Patriot Ordnance Factory

[Jcon268]

Looking to gain some information, if possible, about this company (POF).
As a disclaimer, I'm attempting to sell a rifle made by them here in the classifieds section, which I think is priced appropriately given their cost new.
Despite pricing, it seems to suffer from a lack of interest. This lack of interest would seem to hint that there might be a lack of desire for this specific product.
Having done *some* research, I've found that there are what I'd call a significant number of complaints online about POF and what appears to be a certain period of time where their quality control suffered to some extent. Also have heard a couple of complaints about customer service but could be isolated incidents.
What I can't figure out, or haven't had time to research properly, is WHEN that time period was and what the effects were. There was a new revision of my firearm put on the market called the Revolution, which was an AR15 chassis that shoots .308 caliber rounds. Now I could picture something novel like that suffering issues, perhaps not having all of the kinks worked out. However, there now seem to be a lot of people happy with that particular firearm and who follow POF closely.

If I've missed something, I'm hoping to learn about it from some of you guys who have experience with the brand and what problems you've seen relative to other brands.

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[Lazyfaire]

I have 2 - 415 Edges (5.56) and they shoot very well. Light weight and the groups are close. Usually the complaints circle around the Revolutions (308) which if they work well are great guns too. The Revolution has been around maybe 10 years. The design was a 308 in an AR15 config. The lower receiver is extended to allow for the short action magwell, and the bolt is enlarged for the larger cartridge.

The designer tests his rifles like the military. Take an AR15 and dump as many mags as possible to find the failure point and then redesign that portion. Then do it again. The military does not test their larger calibers that way, but POF does the same with the 308s to find the failure points, then fix/harden those points. So they are solidly made.

 

[Jcon268]

I have 2 - 415 Edges (5.56) and they shoot very well. Light weight and the groups are close. Usually the complaints circle around the Revolutions (308) which if they work well are great guns too. The Revolution has been around maybe 10 years. The design was a 308 in an AR15 config. The lower receiver is extended to allow for the short action magwell, and the bolt is enlarged for the larger cartridge.

The designer tests his rifles like the military. Take an AR15 and dump as many mags as possible to find the failure point and then redesign that portion. Then do it again. The military does not test their larger calibers that way, but POF does the same with the 308s to find the failure points, then fix/harden those points. So they are solidly made.

Good to hear. The people who like them seem to like them a lot. They offer a lot for a decent price (assuming performance is up to claims). Almost any other piston .308 costs 50% more or even more than that

 

[Lazyfaire]

Good to hear. The people who like them seem to like them a lot. They offer a lot for a decent price (assuming performance is up to claims). Almost any other piston .308 costs 50% more or even more than that

They come in either a gas piston or DI configuration

 

[STHLD]

I've got one of their Cabelas special Minuteman's from 2014. Those minuteman's and puritans were very simple and kicked bubblegum, the roller cam was great. Top notch piston system. By far my favorite AR of mine, reliable and damn accurate.

My in-law's got a newer 308 piston which shoots alright, just a lot going on and an awful big handguard.

Best man at my wedding was Phoenix swat for years, all they ran and trained with was POF 556 and 308 systems.

It seemed like 2010-2013 was when most of the horror stories popped up. Just watch the old torture tests on these, they out run the HK's.

 

[Jcon268]

They come in either a gas piston or DI configuration

Yeah, sorry I should have

I've got one of their Cabelas special Minuteman's from 2014. Those minuteman's and puritans were very simple and kicked bubblegum, the roller cam was great. Top notch piston system. By far my favorite AR of mine, reliable and damn accurate.

My in-law's got a newer 308 piston which shoots alright, just a lot going on and an awful big handguard.

Best man at my wedding was Phoenix swat for years, all they ran and trained with was POF 556 and 308 systems.

It seemed like 2010-2013 was when most of the horror stories popped up. Just watch the old torture tests on these, they out run the HK's.

That's great to hear. Is your in-laws .308 the Revolution or the older standard AR10 frame (Edge)?

I agree about the handguard, definitely has more battle rifle vibes than AR

 

[asiparks]

I currently have 4, gen 4 415 edge pistol, now SBR, an older gen 2 308, a DI Minuteman special edition with the dictator gas block and the Revolution piston.
The 308, which I bought, somewhere between 2008 and 2010, had to go back because the edge of the feed ramp was shaving brass off of cartridges- they sent me a return label and had it back to me in 3 weeks, zero problems after that.
They are all sub MOA guns and reliability has been flawless- and I'm not one to over clean my guns.
Their quality is easily on par with LWRC and LMT, and I'd argue that they are one of the few companies to innovate in the AR space- the roller cam, the beautifully made one piece bolts, E squared extraction, arguably the best ambi lowers and then there's the AR15 sized 308 Revolution.....
Like Robinson Arms with their superlative XCR, POF just seem to put their money into making rifles, rather than marketing.

The 2 that keep popping up the classified are wild bargains.....

 

[Jcon268]

I currently have 4, gen 4 415 edge pistol, now SBR, an older gen 2 308, a DI Minuteman special edition with the dictator gas block and the Revolution piston.
The 308, which I bought, somewhere between 2008 and 2010, had to go back because the edge of the feed ramp was shaving brass off of cartridges- they sent me a return label and had it back to me in 3 weeks, zero problems after that.
They are all sub MOA guns and reliability has been flawless- and I'm not one to over clean my guns.
Their quality is easily on par with LWRC and LMT, and I'd argue that they are one of the few companies to innovate in the AR space- the roller cam, the beautifully made one piece bolts, E squared extraction, arguably the best ambi lowers and then there's the AR15 sized 308 Revolution.....
Like Robinson Arms with their superlative XCR, POF just seem to put their money into making rifles, rather than marketing.

The 2 that keep popping up the classified are wild bargains.....

I'm not sure why but they get nowhere near the respect that LMT does. It might be the military pedigree or being more exclusive due to price but LMT has the most ardent fan base aside from probably KAC. I haven't held or shot either so I couldn't offer an opinion.

 

[Greg S]

Bought a 5.56 Lemon years ago. POF is garbage. Rifle would not run without jamming. Factory was no help and Fing rude to me. Dumped it cheap and would not recommend based on my product experience and warranty contact.

The only reason I'd run a piston is an sbr suppressed.

 

[Foreverlost]

Purchased a P308 almost 10 years ago. It ain't a bolt gun! Sat around during the Obummer admin, lack of ammo, reloading supplies. Trump admin, things picked up and ran some ammo thru the gas gun. Ejection wasn't 100%. Got back to fiddling with it again in the Slow Joe admin. Still glitches in the get-a-long with ejection. Less than 1000 rounds thru the P308.

Time to call POF and had a chat with Juan. Use the gun or not the springs will weaken, fact of life. Ordered a new buffer spring, and a bolt rebuild kit. The P308 now goes bang, bang all day long. Empty cartridges spit out like they should.

Would someone lend me a set of good eyes so I can focus on the scope reticle. Waited far too long to call Juan.

Gas piston or DI.............they can be picky. Juan also noted, sometimes it's the ammo and how hard the buffer spring is slammed. Hotter load and the buffer spring fails sooner.

So, if the POF is causing a pain in the backside, call Juan. Be polite..........quit think'en, quit whinn'en,.............listen.

Foreverlost,

 

[Lazyfaire]

Bought a 5.56 Lemon years ago. POF is garbage. Rifle would not run without jamming. Factory was no help and Fing rude to me. Dumped it cheap and would not recommend based on my product experience and warranty contact.

The only reason I'd run a piston is an sbr suppressed.

I own a POF Edge 415 & a 416 (both are 5.56) . Both of them shoot great. The 415 was new and the 416 I found in a pawn shop.

Bought a Revolution 308 and like @Foreverlost it has issues with ejection and next round pickup. Going to try his suggestions and see if it shoots better. The Revolution has a very involved break-in procedure.

When they work, they are great.

 

[Foreverlost]

I own a POF Edge 415 & a 416 (both are 5.56) . Both of them shoot great. The 415 was new and the 416 I found in a pawn shop.

Bought a Revolution 308 and like @Foreverlost it has issues with ejection and next round pickup. Going to try his suggestions and see if it shoots better. The Revolution has a very involved break-in procedure.

When they work, they are great.

Yup! Dem olde springs might be weak n' short. The buffer spring is a piece of cake to replace. With the bolt rebuild kit all the necessary parts are included. The extractor, spring, o-ring, and pin aren't too bad to replace. Use a pin punch or nail, etc. You can almost give the extractor a squeeze with your fingers and push out the pin. I wrapped a leather strip around the extractor & bolt and used a vise for a gentle squeeze to get the pin in place. The ejector will be a challenge if you have never been down this road before. I needed a 1/16-inch pin punch (Ace Hardware etc). No doubt, pushing the ejector plunger in far enough and tapping the new pin in place is a chore. I used a small tubing cutter to cut the head from a cartridge. Again, protect the bolt if using a vise, leather or soft metal where the bolt would touch the jaws of a vise. Once the new spring is inserted place the plunger in next. Now the fun begins. A little finesse and luck to place the cartridge head into the bolt keeping all the parts n' pieces in place while tightening the vise. The pin for the ejector is not quite round. It will need to be driven out and driven in. Do not reuse the old pin.

I'll recommend call Juan first. Spring replacement if needed.........remove old extractor, remove old ejector, replace new ejector, replace new extractor. With the extractor out of the way the plunger might be easier to push in place with the cartridge case??????

This was my first bolt rebuild attempt, no damage done. But I bet there is an easier way, and I don't have those tools. Might be good for 4 or 5 years?

Foreverlost,