Powder measures

[ma96782]

That's not the way I understand it.. I believe most competitive/winning accuracy shooters (benchrest etc.) measure their charges and have been doing so for decades.
And as for rifle vs pistol weighing of charges, 1/10gr of 5gr is much more than 1/10gr of 25 or 100 on a ratio basis.
As you can probably surmise, I just throw my charges with a measure. lol

When you say "measure their charges" did you mean......powder is thrown from a powder measure and that's it? No trickle?

++++++

While at the range I use to see the "extreme accuracy shooters" using their already loaded re-loaded ammo.

When testing their ammo......they have their ammo arranged in ladder testing fashion in their ammo box. It's clearly marked. When they are shooting a "practice session," the ammo in the box is the same.

It's been my experience/observation (watching and listening).......that most extreme accuracy shooters (that I've encountered) are "___a___" about their routine when loading ammo. It's all about consistency. EXACTLY.....GETTING EVERYTHING THE SAME. Same case lot #, same bullet lot #, primers from the same lot number# and powder from same lot # were used to produce the ammo. And don't forget about weights: bullets, cases (sometimes, even volume) and powder charges.

Change one component or lot# and it's back to testing again.

So anyway, loading it at home (or their club house, whatever) with a thrown charge and final trickle on the scale to get the weight JUST RIGHT, has an advantage of NO WIND to affect a scale. With the electronics of today....it's even easier than before. IIRC...even the Army's Marksmanship Unit does it.

Yup, I've also noted BR shooters that re-load at the range. They drop powder. But, I don't usually see them messing with the adjustment knob. If they did....they had a scale to check their work. Weigh every powder drop.....OK, some were really particular, some were not. Then, I'd bet that they were confident with their powder throwing technique. But, windy conditions and a scale......that's no fun......maybe that's the reason. Humm.....maybe, they should think of a different re-loading strategy? OK...but, I can see their logic too. It's only a couple of rounds.

So of course, you can do whatever you want and however you want to do it.

Mind you that, I like accuracy too. But, it ain't like I'm about to spend all my time making ammo with that much attention to the details (i.e. weighing powder for every single round).

Maybe, it's just in how I define the term, "extreme accuracy shooters," Versus how you see them?

Anyway....who cares? I suspect that, it might be, mostly only them. And, their competitors.

LOL.....I'm nowhere close to what they achieve. And that's fine by me.

Aloha, Mark

 

[Crohnos01]

Personally I don't see the need for a micro adjuster? Settle the powder by working the handle a few times (Thunk-thunk) How many clicks equals how much powder weight? I'll let my fingers do the work, you got to measure the throw and adjust accordingly anyway?

I use the Uniflow. For pistol I will say that the small drum is mandatory. I started with the large and it was more difficult to dial into perfection. I also use the RCBS 5-0-5 scale, can't bring myself to trust an electronic. I don't bother with baffles or a weights. Usually I'll fill the hopper about half full, "thunk-thunk". Most times I do 100 at a time and with the half full hopper my throws, I believe, are consistently .1g +/-. I eyeball the exact spot where the lines meet on that scale every 10th-16th throw. Consistency with the "thunk-thunk", and as you measure every so many throws the tiniest turn, in-out should keep you really close. Just for the heck of it, when your the line on the scale arm is only half a line above the other, see how much it takes trickling out of the pan to bring you exactly lined up.

I hear you and agree actually even though I am currently using a micro adjuster. I only have one because it came with a bunch of other used Hornady stuff I bought at a gun show. I loaded for years without one and if I was doing precision loads, would set the thrower to .5 grains below my desired charge weight and trickle in the exact charge on the scale. I too don't trust digital anything... I bought a new caliper not too long ago and bought a analog dial... I just feel better knowing that I am not relying on a battery and electronics to measure my case length or whatever.

That being said I stepped up to the RCBS chargemaster a year or two back and cross checked every charge on my 505 scale for probably the first 200 rounds, then backed off to every 15th or so round, but, honestly I don't think I have found a single charge that was off enough I could see the difference on the balance beam scale.

 

[mjbskwim]

On the digital scales, I was trying to find some info years ago about the best ones and one writer said the $100 ones are every bit as accurate as the $30 ones. Yes I have that in the correct order,lol.
With my little MEC? scale I'll weigh the brass,fill with powder,weigh that then trickle if I'm loading for precision.
The fun part is if the load is a couple tenths heavy I'll dump a few granuals out then weigh again. So I dump say 10 granuals out,it goes to a light load. Then when I trickle load it I put more back in to get it to weight. So my scale ain't perfect
I'm going to just start using the manual scale .
All I am trying to accomplish here is get within a grain for plinking. I do trickle charge if I am doing hunting loads.
As for separating bullets by weight,my American is shooting consistent one hole groups so I'll pass on the extras for now.
I just want a little more consistency in the throws for my plinking..
I'll try a more consistent technique
Thanks for all the info and ideas. Please keep 'em coming for others
Mike

 

[Crohnos01]

I bought a cheap digital scale from Cabelas a number of years ago. It worked fine for awhile, but then started being very inconsistent after a couple of years when checked against the balance beam.... Needless to say, it didn't help mitigate my phobia of electronic tools in reloading

 

[Goosebrown]

Have the Redding competition and it's amazing. Very accurate.

However the RCBS charge master blows it away. Electronic dispensing is better in every regard except for measuring bullseye which is so fine it jams the charge master.

 

[Goosebrown]

Redding has the best trickler too. Very heavy and stable.

 

[Mikej]

I bought a cheap digital scale from Cabelas a number of years ago. It worked fine for awhile, but then started being very inconsistent after a couple of years when checked against the balance beam.... Needless to say, it didn't help mitigate my phobia of electronic tools in reloading

That's the thing....There's nothing to make my balance beam go bad in the middle of loading. Check it with some weights at the beginning and basically it gets checked throughout the loading process. How many rounds will you have in a session if an electronic decides to go wonky?

 

[Josh89]

I picked up a Lee perfect powder measure today.i have a Lee drum measure that works with the powder thru dies but didn't really care for that to much.but anyways the perfect powder measure seems to work pretty good.ive only done a 100 rounds with it but they were all pretty much right on the money for my 9mm load with titegroup.sure was a lot quicker than using my scales for each charge.

 

[ma96782]

OH....OK....

Pistols (and non precision rifle) loading......I put empty cases in a loading block. Say, 10 x 10 or 10 x 5 (or whatever). The powder measure is mounted and the loading block is brought to it.

I simply place the block (w/one case at a time) under the powder measure's mouth. I operate the handle (trying to keep the movement of the handle operation consistent ). Technique. So, a single handle operation, to every empty case. Left to right, 1st line of 10,* When I'm done with that line, it's on to the 2nd line of 10. Repeat, until I've done all of the cases in the loading block.

Now to check the dropped powder weights.....

Being that the loading block is arranged in 10's ....well ok. I'll check the powder weight of every 10th charge. The last one on the right (I'm right handed). Simple.

WEIGH IT (that 10th check case on every line). I start with the case located at the top right corner. When done (assuming that it's OK) the powder gets poured back into the empty case. And the case is replaced back into the loading block. That line of 10 cases are GTG. Then, it's on to the 20th check case (second line down, extreme right)..... Repeat the process until the loading block is done.

But, say that a problem occurs (for example).....

If the 30th check case weight is "OFF." Aka: OUT of my comfort zone. **Recycle the line of cases after the last check case that was GTG (the 20th in this example). AND, recycle all of the cases until the beginning of the next "check case." That would be until the 49th. You're back to checking again with the 50th. Continue with the check weight process from there. See the logic?

Why/What could have gone wrong?

Maybe....you got "froggy" with your technique during powder dropping? Or maybe, the lock on your powder measure got somehow unlocked or something? If that were the situation, maybe you should recycle EVERY case after the problem was discovered? Humm.....whatever....you figure it out and take appropriate action(s).

For me.....only precision ammo (and for EXTREME ACCURACY loads).....will get their powder drop individually weighed and trickle powder either added or subtracted (if needed). To bring it to EXACTNESS.

It would be a PIA to weigh every charge for pistol ammo. Yup, I use a lot of it. Even my 2700 Match ammo and Hi-Power Match ammo was made that way (checking every 10th charge). Until, I went to a progressive press (for my pistol ammo). That's me.

The AMU (I've heard) weighs every charge for every round of Hi-Power ammo. It's about their willingness to spend the extra dedication and effort.......for WINNING!

BTW, that disk measure, is what my Lee M1000 progressive machine uses to drop powder. It's works good enough for my production pistol ammo. And YES, I still do weight checks of powder.

Hope this helps to speed things up.

*Whatever...you're the boss. Stop here and do a weight check if you like to do it that way. I don't like switching back and forth from powder drop to weight checking mode after only 10 powder drops.

**Recycle means = powder gets thrown back into the hopper and cases set to the side. They will be used with the next batch. You don't want to put them back into the loading block. You might accidently load them. YES, it could (and has) happen.

Aloha, Mark