Oregon Oregon HB4145 - M114 Implementation bill for 2026 Session

[ilikegunspdx]

HB 4145 replaces M114 but cannot proceed until after the Oregon supremes make a decision. If they rule against us, the requirements of HB 4145 become law. If they rule with the constitution, then all of it gets dropped.

Think of it this way: There is a law that allows slavery but it's been appealed so can't go into effect. If the supreme law of the land decides that slavery is unconstitutional, they can't just make a new law since the concept of slavery is illegal, no matter how many laws they make saying that it's legal.

Actually imo they can make a new (illegal) law and they will I'm sure. They'll tie it to state commerce and call it "new". That's what WA has been doing imo. It will improve our position in future cases though of course if or Supreme Court rules for us.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

HB 4145 replaces M114 but cannot proceed until after the Oregon supremes make a decision. If they rule against us, the requirements of HB 4145 become law. If they rule with the constitution, then all of it gets dropped.

Think of it this way: There is a law that allows slavery but it's been appealed so can't go into effect. If the supreme law of the land decides that slavery is unconstitutional, they can't just make a new law since the concept of slavery is illegal, no matter how many laws they make saying that it's legal.

That makes sense thanks. So their new pending law is their "new and improved m114" essentially?

 

[CamoDeafie]

I don't think mag ban in Duncan v bonta would affect m114. OR Supreme Court rules on OR constitution not federal. But maybe they would say "on hold until bonta is figured out". I really doubt that though. But it's possible. Who knows.

If immerguts hold is still in effect then she can wipe it out with a stroke if a pen I would think. And she wants to wipe it out imo.

I'm trying to figure out on the state constitution track only. How does the new bill and m114 overlap, what overrides what, etc.

Federally, the case is in limbo at the 9th District pending Duncan V Bonta.

If Duncan V Bonta gets decided and hopefully it says standard capacity mags are arms and cannot be banned if there's so many of them (in common use nationally)...then there's nothing Oregon State Supreme can do to uphold the mag ban itself. Only the purchase permit system.

But if SCOTUS GVR or deny cert to Duncan V Bonta....then we are well and truly screwed nationally.


Edit. The only thing federally that I can see being upheld regardless, is the permit to purchase schemes, as several States (coughs Illinois coughs) have it in one form or other.

 

[PiratePast40]

If the Oregon Supreme rule against us, and Dens don't pass 4145, it'll be a hot mess. The permit won't be available but will be required.

 

[Midnite]

If the Oregon Supreme rule against us, and Dens don't pass 4145, it'll be a hot mess. The permit won't be available but will be required.

Going to be a lot of theoretical law put to practice at that point.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

Federally, the case is in limbo at the 9th District pending Duncan V Bonta.

If Duncan V Bonta gets decided and hopefully it says standard capacity mags are arms and cannot be banned if there's so many of them (in common use nationally)...then there's nothing Oregon State Supreme can do to uphold the mag ban itself. Only the purchase permit system.

But if SCOTUS GVR or deny cert to Duncan V Bonta....then we are well and truly screwed nationally.


Edit. The only thing federally that I can see being upheld regardless, is the permit to purchase schemes, as several States (coughs Illinois coughs) have it in one form or other.

FYI the reason I don't want to include bonta is it's too much of an unknown. For ex. Will it be heard in the next 10 years?, ever?

If SCOTUS takes up the mag ban or AWB then it's worth paying attention to but prior to that it's wasted time imo.

Contrast that with OR Supreme Court and m114 issues. That is actively being considered right now. And we may have a decision in 1-9 months.

 

[CamoDeafie]

FYI the reason I don't want to include bonta is it's too much of an unknown. For ex. Will it be heard in the next 10 years?, ever?

If SCOTUS takes up the mag ban or AWB then it's worth paying attention to but prior to that it's wasted time imo.

FWIW, it's still being listed for conference at SCOTUS. However many times until either Grant or Deny Cert. I'm betting on deny, or GVR. Until then, the Federal M114 case is in limbo at the 9th District. If (a big if) the SCOTUS deny cert to Bonta, and the 9th just plain deny the appeal of the M114, then it falls to the Oregon Supremes.

Contrast that with OR Supreme Court and m114 issues. That is actively being considered right now. And we may have a decision in 1-9 months.

But if Oregon Supremes rules in favor of State, and the SCOTUS strikes down mag ban .....?

 

[ilikegunspdx]

…
But if Oregon Supremes rules in favor of State, and the SCOTUS strikes down mag ban .....?

I'm not gonna worry or consider something that appears unlikely to happen and indeed may never happen. If scotus takes up the case I will think differently. I don't like discussing whether and when the earth will be hit by comets either ha ha.

 

[64MercurysRule]

 

[ilikegunspdx]

View attachment 2257495

I hope that not a live view from the space station!

 

[Seven5]

Seems like another performative political stunt.

 

[CamoDeafie]

I'm not gonna worry or consider something that appears unlikely to happen and indeed may never happen. If scotus takes up the case I will think differently. I don't like discussing whether and when the earth will be hit by comets either ha ha.

The only thing like I said that I think will be a given to happen in Oregon with regard to M114.... Is that permit to purchase would be ruled "constitutional" for both State and Federal cases. It's only the mag ban that is a questionable thing, simply due to Duncan V Bonta being listed for conference at the SCOTUS, still. It's one thing for them to deny cert (which has happened to a lot of 2A cases lately), and another to keep relisting for conference.... Although the fact that SCOTUS did GVR it once....means that this could be the second time they consider it, but there seems to be a few significant cases where a case was GVR'd more than once before being denied or heard

 

[CamoDeafie]

Seems like another performative political stunt.

How do you mean? Measure 114 is still on the books, on hold pending whatever Oregon Supreme Court decides (they heard oral arguments last fall of 2025), and potentially pending 9th Circus relating to Duncan V Bonta..but there's a high likelihood of Oregon Supremes deciding in favor of State simply because of who's on the bench (all D appointees), even if Raschio's ruling is robust with citations from Oregon Supreme Courts own case history , Oregon Constitution text, tradition, and timeframe (when Oregon became a State, technology of firearms and the like).

 

[AshWilliams]

The only thing like I said that I think will be a given to happen in Oregon with regard to M114.... Is that permit to purchase would be ruled "constitutional" for both State and Federal cases....

correct me if I'm wrong, but M114 has already been ruled constitutional by Immergut at the federal level, so everything hinges on OSC's ruling.

 

[CamoDeafie]

correct me if I'm wrong, but M114 has already been ruled constitutional by Immergut at the federal level, so everything hinges on OSC's ruling.

And it got appealed to the 9th District, where it is in limbo pending Duncan V Bonta

 

[1911Fanatic]

Isn't that just a thumb print?

I've had so many FBI checks because of security clearances that I'm not worried about what they do with the dozens of sets my prints. State agencies - that's a whole different animal, and I believe we have reason to be concerned when states are run by deranged individuals.

Yeah, anybody that has ever served in the military, well they already have your prints.

 

[Nutty4Guns]

Yeah, anybody that has ever served in the military, well they already have your prints.

And DNA

 

[Librarian]

Although the fact that SCOTUS did GVR it once....means that this could be the second time they consider it, but there seems to be a few significant cases where a case was GVR'd more than once before being denied or heard

I sure hope the SCOTUS actually takes up Duncan; last GVR was a hot mess in the 9th.

 

[1911Fanatic]

And DNA

Probably, but DNA really wasn't a thing when I enlisted. 1980's.

 

[gearhead]

And DNA

Is that why Doc was shining a black light in my rack?