the counter without any paperwork at all.

tac

 

[tac]

OK, guys and gals - this is LONG, but necessary, I think - please read it IF you are seriously interested in how the Swiss 'do' guns.

Quote -

I live in Switzerland. Although we have a high gun ownership it's not only because of the militia. The most important thing about Swiss gun ownership is this:

Militia gun ownership ≠ Civilian gun ownership

Just because the Militia can't or can do, doesn't mean that civilians have to follow the same rules, I noticed that many people think that all guns in Switzerland belong to the army and that nobody owns random guns like AKs and AR15s or even pistols, this is not true since anyone can easily buy all sorts of guns. Many people will read Wikipedia and see this phrase:

In October 2007, the Swiss Federal Council decided that the distribution of ammunition to soldiers shall stop and that all previously issued ammo shall be returned. By March 2011, more than 99% of the ammo has been received. Only special rapid deployment units and the military police still store ammunition at home today.

This only applies to the free ammo that you used to receive. This does not mean that ammo is restricted or forbidden.

You don't have to keep the rifle after finishing the army, you can decide to keep it or not. While in the army, your rifle is not your possession, it only becomes your possession once you apply for a permit to get the rifle.

Here's our gun laws summed up:

• We can own all the ammo we want. The ammo restrictions only apply to ammo bought at the range because this ammo is subsidized by the Swiss government. Anyone can go to a gun store and buy all the ammo he wants with a background check and store it at home.
• Open carry is not common in Switzerland. Since you can only go to the range and back home without any detours. So those pictures of a guy on a supermarket with his rifle or in that apple store? Totally illegal, since they took a detour.
• <broken link removed> (estimated to be around 3 million) in Switzerland are the current issue Stgw 90. These 260k belong to former militia members or people that bought them at gun shops, so these guns belong to civilians.
• Around 50% of all guns in Switzerland are former militia guns such as K31s, K11s, Stgw 57, P210, P220, Stgw 90 and so on. The rest are guns bought by normal people as part of sports, hunting or collection.
• Owning guns is not hard if you have no criminal records.
• Anyone can own certain bolt action rifles (chambered in hunting calibers) and break action shotguns with just a background check or a WES (permit) not older than 2 years plus an ID. Bolt actions chambered in calibers like .338 LM and .50 require a permit.
• Semi auto guns can only be bought with a <broken link removed> which takes 5 minutes to fill and you just need to send it to the police and wait 1-2 weeks. This permit consists of entering your personal info and what types of guns you are buying.
• You only need to provide a justification for owning a semi auto gun if you are buying it for other purpose other than sports, hunting or collecting.
• Owning guns for self defense is very hard and you have to prove that your life is really in danger.
• Since guns for self defense are rare, you cannot buy hollow points unless you are a hunter. Armor piercing ammo is also restricted, and since using FMJ ammo for self defense is not a very good idea, it makes little sense to get a gun for self defense unless you also want to hit your neighbors.
• Immigrants are generally allowed to own guns as long as they have the B or C residents permit.
• Immigrants from countries such as Sri Lanka, Albania, Turkey, Kosovo, Serbia, Bosnia and Montenegro (there might be a couple more) are not allowed to own guns (an exception might be made but it's hard to get one according to a friend from Serbia).
• The background checks are not done on the spot. You have to order one online or by going to the post office. After paying 20 Swiss Francs you receive a background check per mail, this background check can only be used for two months when buying a gun.
• It's not mandatory to own a gun and the army rifle is not free.
• Gun rights in Switzerland are protected by law.
• Silencers/Suppressors and laser sights are restricted and can only be bought with the same special permit that you fill to get Full Auto guns.
• You can take the army rifle home or leave it at the armory.
• The army rifle is converted to semi auto only after finishing the militia.
• Sports shooting is very popular in Switzerland that's why we have a high gun ownership (the people in the militia don't count to the gun ownership because their rifles are not their possession)
• Concealed carry licenses are EXTREMELY hard to get. You have to prove that your life or the life of other people is in danger, or that you need a gun for your job. After getting the permit you have to pass a written and practical examination, the permit is valid for 5 years.
• There are no psychological tests in order to own a gun in Switzerland.
• You can own as many guns as you like with all the ammo you want, there are no "assault weapons" ban, no short barrel rifle restrictions and full auto guns can be bought with a special license.

How to get a bolt action rifle or a break action shotgun in Switzerland:

• Request Strafregisterauszug (background check) from this page
• After paying 20 Swiss Francs
• Go to a gun shop and browse these guns
• Show this background check + ID
• Pay for the rifle/rifles and all the ammo you want

How to get a semi-auto or quick repeating gun (including pistols, revolvers, pump action shotguns and lever action guns):

• Request Strafregisterauszug (background check) from this page
• After paying 20 Swiss Francs
• Fill out the <broken link removed>
• Send it either by mail or personally to the police station (depends on the region)
• Pay 50 Swiss Francs
• After two weeks it arrives by mail
• Go to a gun shop and browse the type of guns that you applied for
• Show the background check + ID and the permit
• Pay for the guns and all the ammo you want

And most importantly:

• The vast majority of gun owners don't own guns for self defense (a small amount people do but they have to have a very good reason), we don't own guns to fight the government. We see guns as tools that provide a lot of fun and food.

While we have widespread gun ownership among the civilian population, our culture and gun culture is somewhat different.

The amount of guns in Switzerland is around 3 million including illegal guns, the current Stgw 90 only makes around 260k of all these weapons though (and these are in the possession of former militia members or civilians). The rest are either civilian bought guns or the old militia issued rifles that are now in the possession of former militia members and civilians.

Just to show how easy it is to get a bolt action rifle, one of the "free weapons". I walked into a gun shop 30 minutes ago, showed my ID, an old WES (permit that I had used to get another weapons 1 year ago) and bought a rifle without any problems.

The myth:

People from all over the world think that Switzerland has extremely strict gun ownership laws due to a flawed "study" done by some people about our supposed gun laws called "Switzerland and Israel are not gun toting utopias". This study managed to convince many people that we have the following restrictions:

• The police will check up your guns once in a while
• You can't transport guns without a permit
• You can only own a handgun for 6 months, after that you will have to apply for another permit
• Ammo is not allowed
• The state doesn't encourage gun ownership
• You need to state a reason for owning a gun in Switzerland and you need training to own one

This is all false and basically these are lies spread by people with an agenda.

For anyone curious there is a nice documentary about Swiss gun ownership on Youtube. You can check it out here:

Swiss Gun Ownership - The Real Story

Thanks for reading.

tac

 

[BlackRyder]

Thanks, Tac. That was a very interesting read... Seems like they have a pretty healthy attitude towards guns over there in Switzerland.
I've read that in Germany silencers are over the counter items, and that it is actually considered poor etiquette to shoot unsupressed.. Do you know anything about this?.

 

[tac]

Thanks, Tac. That was a very interesting read... Seems like they have a pretty healthy attitude towards guns over there in Switzerland.
I've read that in Germany silencers are over the counter items, and that it is actually considered poor etiquette to shoot unsupressed.. Do you know anything about this?.

Never heard of that, not moving in the rather exalted circles in which the German Jaegerherren operate.

Here in crowded little UK there are many areas of land where shooting [called a 'permission because it's a, uh, permission] is actively encouraged by the land-owner where the use of a mod, especially at night, is actually a condition of the permission.

As with much that can be found on the internetty [pun for those of you here from NE England], there is a crumb of truth in what you have written. They ARE available over the counter, but not over the internetty or by mail-order. You have to do the deal face-to-face with your Waffenerlaunbnis/Waffenschein/Jagdschein in your paw at the time of the transaction, so that the dealer can assure himself that you have the right to purchase and own such a device.

As an aside, I'm afraid that, by and large, etiquette and I are strangers with only a passing nod between us.

tac