Poll: Bolt-guns obsolete?

[CountryGent]

A "classic", as much as a three year old video can be, from In Range TV:

Within the parameters they are talking about: agree or disagree?

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[03A3Sporter]

Its all about use cases . Do I want one to go into combat with ? not if I have another option. For hunting and general use though they work as good as they ever did.

 

[Longwalkhome]

Sgt York did well with a bolt gun but backed it up with a 1911. In today's world you would have to maintain long distance between you and the enemy if all you had was a bolt gun imho

WWII Able Seaman Brown took on a crippled battle ship with a bolt gun and lived to tell the story. Movie called Sailor for the King with Jeffery Hunter.

 

[TTSX]

When the people who kill other people from very VERY far away use more gas guns then bolt guns, I'll agree. But only after the majority of hunters also replace theirs. Oh, and top level bench rest shooters.

I'll change my statement a bit after actually watching the video. In the context they stated, if everyone else has an automatic, you are definitely at a disadvantage within a couple hundred yards and everyone is trying to kill everyone else. It was an interesting point they made that the sand people used British enfields just long enough to pick up an AK and now it seems they used those just long enough to be given an M4...... so is it an advantage to have repeating fire? Yes. Is the bolt gun obsolete? Still no.

 

[coop44]

Bolt guns will never go away, there are a bazillion out there. Simple reliable long lasting guns, GENERALLY in more potent calibers than semi autos are offered in. Of course there are large caliber semi autos, but they are not the norm and they are not affordable for many of us. Also not very practical for hunting imho.

 

[quneur]

Firearm ownership isn't all about the fight against anti-2A. It encompasses much more. It also meant sustenance hunting, self preservation and general enjoyment. Not every firearm is black polymer aluminum frame. There are thousands of elk size or larger game taken every year with non-black firearms. And those black arms in calibers large enough to take large game is at a disadvantage compared to single shots and bolt action firearms. One, weight and two, all you usually need is one shot because by the second shot the game is running for its life.

 

[Nosferatu]

I'm not even going to watch it, I can only imagine the stupid arguments they try to make.

The AR isn't going to make everything else obsolete. I know there are a few companies making 300WM AR-pattern rifles, but they weigh a ton and not something you want to drag around the mountains chasing elk.

Hell, look how many people are still buying and clamoring for more lever actions (myself included). A design from the mid 1800's. If those aren't going away, bolt guns have a LOT of life left in them.

 

[Knobgoblin]

This is a dense, rich desert. And I thank you for that.

First I'd like to share how giddy I am that these 2 hardcore gun nerds think the 1917 Enfield is best of breed. I always felt this was the case, but I rarely tell people this because it's always Springfield vs. Mauser. Plus I just assumed that having the 1917 as my first great war milsurp had made me prejudiced.

I love bolt guns with open sights. I already know that I, personally, am way faster with a lever gun than I'll ever be with a bolt gun. When we start adding modern ,center fire ,magazine fed rifles to the mix the conversation is over. No rational person would ever purposely choose a non-scoped , 5 or even 10 round bolt gun when they could have anything that begins with the letter "A"

Penetration and longer effective range arguments are not as significant as many would like to believe. I see my vote is in the minority thus far. Can't wait to see this thread blossom.

Thanks again Gent . Good stuff.

 

[Knobgoblin]

Most of the comments so far seem to be ignoring the lack of glass on the bolt guns in question.

 

[Savage Jav]

Sgt York did well with a bolt gun but backed it up with a 1911. In today's world you would have to maintain long distance between you and the enemy if all you had was a bolt gun imho

WWII Able Seaman Brown took on a crippled battle ship with a bolt gun and lived to tell the story. Movie called Sailor for the King with Jeffery Hunter.

And imagine if Sgt York had an m16

 

[American123]

They serve a purpose, but that purpose is no longer to be the most effective fighting rifle available, apart from the most niche of uses.

As I understand it they are popular in more longterm without support survival situations or hunting where the need for quick successive shots and reloads is nearly non existent. One benefit is the overall simplicity of parts and less likelihood due to less parts for a failure that would render it inoperable.

Big game magnums is another niche for bolt actions where semi autos are just not practically made to be used.

 

[gmerkt]

Except possibly for specialist applications, they are obsolete for military purposes. For general shooting and hunting as a civilian, perfectly useful. Their usefulness in the latter role may really shine if legislation ever takes semi-autos away completely. May happen some day, not saying it's imminent.

I was interested to note that the guy on the right pronounced "Garand" correctly, not the popularly accepted way.

 

[Flymph]

In the context they are referring to, yes. In general, not necessarily; as they said, affordability is an important factor.

 

[CLT65]

I watched it and I'm still not sure exactly what point they were trying to make. I think they were just saying that bolt-action battle rifles are obsolete for arming troops on the modern battlefield. I thought that was common knowledge a long time ago.

I didn't see where they were trying to say that they weren't still usable or useful, nor did they talk about hunting or other typical civilian uses. They were just saying that if you have your old Mosin-Nagant and think you could somehow hold your own against someone with a modern semi-auto, you're dreaming.

 

[Savage Jav]

They serve a purpose, but that purpose is no longer to be the most effective fighting rifle available, apart from the most niche of uses.

As I understand it they are popular in more longterm without support survival situations or hunting where the need for quick successive shots and reloads is nearly non existent. One benefit is the overall simplicity of parts and less likelihood due to less parts for a failure that would render it inoperable.

Big game magnums is another niche for bolt actions where semi autos are just not practically made to be used.

Im not sure about the parts breakage bit. I would argue bolt guns are also shot alot less then semi autos. I know its an ammo crunch but I would love to compare an off the rack bolt gun, AR, and AK by shooting them until the literally break (obviously not very scientific, and would take forever). But I think we would find that bolt guns break more then we think just like revolvers break too.

This isn't ment to be an argument but more so food for thought. When was he last time someone went out and put 1000rds through their bolt gun in a session?

 

[Knobgoblin]

Im not sure about the parts breakage bit. I would argue bolt guns are also shot alot less then semi autos. I know its an ammo crunch but I would love to compare an off the rack bolt gun, AR, and AK by shooting them until the literally break (obviously not very scientific, and would take forever). But I think we would find that bolt guns break more then we think just like revolvers break too.

This isn't ment to be an argument but more so food for thought. When was he last time someone went out and put 1000rds through their bolt gun in a session?

Lol.

You ever manage to get this together I'll donate a stock IO to the cause.

Yes , you can nail it in a wooden rest and pull the trigger with paracord.

 

[Savage Jav]

Lol.

You ever manage to get this together I'll donate a stock IO to the cause.

Yes , you can nail it in a wooden rest and pull the trigger with paracord.

Glad you care about my health. Oh my reputation if I was caught holding an IO thats not an import

 

[American123]

Im not sure about the parts breakage bit. I would argue bolt guns are also shot alot less then semi autos. I know its an ammo crunch but I would love to compare an off the rack bolt gun, AR, and AK by shooting them until the literally break (obviously not very scientific, and would take forever). But I think we would find that bolt guns break more then we think just like revolvers break too.

This isn't ment to be an argument but more so food for thought. When was he last time someone went out and put 1000rds through their bolt gun in a session?

I understand, I was going off the anecdotal evidence that nearly every tv show that includes people who spend a lot of time outdoors doing a subsistence lifestyle tend to have bolt action rifles, as well as most of the televised hunting shows.

If we look at the mechanical parts on an AR compared to the bolt action that would potentially break and render them inoperable, it would be interesting, the AR could in theory be rendered a to a single shot and not completely inoperable before eventually it became completely inoperable.

 

[Knobgoblin]

Glad you care about my health. Oh my reputation if I was caught holding an IO thats not an import

Even with the unfair advantage of a prone-to-auto-disassembly AK , I'd still bet against the AR . If locking up completely would disqualify said AR

 

[Pandaz3]

I have a number of AR's, a couple lever action center fire, and one bolt gun, a Model 70 in 7 MM Mag, so I'm not too attached to bolt guns.