.223 Rem vs. .22 WMR?

[The Heretic]

Occasionally I see a .22 WMR rifle and think I might want it.

But then I look at the cost of the ammo (about the same as some .223), and then I think about the fact that it isn't that much faster than some hi-vel .22 LR ammo, and then I think about the fact that I can download/reload .223 to .22 WMR velocities and way above, has a much wider selection of bullets, and I already have a .223 bolt action rifle.

Am I missing something here??

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[Knobgoblin]

Ever see a 9 shot revolver offered in .223?

 

[Kruel J]

Less recoil, less noise, easier to carry more ammo. I really like .22WMR.

 

[Knobgoblin]

I have a cz bolt gun in 22wrmr that I occasionally think about chopping and suppressing. Not positive if my science is right, but a 5.56 rated can should make it almost completely silent.

 

[Hueco]

If the constraint is that both have to use a bolt gun, and the only concern is terminal ballistics, then I think you will find the .223 superior. As you said, more bullet selection + reloadable + can be down rated to mag velocities anyway.

But, those aren't the only things that matter now are they?

 

[The Heretic]

Ever see a 9 shot revolver offered in .223?

View attachment 1172304

IMO, for most revolvers, the .22 WMR is not very effective - you lose a lot of velocity with the shorter barrel (than a rifle - which is why I posted this in the rifle sub forum) and with the cylinder gap.

For a pistol, I have a Five Seven with 20-30 rounds (30 with the CMMG extension) and a little more power and range than a revolver in .22 WMR, plus I have a threaded barrel so I can suppress it.

No - I am thinking about rifles in .22 WMR and .223

 

[ma96782]

Aloha, Mark

 

[The Heretic]

If the constraint is that both have to use a bolt gun, and the only concern is terminal ballistics, then I think you will find the .223 superior. As you said, more bullet selection + reloadable + can be down rated to mag velocities anyway.

But, those aren't the only things that matter now are they?

For .22 WMR vs. .223, versatility with loads, cost, accuracy and range - yes, those are what matters for this comparison - to me.

If .22 WMR cost 10-15 CPR, then cost would be near as much of an issue - but that isn't happening - the least expensive .22 WMR is 28 CPR.

Add onto that, the fact that I already have a .223 bolt action and a break action combo (Savage 24) in .223, so I save the cost of not buying another rifle.

 

[The Heretic]

I have a cz bolt gun in 22wrmr that I occasionally think about chopping and suppressing. Not positive if my science is right, but a 5.56 rated can should make it almost completely silent.

It would still have a supersonic "crack".

Quieter yes, silent no.

 

[Kruel J]

It would still have a supersonic "crack".

Quieter yes, silent no.

Subsonic loads.

 

[titsonritz]

Between 22LR and 223/5.56x45 I've never had a use for .22WMR, if I was going to do another rimfire cartridge it would be .22WMR's offspring, the .17 HMR.

 

[Knobgoblin]

For .22 WMR vs. .223, versatility with loads, cost, accuracy and range - yes, those are what matters for this comparison - to me.

If .22 WMR cost 10-15 CPR, then cost would be near as much of an issue - but that isn't happening - the least expensive .22 WMR is 28 CPR.

Add onto that, the fact that I already have a .223 bolt action and a break action combo (Savage 24) in .223, so I save the cost of not buying another rifle.

I agree with you, as regards actual retail.
However, there is a far better chance of stumbling onto deals for 22 mag on the secondary market. Most folks who end up with 9mm , 556 , 762 are aware of their value even if they aren't gun people. Rimfire and shotgun shells still pop up at garage sales very reasonably priced.
If you're into that sort of thing.

 

[Kruel J]

Between 22LR and 223/5.56x45 I've never had a use for .22WMR, if I was going to do another rimfire cartridge it would be .22WMR's offspring, the .17 HMR.

I like .17HMR too. They're both good varmint rounds.

 

[Geardo]

.22 WMR is pretty fun to shoot. A lot less loud than .223 for plinking.

 

[aasbra]

I enjoy smaller caliber rifles. So in my collection, I have rifles in 22 magnum and 223, and also some "intermediate" between the two, including 222 and 22 Hornet.

I like them all. You mention downloading 223 to perform more like the 22 Magnum, so I assume you handload or are open to handloading/reloading your own ammo. For a handloader, lots of options open up, and in that case, I see less support for holding a 22 mag in my collection. Generally (there are exceptions) 22 mag ammo is not regarded as accurate as some other smaller CF calibers. I find the 22 Hornet can be loaded to a nice range between the 22 LR and the 222 or 223, and both the Hornets I've owned were good shooters. So if either my 22 mag rifles or the 22 Hornets were on the chopping block, I personally would keep the Hornet as a handloader. I haven't tried downloading 223 for plinking ammo or use more in the purpose of the 22 mag, but I know others do. Nice thing about loading 223 is that brass is plentiful. Keep some primers and suitable powder on hand, and you should always be able to make ammo. There have been periods where 22 mag ammo is harder to find. That said, you strike me as the type who doesn't wait to go find ammo when everyone else is also looking, but rather one who keeps a reasonable amount stashed away.

Now if you don't (or won't) handload, I definitely see a stronger case for the 22 mag. I enjoy shooting both of my CZ 452 rifles in 22 mag. But I enjoy the 527 rifles in 22 Hornet more.

 

[Stomper]

Ever see a 9 shot revolver offered in .223?

View attachment 1172304

If this were in .223…. It'd jam up into muh junk every time I sat down…

 

[Member 52301]

My husband shoots a sweet bolt action .223 rifle.

He is a very picky man when it comes to ALL things gun related and he is a very proficient rifleman.

He is very good with handguns. He used to compete too.

He hunts in ALL types of terrain out here.

He used to shoot various gauges, beautiful Walnut wood/steel shotguns and reloaded for all of them shy of his last, former (NON wood.) Marine Magnum 870 shotgun which he sold.

He reloads and has reloaded since the early 70's. He LIKES his own .223 ammunition better than factory ammo no matter what BRAND or grain it is in too.

He reloads for ALL of his CF firearms shy of .380 for his newer, sweet GLOCK pistol.
(He does have a TINY bit of 45acp and 30-30 Win. factory on hand too.)

He shoots a sweet bolt action CZ 22wmr rifle. He has owned several 22wmr rifles in the past but not TONS of them.

I do NOT reload.

I did think about getting into it before my late husband's cancer discovery and death. I changed my mind and I did not get into it.

I do NOT regret not getting into reloading.

I shoot a sweet bolt action CZ 22wmr rifle. The exact TWIN of the above rifle bought - special ordered at the same time from our FFL man.

I LOVE to shoot 22wmr firearms especially in a rifle. I hardly shot the 22wmr cylinders out of several of my former RUGER s/a revolvers.

I LOVE shooting 22lr firearms too.

I DID shoot .223 out of several rifles that I did not own in the past. They were in various actions. Including the AR15 PLATFORM as some of you call it and IT DID NOTHING FOR ME AT ALL. NOT my thing. NOT what I like in LOOKS too. NO offense to you who love them.

I like traditional firearms in LOOKS and in actions the MOST although I do love very SPECIFIC Glock pistols (The 19!) and only a COUPLE of other semi automatic pistols and one CT made Marlin Papoose.

Traditional = my former heavier lever action rifles, my former d/a revolvers, my former s/a revolvers and my LAST 2 CZ bolt action rifles which I recently gifted to my husband but I can still use them when I choose to shoot.

CZ 457 Lux - CZ-USA

The 457 Lux has crisp iron sights and a European-patterned stock.

cz-usa.com

Plus I shot the sweet CZ .223 bolt action rifle too. The one of my husband's that we gifted to our friend Veteran that is like a nephew to me. I shot one box of factory ammo that my FFL man GIFTED TO ME and my husband's reloaded ammo out of that rifle.

Personally, I do NOT care for the .223 cartridge. It is OKAY but I did not LOVE IT like a 22wmr cartridge coming out of a rifle.

I do realize that IS CONTRARY to what MOST people love because to THEM .223 is just perfect for them. LOL

I did NOT like shooting IT (.223) as I did when it came to my other former cartridges coming out of PISTOL CALIBER RIFLES (With matching handguns calibers!) and I did NOT like it as much as I LIKED shooting a 30-30 WIN. rifle too.

I would and DID TAKE a 30-30 Win. rifle over a .223 rifle in the past and as my FIRST CF RIFLE when I moved out west.

I would and DID TAKE a 22wmr rifle in a LEVER ACTION rifle - my first 22wmr rifle for ME (NOT for my husband of course.) too. That was a heavy but beautiful, tack driving rifle in walnut.

So when I decided to try a 22wmr rifle in a BOLT ACTION in the CZ brand... I found out that I LOVED that cartridge as much as I did in the former HEAVY lever action rifle.

If someone GAVE ME a .223 rifle no matter what it was WORTH and no matter what BRAND NAME IT WAS IN - I would GIVE IT to my husband or pass it on or SELL IT too.

I would still take and USE 22wmr and 22lr rifles over ANY single .223 rifle as a older, somewhat handicapped lady just as I would when I was a YOUNGER and stronger lady too.

And I would TAKE a SWEET 30-30 WIN. rifle FIRST, a sweet 45Long Colt rifle and a sweet 357Magnum rifle OVER ANY .223 rifle ANY DAY OF THE YEAR if I still OWNED and shot them as I did in the past.

I would even shoot my husband's RELOADED 45-70 ammunition that he RELOADED special for ME out of one of HIS former rifles or HIS present 45-70 rifle OVER a .223 rifle especially if I was still in my 50's. (I will be 72 years old this summer.)

A .223 cartridge does NOTHING FOR ME. NO offense.

A 22wmr DOES something for me. Yeah - RF!

So does 22lr. Yeah - RF!

So did other CF calibers - cartridges for me - very SPECIFIC ones over the years that I chose for ME and I had and have NO regrets on any of my choices in firearms ever.

I can carry a box of 50 rounds of 22wmr easily. I do NOT think that the cost of 22wmr is that high if you watched your prices in the PAST and even if it did cost more than 22lr as AN EXAMPLE - if you LOVE SHOOTING IT and want it for a specific purpose - BUY it!

A FACTORY LOADED BOX of .223 ammo holds 20 rounds and I have NO clue what it costs in the store since I do NOT buy it and my husband reloads .223 ammo for HIS one rifle. FIFTY ROUNDS of factory loaded .223 ammo must cost more than 50 rounds of 22wmr but I could be WRONG. But I do not think so.

I have NO clue what MY husband's .223 reloaded ammo costs for HIM to reload because he PLANNED AHEAD and he did not pay crazy @@@ prices for the fake/real so called shortages.

As many firearms as some people own and in MANY calibers not counting ALL of their factory ammo and reloaded ammo - reloading STOCK... I can't see a BOX OF 50 ROUNDS of 22wmr BREAKING ANY PERSON'S BANK especially if they MIX IT IN WITH SHOOTING 22LR AMMO. LOL Even if a person was a NEWBIE and/or on a LIMITED BUDGET.

PLUS I would STILL SHOOT a 22wmr CZ RIFLE even if COST MUCH MORE than what WE paid for it in the PAST. My husband and I planned ahead and we have enough on hand for BOTH OF US. And if we ran out - we would still buy MORE especially for me but we do not have to do that since I do not shoot that much any longer. But he still does on a VERY regular basis - several times per week and he would BUY IT if he needed/wanted it.

IF anyone LOVES shooting the 22wmr in a lever action rifle as I did even if some beautiful rifles are much HEAVIER for older bones - you can have a boat load of FUN shooting that lever action rifle as you can with your bolt action rifle too!

Old Lady Cate

PS: I have a friend in ID who loves .17 HMR rifles or maybe he only has one rifle (?) in that caliber now. That '17' NEVER interested me at all but many people LIKE their choices! Just as I LIKED/LIKE my choices.

 

[Member 52301]

I enjoy smaller caliber rifles. So in my collection, I have rifles in 22 magnum and 223, and also some "intermediate" between the two, including 222 and 22 Hornet.

I like them all. You mention downloading 223 to perform more like the 22 Magnum, so I assume you handload or are open to handloading/reloading your own ammo. For a handloader, lots of options open up, and in that case, I see less support for holding a 22 mag in my collection. Generally (there are exceptions) 22 mag ammo is not regarded as accurate as some other smaller CF calibers. I find the 22 Hornet can be loaded to a nice range between the 22 LR and the 222 or 223, and both the Hornets I've owned were good shooters. So if either my 22 mag rifles or the 22 Hornets were on the chopping block, I personally would keep the Hornet as a handloader. I haven't tried downloading 223 for plinking ammo or use more in the purpose of the 22 mag, but I know others do. Nice thing about loading 223 is that brass is plentiful. Keep some primers and suitable powder on hand, and you should always be able to make ammo. There have been periods where 22 mag ammo is harder to find. That said, you strike me as the type who doesn't wait to go find ammo when everyone else is also looking, but rather one who keeps a reasonable amount stashed away.

Now if you don't (or won't) handload, I definitely see a stronger case for the 22 mag. I enjoy shooting both of my CZ 452 rifles in 22 mag. But I enjoy the 527 rifles in 22 Hornet more.

My MT husband, not my late husband, owned several 22 caliber rifles (22Hornet, 22-250, 220Swift.) that he RELOADED for in the past too. I never shot those rifles of his and he sold them before I knew him. He is telling me this as I type to you now.

He scaled back in all of his firearm calibers when he downsized and consolidated a bunch of firearms.

He had and still has RF firearms in 22lr and 22wmr.

My late husband only owned 2 firearm calibers TOTAL, by choice, and they were in 22lr and in 357Magnum.

Cate

 

[Spitpatch]

There is a relatively huge gap in power that exists between 22lr and the Hornet. The .22 WMR fills that slot perfectly. As to comparison with the 17HMR, in my experience once the game is larger than a squirrel, the WMR is a better killer. Penetration is the key on "bigger" stuff.

As to accuracy, both cartridges suffer from the sad fact that "target" or "match grade" ammo was never developed for them. They are hunting cartridges, and predictably, the ammo reflects that with none of the attention or expense given to the .22lr in that regard. Both are plenty accurate for the purposes they were designed.

After "building" on a 17HMR with every after-market improvement available, and spending a couple years with it in gopher (sage rat) fields, Prairie Dog towns, I have decided I like the 22WMR a lot better. In a Bullberry barreled Contender Carbine, it is every bit as accurate as the HMR.

The old Winchester load of the 40gr Hollowpoint is still my stalwart for accuracy and effect on game, after having tried just about everything else.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

I like 22 mag mainly just cuz of its versatility. I have 22 mag revolvers from 1.5" barrels to 16". Great fun. Don't think it can compare to .223 for ballistics or reliabilty etc. but great cartridge for what it is. Has anybody shot the armscor 22 TCM cartridge?

Heritage 22mag revolver pistol


Naa 22 mag sidewinder