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Vetrans Today-Sandy Hook

Discussion in 'General Firearm Discussion' started by novamind, Dec 28, 2012.

  1. novamind

    novamind Hillsboro Active Member

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  2. maxord precision

    maxord precision Tacoma WA Member

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    So, that was the bushmaster huh? Heres why that columnist is wrong. Does bushmaster make a side charger? Thats very obviously a mossberg 930 or winchester defender. Its very very plain to see that its a semi auto twelve guage. Look at how he operates it, hes not using a charging handle on the rear like an AR, its on the outboard (right handed shooter) side. If you look at the barrel profile its way to big to be an AR.
     
  3. deen_ad

    deen_ad Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    Take a look at the Bushmasters shown in the story, there is one (ACR Enhanced) that is a side charger with no back charger.
     
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  4. novamind

    novamind Hillsboro Active Member

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    Good point deen_ad the gun in the trunk was a missing puzzle piece as nothing worked to fit here for me -until now. If it was a bushmaster AR-15 it would have to be a ACR Enhanced. This variant is new to me.
     
  5. Norm0931

    Norm0931 Hillsboro, OR Sgt. Sheep Silver Vendor 2016 Volunteer

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    Well, an ACR is not an AR-15. However, it could have been an AR-15. The lower could have been Bushmaster and it could have been a side charging AR upper. Several companies make them. They would have called the rifle a Bushmaster since technically the lower is the firearm.
    Alexander_Arms_Side_Charger.jpg

    Rewatched the video several times. I know the dude on Veteran's Today says he is a Marine Corps Firearms instructor, as was I from 2007-2008. I just watched a slow motion video of the clearing of the weapon. IMO that's a shotgun.
    [video=youtube_share;bGALsV6BzFI]http://youtu.be/bGALsV6BzFI[/video]

    At 1:44 you'll see him bring the stock back behind his arm. From the angle and shape of the stock, supported by the shape of the forend, size of the round ejected (looks like a shell to me) and the shape of the pistol grip that looks EXACTLY like this:
    Benelli-M4-Tactical-1-1.jpg
    firearm_shotgun_R12_2_ss.ashx.jpg

    A Benelli M4 with a pistol grip on it. It could possibly be a Remington Versa Max (very similar auto loading shotgun) and Remington is owned by the same conglomerate as Bushmaster. The thing that immediately sets that off as a shotgun and not an AR is the top of the stock at the buttplate is several inches below the receiver. AR stocks are inline and level due to ballistics and how you need to look through the sights. Shotguns stocks angle downward.

    Alexander_Arms_Side_Charger.jpg
     
  6. Velzey

    Velzey Estacada, Oregon Gunsmith Gunsmith Bronze Vendor Bronze Supporter

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    Clearly a shogun shell!

    A 12ga shotgun shell is the size of an adult males thumb. And that is exactly what popped out of that!
    .223 no way
     
  7. trainsktg

    trainsktg Portland OR Well-Known Member

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    No doubt a shotgun.

    Keith
     
  8. Vantage

    Vantage Pacific Standard Time Active Member

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    Novamind you still trying to push this conspiracy theory stuff?
     
  9. Mastershakelock

    Mastershakelock Medford Member

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    I think that statement is absolutely hilarious given just a few months ago anyone claiming Obama was coming after their guns was a conspiracy theory nut, and it would never happen.. what is wrong with questioning the official story and trying to find out answers that don't always match up with the mainstreams views? The people that control the system have an agenda.. and if it means covering up or distorting the actual events to help their cause it's a PROVEN FACT THEY HAVE DONE IT BEFORE IN THE PAST. Why on earth should it be any different now?!! I am so sick of these degrading labels. Yes their are nut job crazy's out there just looking for attention with this end of the world crap.. but not EVERYTHING is a Gdamn conspiracy theory! It's simply just a theory based on real provable facts (and VIDEO evidence) in some cases that differs from the mainstreams views! And tell me exactly who owns and controls the mainstream media? The same men who control the system, the names you never hear about working silently in the background, working the gears of society, molding the minds of millions of brainwashed American consumer wh*res, who are absolutely clueless. It's extremely frustrating after everything we have seen that people still use the term so negatively. It only reconfirms my belief that the majority of the American people will continue to believe whatever story is given as long as the 4-5 mainstream news channels come to the same conclusion. Americans need to start thinking outside the box because we have never been in greater danger of the endless misinformation we suck down willingly without a second thought to question the validly of such strange and insane events.
     
  10. Mastershakelock

    Mastershakelock Medford Member

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  11. Pauly

    Pauly N. Portland Active Member

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    Well, duh... :)

    Although I'm not a fan of the antisemitic tone of some of the articles there, anybody who's honest with themselves simply cannot reconcile all the massive inconsistencies as well as the changing stories.
    It's like watching a 5 year old child being tripped up as they lie.
    At least I'd feel better if they could be better liars.
    Why are there always 2-4 shooters when these things start, then it goes down to one. Eyewitness accounts are disregarded.
    Sorry, I don't buy it.
    Maybe someone could be wrong about the color of someone's pants, but the several incidences where we're expected to believe that multiple eyewitness are constantly having shared hallucinations, is just pathetic and insulting.


    You're missing an even more important part.
    When it was happening, it was still daylight. They were reporting live on scene and were showing parents at the fire outpost after the stated discovery and it was still light out.
    Are people trying to tell me that after finding a long gun in the car, they didn't check or secure it, but just tossed it back in the trunk and just left it be, then shot a video later that night of rediscovering it?
     
  12. slimer13

    slimer13 Deer Park Well-Known Member

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    Its funny how people severely underestimate the incompetence of the media and chaulk it up to some grand conspiricy.

    Do you have any idea of the logistics of the type of operation that you are implying?

    I have had intimate first hand knowledge of an unfortunate incident that happened locally, but when I watched it on the news, more than half of what was reported was total crap. Was this some evil conspiricy or simply the media being in such a rush to beat out its competitors to a story, things that were reported were not properly verified?
     
  13. OFADAN

    OFADAN Brownsville, OR Well-Known Member

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    Definately a Semi-auto Shotgun. Interesting manual of arms procedure - unloading while pointing at the vehicle fuel tank. Not that anyone's ever had a negligent dischange. Just learned this week of an officer having an ND with an AR after an incident. Fortunately the round went into the ground - rather into the fuel tank as in this case.
     
  14. Pauly

    Pauly N. Portland Active Member

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    Media reports cite officials. Especially the day Sandy Hook was happening.

    As for it being logistically difficult, apparently it was, because they did a really bad job of making a cover story.
    And yes, governments in the past have engaged in massive conspiracies. There's motive up the yin-yang on this one.
    Yes, the conspiracy does indeed look to be quite grand. Especially when one looks into "Nick & Laura Phelps", supposed grieving parents, only to find they're real names are Richard & Jennifer Sexton, out of Florida (sorry, 1 look alike, okay... But Identical couples? Doesn't happen)
    Also, the plates of the suspects car are registered to a "Christopher A. Rodia" who is currently listed as living in Miami, and has no connection to Lanza, or his mother.

    It's okay. You can deny reality if it makes life easier to deal with, but if you were an investigator and you ignored the inconsistencies in this story, it would be a dereliction of your duty.
    Psychophysiological cues of deception, changing stories, facts not adding up...
    Someone can not seriously ignore that.
    They can play like they believe it for whatever reasons they may have, but they're just fooling themselves. Likely as a defense mechanism to avoid dealing mentally with the reality they find themselves in.
     
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  15. slimer13

    slimer13 Deer Park Well-Known Member

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    I should have remembered...

    302xbad.jpg
     
  16. Just Me

    Just Me Peoples Republik of Oregon Active Member

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    I was directly involved in an incident in my city. When the story was published in the paper the only things they got right were the date and the highway. Seriously, it was completely wrong. When friends asked me about it and I told them what actually happened they were astonished. Perhaps now they will not take the reporters as prophets.
     
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  17. Pauly

    Pauly N. Portland Active Member

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    Don't be so hard on yourself.
    You're not an idiot. (well, you might be, but I don't see overwhelming evidence on this thread at least) You're just in denial.

    Real time police scanner recordings of plates being run, and pictures from multiple sources of said plates being on the suspect vehicle, don't lie.
    So, prove your worth. Disprove any point I mentioned.
    Don't be like a lefty, insulting, then losing your mind and running away because you have no rationale explanation for your stance.
    Do you do acid & get flashbacks, so you're projecting that that's what's happening to all the eyewitnesses, or do you just lack answers?

    If it's the latter, you should really step out of the conversation, unless you're just here to self aggrandize and bolster your own ego.
    Go along son.
    Grown folks is talkin'.
     
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  18. slimer13

    slimer13 Deer Park Well-Known Member

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    Must resist argueing....

    Cant do it (stuck inside today and bored).

    I am really not seeing the relevence of the plates. Please spell out nice and slow, (for us sheeple) the exact events of that day (in your mind) so I can better pick your theory apart. I mean was it multiple shooters? Mind control? Robots? Aliens? What exactly?
     
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  19. Pauly

    Pauly N. Portland Active Member

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    You don't see relevance in the fact that the car that you're watching videos of police pulling a long gun out of the trunk of that's supposedly owned by the shooter's mother and the vehicle that the police say he used to get there isn't connected to the family?

    Okay.
    Now you proved the first part of my last post wrong.
    Just believe everything you're spoon fed.
    It's not like the courts ruled that the Media can lie to you, or the NDAA has a provision allowing for the use of disinformation (propaganda) against the American people, or anything... lol

    As for the rest, I think I'll just write this off to a Proverbs 18:2 moment, and wish you the best.
     
  20. Swedish K

    Swedish K SW Washington Moderator Staff Member

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    After reviewing the article, while parts of it do seem to be guesswork, the one thing that definitely stands out is that the officer picked up the weapon (evidence) from the trunk of the vehicle with bare hands and cleared the weapon. No officer in their right mind would contaminate evidence like this. As was pointed out, the weapon would have been left for the CSI types to process/print, or at the very least the officer would have worn gloves so as to not put his prints on the weapon and avoid contaminating the evidence. Most likely they would have checked the vehicle for booby traps, sealed it with evidence tape, and had it towed to a secure CSI lab to further investigate.
     
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