I HATE Varget!

[daved20319]

Was loading up some more test rounds for my .223 Savage bolt gun tonight, since I have a couple of pounds of Varget and I'm focusing on "precision" rounds with heavier match grade bullets, I figured I should do some Varget loads. Terrible stuff to work with! Doesn't meter worth a hoot, bulky as my second wife, I'd barely gotten started and was already having trouble with case fill. Did come up with a solution, though. I have an electric engraver I've had for years and rarely used, mostly because it's noisy as hell and the vibration puts my hand to sleep. But it was just the ticket, turn it on, rest the case on it, and pour the powder in. Settled it right in, I had almost no crunch even with the max load. I'll be glad when this is gone, I don't plan on buying any more. Of course, having said that, I'ver probably guaranteed that those loads will be ragged one-holers at 2 miles . Okay, rant ended, later.

Dave

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[DizzyJ]

Bummer. I love it.

Try using a funnel with a long drop. You'll find the powder packs a lot more easily.

 

[Goosebrown]

I love varget, but not for .223.

Don't use a powder throw for precision loads.

Get a charge master. Metering extruded powder won't be a problem.

 

[Mygrainman]

I feel the same way about Unique... it like working with cornflakes.
Im down to my last half pound and it's all tightgroup for my pistols from now on.
Love those ball powders
CFE BLK
H335
Tightgroup
Are my go to's... all easy to work with and I can reload for most all my guns with those 3.

 

[bsa1917hunter]

I personally wouldnt use varget for my 223 loads. AR comp has me spoiled at the moment. Just drop the charge in the case from my uni-flo and go. I can load 300 rounds/hour on a single stage press without breaking a sweat. H335 and BLC2 is the same way. I dont know how precise you want your "precision" hand loads to be, but the way i do it, i shoot consistent sub moa 10 shot groups with my AR. My newest rifle, which is a savage bolt action" shot an average of .8xx" 10 shot groups with some mild loads thrown together, in the same fashion, for a different rifle using H335. Tonight ill start working on some loads specifically for my new rifle. Wish i had some cfe223 powder, but will probably just try ar comp for starters. No sense in making loading any harder than it needs to be.

 

[ageingstudent]

I personally wouldnt use varget for my 223 loads. AR comp has me spoiled at the moment. Just drop the charge in the case from my uni-flo and go. I can load 300 rounds/hour on a single stage press without breaking a sweat. H335 and BLC2 is the same way. I dont know how precise you want your "precision" hand loads to be, but the way i do it, i shoot consistent sub moa 10 shot groups with my AR. My newest rifle, which is a savage bolt action" shot an average of .8xx" 10 shot groups with some mild loads thrown together, in the same fashion, for a different rifle using H335. Tonight ill start working on some loads specifically for my new rifle. Wish i had some cfe223 powder, but will probably just try ar comp for starters. No sense in making loading any harder than it needs to be.

Interesting, I have had my best results in my 16" AR with those 3 powders out to 200 yards. Just playing with old school iron sights though, not putting the crosshairs on a bugs arse.

OP-- I use varget in my 22-250 it works quite well even if it is tempermental with metering. I have similar issues with 700x in my .38 spec target loads. Still looking for a powder that meters better. Red dot comes close. For some reason 700x gives me outstanding accuracy with the same load out of all three of my S&W revolvers, which is highly irritating since I have to weigh every charge to avoid .5-.9 grain differences in throws. For pistol. Nice shooting clean load too darnit.

 

[308]

Varget/Stick powder does seem to fill the .223 case too quickly and it is difficult to meter out exactly for any load in my experience. I do love it for my top secret .308 load though.

 

[ron]

Varget is one of the worst metering powders I have ever tried. I use a RCBS charge master.
It does shoot very well. For heavy weight bullets 77 and 80 grain bullets it works well. I have
used Varget for many years for my 600 yard 223 80 SMK. Now I get best results from VV N140
for 80s and IMR 8208 XBR for 77smk. 8208 meters nice and I can use a powder thrower.

 

[Mygrainman]

Good to know 8208 meters good. I was afraid it might be a challenge since it is an extruded powder.
I picked some upafter watching Jonny's reloading bench..
He got some great groups out of it while trying to work up a Mk262 77gr OTM load. Didn't have the Velocity of a MK262, but isn't it the groups that count?

 

[jordanka16]

Varget is not fun out of a powder measure. I use it with my charge master and have no trouble. Most of the time I use 8208xbr or TAC in .223 since I'm usually loading on my dillon, they give just as good of performance but they meter a lot better.

 

[bsa1917hunter]

Thats good info for guys loading 223.

 

[daved20319]

Thanks, guys. Just to be clear, I don't use, nor do I intend to use, Varget on a regular basis, for some reason, I ended up with a couple of pounds, and I'm loading some heavier (69, 75, & 77 gr.) bullets for my Savage, so figured this would be a good way to use it up. As I can't shoot right now, I'm just loading up a bunch of test rounds for the next time I can shoot. I much prefer H335 for .223, and the CFE series, although I haven't shot any yet, is also really nice to work with, I've done some test loads for both 9 & .45 ACP with CFE Pistol, as well as CFE 223 for the Savage. And yes, I'll be posting results when I get the chance to shoot some of it. As the only rifle I'm currently loading for, H335 and CFE 223 will likely become my go-to's, although I can't resist experimenting, so will probably try some others in the future. Later.

Dave

 

[bsa1917hunter]

Thanks, guys. Just to be clear, I don't use, nor do I intend to use, Varget on a regular basis, for some reason, I ended up with a couple of pounds, and I'm loading some heavier (69, 75, & 77 gr.) bullets for my Savage, so figured this would be a good way to use it up. As I can't shoot right now, I'm just loading up a bunch of test rounds for the next time I can shoot. I much prefer H335 for .223, and the CFE series, although I haven't shot any yet, is also really nice to work with, I've done some test loads for both 9 & .45 ACP with CFE Pistol, as well as CFE 223 for the Savage. And yes, I'll be posting results when I get the chance to shoot some of it. As the only rifle I'm currently loading for, H335 and CFE 223 will likely become my go-to's, although I can't resist experimenting, so will probably try some others in the future. Later.

Dave

Dave, keep us posted on the progress. Im curious to see how your 1 in 9 twist savage shoots the heavies. I have some 73gr eldm bullets, that i want to try in mine.

 

[ageingstudent]

Varget/Stick powder does seem to fill the .223 case too quickly and it is difficult to meter out exactly for any load in my experience. I do love it for my top secret .308 load though.

I was thinking that might be an option for my .300 savage. If I can find a shorter heavy projectile that will fit and function in a remmington model 81. Still researching that.

 

[ron]

In one of my AR rifles and a buddy's 20" 1/9 barrel we found 69SMK with 25.3 grains of Varget
works well. It was the most accurate load tried in by buddy's 1/9 barrel twist rate AR.
This is the "Accuracy Load" listed in Sierra's load manual for 69 SMK.
The 223 seems to prefer different powders for different bullet weights. For the 69 and heavier
bullets I have found VV N140, Varget and IMR-8208 XBR. In the lighter bullets I like W748
and H335. Love the CFE pistol for 45 acp and 9mm but have not found good results with
CFE 223. Favorite short range load (200 yards) I have found works in 1/9, 1/8 and 1/7 twist
rate barrels. 53 SMK and 26 grains W748. I use Winchester 223 brass. As always check all
recipes with published data. This is my own limited experiences with loading for the 223.

 

[bsa1917hunter]

Good info Ron. As per usual. Well, I went to the fun store (2 in fact) and didn't see any of that 8208 powder. Not even any N140 or CFE223. I did see some AR comp hiding behind a nice Kimber rifle though. I was at Coastal farm and ranch. Almost took the 6.5 creedmoor Kimber rifle home instead of the powder. Dang I hate it when that happens.. . I did ask to see the rifle though. I don't know what I'd do with such a light rifle. The tag on it said "sub moa" too. It was tempting . So for now, I am going to run AR comp since I know my AR15's and AR10 308 loves the stuff. It won't go to waste. The bullet I loaded up is a discontinued 68gr. Hornady BTSP match that I found at a small gushop for $10.00 because there was only 85 in the box. I doubt I'll run across more of these bullets So, like the OP, I'll bet these loads shoot like a house afire. They will probably be that infamous sub 1/2 moa 10 shot group kind of load that I only dream about . I'll be at the range tomorrow, testing them out.

 

[ageingstudent]

@ron. Love those one book/one caliber manuals. Lots of choices. Good value.

@bsa1917hunter. I'm jealous. Have all my stuff packed up for a move the bench is closed for the near future.

 

[orygun]

So, I take it that Varget's a stick powder. Is it more temperamental that any other stick powder, or just in comparison to ball?

I love dirty old Unique. Gives real satisfaction when cleaning my handguns. (seriously)
It's a favorite for my 45ACP loads. It meters well enough in the Dillon measure on my 550.

 

[Goosebrown]

So, I take it that Varget's a stick powder. Is it more temperamental that any other stick powder, or just in comparison to ball?

I love dirty old Unique. Gives real satisfaction when cleaning my handguns. (seriously)
It's a favorite for my 45ACP loads. It meters well enough in the Dillon measure on my 550.

Varget is extruded. All the rifle powders I use are. H4895, Varget, H4350, RL10x... they work better in my rifles all the time.

However I don't use a powder throw I use a charge master extruded powders are hard to throw.

I am sort of surprised that people can't get enough in a case to load them. I never hit accuracy nodes that close to maximum charge but every rifle tests out differently I guess.

 

[ageingstudent]

So, I take it that Varget's a stick powder. Is it more temperamental that any other stick powder, or just in comparison to ball?

I love dirty old Unique. Gives real satisfaction when cleaning my handguns. (seriously)
It's a favorite for my 45ACP loads. It meters well enough in the Dillon measure on my 550.

Yes stick powder with very long kernels. I wish they would make a short cut version.