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Can Safety Trump the 1st Amendment?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by RicInOR, Feb 28, 2014.

  1. RicInOR

    RicInOR Washington County Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    The 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals said the officials' concerns of racial violence outweighed students' freedom of expression rights.

    Court: School can ban US flag shirts for safety

    These are students - not adults - and schools do have the power of in loco parentis,
    But, if there are reasons to take the 1st amendment, then don't those same reasons apply to take the 2nd?


    I am reminded of a quote by Benjamin Franklin that “Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."


    Another article:
    http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/184668/
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2014
  2. Caveman Jim

    Caveman Jim West of Oly Springer Slayer 2016 Volunteer

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    They are showing students how they are able to be controling so they will swallow their pride and be mindless robots in the future!!!!
     
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  3. Dunerunner

    Dunerunner You'll Never Know Well-Known Member

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    If it could be done with the 2nd, it would only be on campus...right? But there is a big difference between self defense and the denial of the means to self defense and wearing a T-Shirt! Would that also apply to those wearing an Obama, Rainbow, Hillary, Woman's Right to Choose, Che Guevara‎ T-Shirt or Mao T-Shirt? I mean, what is right is right!!
     
  4. salmonriverjohn

    salmonriverjohn N.W Oregon coast, Gods country Well-Known Member

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    Can your 1st amendment be trumped by safety? Try screaming FIRE in an outlet mall or theater.
     
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  5. RVTECH

    RVTECH LaPine Well-Known Member

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    Or replace the word 'fire' with 'gun'
     
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  6. oknow

    oknow amboy wa. Well-Known Member

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    You can yell fire in a mall or theater if there is a fire.
     
  7. salmonriverjohn

    salmonriverjohn N.W Oregon coast, Gods country Well-Known Member

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    Yep, you get the point though.
     
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  8. 3MTA3

    3MTA3 DMZ between Liberty and Tyranny Behind Enemy Lines Bronze Supporter

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    Or if you are shooting at the latest coward that decides to shoot up another gun free zone...
     
  9. RicInOR

    RicInOR Washington County Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Or if you are on stage.


    To be clear, the 1st amendment has been restricted. Not that it should be.
    It is designed to protect the expressions of ideas, to allow opposition to the ruling political party.
    Some restrictions I strongly oppose include "hate speech."
    Other speech which is not protected includes "bearing false witness," something I agree with (you can't lie on contracts, in court etc.)
    Political speech which should be unencumbered, does have restrictions like how much money someone can contribute to a candidate.
    (There is a whole nother argument about collections of people, like corporations, and their political speech)

    The 1st also does not allow the government to have an official religion. Religious practice has been restricted - can you have multiple spouses (well, soon I think this will be ok again - once gay marriage is in every state) How about the sacrifice of animals (required by some religions)

    Then we get the right to assemble. But restrictions apply - you may need a permit to meet in a park, or have a parade.

    And, they are suppose to listen to our grievances.


    Back to yelling in a crowded space. I think you need to be held to account for your actions. Yell "Bubble Gum" and people get hurt, should you not be arrested? How about throwing some money in a mall at Christmas? What if no one gets hurt, what is the big deal.
    Just like driving with a cell phone - so what. If you are driving erratic, regardless of the reason, police should stop you. But if you can use a cell phone and drive safe, why not.
    We shouldn't restrict what someone might do, or why they do something, just their actions.


    In this case of these students wearing a flag on another countries holiday, is a political protest. Protesting that we are elevating other countries above the USA. If you celebrate your heritage, good for you. But when our government (the school) does so, they have invited protest. When schools celebrate Christmas, what happens?


    U.S. Constitution - Amendment 1 - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net