Picked up a ZiP 22 on Friday! New, very weird little pistol from USFA.

[SIG383]

I want one, just for the sake of having one!! So, one mounted under an AR pistol would be legit without being considered an SBR, right? I would hope so since we can't have them in Washington.

 

[jmurray192]

Yes a ARPistol is not a SBR so the zip22 would fall under a pistol also if mounted. If there is a will there is a way

 

[Nwcid]

On a "pistol" puts you in an interesting position that I do not have an answer for.

One of the defining features of a pistol is "a single downward grip". By adding a second downward grip it no long meets the definition so it would become an AOW (also an NFA item).

The ATF has ruled the Magpul AFG is NOT a downward grip and IS legal to be used on handguns without changing the definition. Also the use of a bipod, which can easily be gripped, is not illegal on a handgun. Since this gun is not a traditionally gripped handgun it MIGHT be legal. It might be legal with a flush fit mag but maybe not with stick mag. I don't know, but considering the possible $250,000 fine/20 year jail term and the fun of dealing with the ATF I would make sure first.

I do know that if you mounted a traditional handgun under your handgun AR it would create an AOW.

 

[jmurray192]

Ok ill do the work then. I will write ATF with these questions and get the correct legal stand point. Be awhile for a response but we will know. It has to be a written letter no emails

 

[EJ20Legacy]

Yes very true. But building my AR15 pistol with no butt stock on it will do me just fine. I hope

EDIT: Whoops! Didn't see there was a page 2 before I responded. I agree with what Nwcid said, but would like to state that I personally do believe the ZiP counts as a second downward/vertical grip. The ZiP is meant to be held in the hand. Therefore, it has a grip. Or, maybe, you could say it is a grip. The grip part of it is perfectly vertical. I don't see getting around AOW rules on this. Worth asking? Sure. ...what I had typed before this edit:

While many people assume that attaching a pistol to another pistol is okay, that may very well not be the case. Attaching a Title 1 handgun to another Title 1 handgun or attaching a flare launcher to a Title 1 handgun, may make it a Title 2 AOW. One reason being that a second 'vertical/downward' pistol grip on a pistol, like a vertical foregrip, makes it an AOW. I could see the ZiP being counted as a vertical second grip.

Anyway it is highly recommended that you do not attach a ZiP to another pistol, either, unless the host firearm is a registered Title 2 firearm (AOW, MG, SBR, SBS).

That thing looks like some sort of futuristic staple gun.

And all this time I thought my H&K P7 looked like a staple gun

 

[EJ20Legacy]

Made another video while I "field stripped" the thing. Added it to the first post...

 

[cwegga]

I thought it was kinda funny! BUT... of the many dozens of comments I have gotten on the couple of forums that I visit, plus the comments on YouTube so far, you are the FIRST person to mention that. I told my wife and she said, "you're ret@rded." hahahaha.... so... Glad to hear somebody thought it was funny besides me

Oh, I noticed and laughed too...I just chuckled and moved on.

 

[EJ20Legacy]

So the thing is, so far, a complete and total jam-o-matic. If you want my full analysis of why, read the description for the "range review" video I put up, which is really just a video of me showing how I clear failures to eject and failures to feed over and over

The short version is: it needs a dedicated ejector.

USFA ZiP 22 LR Pistol -- Range Test & Review - YouTube

 

[Sgt Nambu]

Wow! It appears to be the perfect tool for jam clearing exercises, all right! Thanks for the info. Nice, well focused video, by the way!

 

[ls2gto]

So the thing is, so far, a complete and total jam-o-matic. If you want my full analysis of why, read the description for the "range review" video I put up, which is really just a video of me showing how I clear failures to eject and failures to feed over and over

The short version is: it needs a dedicated ejector.

USFA ZiP 22 LR Pistol -- Range Test & Review - YouTube

Dang that sucks! Too bad it doesn't shoot well, its a cool little gun!

 

[jmurray192]

WOHHHHH!!!!! hold on here. This gun is not a complete jam o matic and it is not crap. I shot mine and have had some jams but the company completely explains all over there website and all over there info that comes with the gun that the mag needs to have the upgraded spring when using the bx25. The only thing they did wrong is not include the spring with the gun. Given its not a CC gun but it is a fun gun.


Also keep in mind MOST .22 hand guns require CCI rounds and will only function with them. And almost everygun will not function right out of the box. On the same day I took out 5 other brand new guns, 3 sigs, 1 keltec, 1 glock they all at one point had a non extract.

 

[jmurray192]

Talked to the creater and ceo of zip today. Really nice guy. Confirmed that they run flawless with cci. Also stated the bx25 will not run correctly unless the correct spring is installed which will be released in 1 month. Told me to run the standerd 10 round mags until upgrade is released. Guys got to keep in mind its brand new. When ever u buy a new released gun your basically a tester. Doesnt matter which company it is

 

[jluck]

When ever u buy a new released gun your basically a tester. Doesnt matter which company it is

I disagree. A little R&D goes a long way, It should be done long before packaging IMO. I don't want to be a test "dummy". I'm not buying crap because it's new. YMMV.

 

[jmurray192]

R&D yes is needed but real world tests are the only way to perfect somthing. Think of it like a car. Same thing. I bought a 2012 honda civic SI. New car big issues. It takes awhile for a company to perfect something. Even honda the most dependable maker (not trying to get into a car debate) Another example is the glock gen4. Most glock owners wouldnt take a gen 4 because its to new. They have a death grip on there gen 3's. I would agree with you though R&D is needed.

 

[Burt Gummer]

It looks like a lot of fun, looking forward to hearing more about it.

 

[jmurray192]

Taken apart and lubed up. Decided to lube against manufactors recommendations.

 

[Sgt Nambu]

Sorry, to ugly, to weird, and my S&W eats, and has always eaten everything. Not getting why someone would even design this thing, the other .22 auto pistols on the market didn't work?

 

[Certaindeaf]

It's hard to disguise your Model 41 as a book-end, that's why.

 

[Mutoman]

There are a couple of vids on YouTube of the gun being shot. Looks pretty disheartening. Reminds me of my old Jennings that stove-piped and jambed every shot. Hopefully someone will find an ammo/mag combo that actually works with these!

 

[chemist]

Still, the idea of "Gun Inception," where you have a gun for your gun, is pretty cool from the standpoint of an always-ready backup.
But ugly? Butt ugly! Boy howdy - somebody finally claimed the crown from Hi-Point.