medical marijuana question

[Blindpig]

I have a family member who has a medical card (doesn't like opiods) she is on the registry but wants a cwp. I told her to not answer 'yes' on the portion of her form that asks if she is addicted to marijuana, which she is not. Can the state (Washington) deny her cwp for having the medical authorization? I have called the local sheriff's office and the attorney general's office and neither can answer the question. Because she is a registered medical marijuana patient, will that affect her? Any info is appreciated. Thanks Blindpig

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[papersoldier]

First off, I am not a lawyer, and none of the following should be construed as legal advise.

If you take a look at the application form (link here, PDF warning) for a Washington CPL you'll find that one of the questions is:

"Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana, or any depressant, stimulant, or narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?"

(note that this question asks about unlawful use and not only about addiction as you seemed to indicate in your post)

While marijuana is legal to possess and use in Washington, it is still considered an illegal narcotic under federal law. For this reason, if you were to mark "yes" on this question while filling out a standard form 4473 a store owner would be unable to sell you a firearm even if you live in a state that has legalized the use of marijuana.

With the above in mind, and since your family member uses marijuana the answer to the aforementioned question is "yes" since marijuana use is still federally illegal, and federal laws supersede state laws when they conflict (according to the Supremacy Clause of the Constitution).

 

[DB is Here]

Database Frequently Asked Questions

Database Frequently Asked Questions How do I

www.doh.wa.gov

 

[P7M13]

Disclaimer: I am not an attorney.
Medical Marijuana is a prescription. Hence, use of it for medical reasons, with a prescription, does not constitute "unlawful" use. Note, my interpretation conflicts with the link posted by @DB is Here. Below is an excerpt from that link page:

May I purchase a gun if I am a medical marijuana patient in the database?

The medical marijuana authorization database is in no way connected to any other system and does not affect your right to purchase or carry a gun. However, under federal law, marijuana possession is illegal for both recreational and medical use. The federal law affects gun ownership. It is unlawful for a firearms dealer to sell or give a gun to a person who uses or is addicted to a controlled substance that is illegal under federal law.

I would wager, in the CFR, it probably defines the amount that constitutes "possession".

 

[fredball]

I had a customer about a month ago fill out the 4473 for a Pistol transfer and I ask questions of customers to get and Idea who I'm working with and if they should own a firearm
We got to talking and I mentioned that I had read some articals about CBD oil and dogs with Aliergies My Golden Retriever has them and all were positive and he proudly says well I smoke pot to help with pain. So we finished up and I told him i'll call you when I get BGC back from Sheriff , I paid ship his gun back and sent a full refund with a letter saying we are unable to process this transaction you will need to contact vendor you bought gun from.
But in the mean time I did a litte research and local LE don't care that he LIED on the federal form and the ATF don't care although they did say I did the right thing of course I did
Also not a lawyer.

Section 11 letter E. Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana or any depressant, Stimulant, Narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance? Warning: The use or possession of marijuana remains unlawful under Federal law Regardless of whether it has been Legalized or decriminalized For medicinal or recreational purposes in the state where you reside.

Also not a lawyer.

 

[Lilhigbee]

I am not a lawyer either, this is my opinion only.
Since marijuana is illegal at the Federal level I would say the correct answer to the "Are you an illegal user...??" question on a Federal form (4473) is "yes".
Since the CWP/CHL application is a state form and has absolutely no Federal involvement, and since marijuana is considered legal at the state level the correct answer for that form would be "no".

 

[DB is Here]

NWFA is not a legal advice site, so take the answers given with a grain of salt. I'd think asking an FFL or Firearm's Attorney is your best course of action.

 

[Knebel]

Its also some sort of "interpretation" I guess. Lets say you smoked a joint 20 years ago, that doesn't make you an unlawful user at the time of purchase, but it made you one 20 years ago. I would say that the way its worded is asking about current activities. One really has to pay attention to the wordings on any government forms and answer truthfully to the best of their knowledge. However, with a potcard the answer is YES.

I personally wouldn't agree that the occasional pot smoker should be barred from purchasing a firearm... I mean, it could also ask about drinking alcohol, ever unlawfully consumed alcohol?. Whats real bad is when the firearm is operated while high or drunk, seen both, don't wanna see it again. Anyway, gotta be honest about it, and if the person says "oh yeah i smoke pot" that would also mean YES to that question. Does the person say "I used to smoke pot 20 years ago" id say that answer then is NO. it asks "ARE YOU..." not "WERE YOU..."

 

[Blindpig]

Thanks for the help. Just an FYI: I asked the AG's office if having a CWP first and then getting a medical authorization nullified the CWP their answer was: I don't know, I should know that. Anyway, thanks for the information

 

[User 1234]

NWFA is not a legal advice site, so take the answers given with a grain of salt. I'd think asking an FFL or Firearm's Attorney is your best course of action.

There are many, many FFLs who give bad advice. I would not ask any FFLs for legal advice.

 

[Blindpig]

I get the cya stuff, I was just looking for opinions and/or first hand experience. Thanks, love this site.

 

[turbo_vanner]

having a medical card doesn't necessarily mean someone uses marijuana. A card holder could easily stop using 'illegal' substances for a time, and end their 'addiction' prior to filling out a 4473. Then answering 'no' is an honest and legal answer, as far as I can tell. I'm no lawyer either though. The form doesn't ask if you have used or plan on using in the future.

 

[slickshot223]

If you want the real answer call the ATF

 

[EHJ]

Opinion Only:

The crime would be - falsely filing the federal form for a weapon transfer.

An FFL transfer...

Not possession of a legal firearm - but the false information given on the form for 'the transfer' of said firearm.

Not a, 'can't have' situation... more like a, 'can't transfer' situation.

I'm not a lawyer. But my family is full of them. Good ones and shifty ones..

"The 'spirit' of the law may lead one to think that all-out possession is illegal - but the details indicated/required on ATF Form 4473 don't define requirements for possession - just transfer."

FPS Russia got caught for possession - but his firearms privileges were revoked (and tossed in jail) for the false information on his forms. FWIW.

 

[bbbass]

NWFA is not a legal advice site, so take the answers given with a grain of salt. I'd think asking an FFL or Firearm's Attorney is your best course of action.

If you want the real answer call the ATF

Ask 10 diff FFLs and you'll get 10 diff answers.

Ask the 10 diff people at the ATF, and you will get 10 diff answers, then another 5 diff answers as they change their minds.

Ask 10 diff lawyers and you will get 20 diff answers.

 

[nwslopoke]

Has anyone heard of any actions outside of being denied by the FFL? It doesn't appear the Feds are actually tracking pot smokers buying through legal transactions. If a person doesn't have a record for pot there's no way to know outside of your words.

 

[Flymph]

In Oregon there is a supreme court verdict of shall issue of the permit to medical users, but technically federal laws differ. The interesting part is there is no such state verdict to allow for the acquisition or possession of firearms. In any case, the federal law technically has superiority over state laws.
Technically you told her to commit perjury, but it's not like they'll really care as they don't seem to go after people for that on 4473's.
Yeah, it's dumb, but it is what it is... for now!
Also not a lawyer.

 

[Knebel]

Again, its asking if you are "RIGHT NOW" an unlawful user. Medical card or not shouldn't matter. Answer truthfully.

 

[Keepmsharp]

The constitution says the right of the people to own and bear arms shall not be infringed. That makes any law prohibiting ownership of firearms illegal.

 

[SCARed]

Back when it was first legalized someone in Woodland I think, got denied for a CHL because if their MJ card. It went to court, but I dont remember the outcome.