17 or 21?

[MrNiceGuy]

With that said.
9mm was developed as an injuring round. Yes.Zee Furur?(who cares) wanted to kill all of us but his people knew that injuring would take more men off the line.

Now the 45 ACP was specifically developed as a man stopper,drop them in their tracks caliber.

But if you must have a 45acp then a hi-capacity 1911 would do the job, I wouldn't trust my life on a glock 40sw/45acp/10mm/357sig or whatever calibers they make'em....

I see that you both get your gun facts from the same person.
Whoever that person is should have their lips stapled shut.

I advise you both to do at least some research before you go re-regurgitating this unwashed tripe.

 

[Trlsmn]

That's a stretch. I'd say a properly loaded .380 may be a more effective killing round on human targets over an improperly 44mag, however, a properly loaded 44.mag will walk big time on anything the .380 can muster. Still, in general, shot placement will be more of a deciding factor.

I disagree, the .44 mag is 100 times more likely to be sitting at home guarding your socks where as my .380 is always in my pocket and hardly even noticed.

 

[chemist]

All the improvements in 9mm ammo have also been applied to .45, and some of the choices out there now are absolutely devastating - without undue risk of overpenetration.

For daily carry ammo in .45 ACP I still go for high reliability over high tech, but that hasn't stopped me from picking up on some 185gr. DPX, 200gr. TAP +P, and of course the infamous Gold Dots.

 

[PinkhamR]

I disagree, the .44 mag is 100 times more likely to be sitting at home guarding your socks where as my .380 is always in my pocket and hardly even noticed.

What brand of .380 ??? I have the Walther PP Super (in 9x18 Ultra) that works for me. Sort of a .380 on steriods ....

 

[mjbskwim]

I see that you both get your gun facts from the same person.
Whoever that person is should have their lips stapled shut.

I advise you both to do at least some research before you go re-regurgitating this unwashed tripe.

Did I hurt your feelings somehow?
These are fact there brother,just facts.I did look them up a long time ago.
Maybe you should do the same

And since we are all calling each other ignorant on this site,I'm guessing you are as ignorant as the nice guy.

titsonritz
Oh ouch, MrNiceGuy not playing very nice, I love it and agree 100%. The level of ignorance on this subject amazes me.

 

[Trlsmn]

What brand of .380 ??? I have the Walther PP Super (in 9x18 Ultra) that works for me. Sort of a .380 on steriods ....

I just carry an LCP but I literally carry it 24/7/365 when I put my pants on.

 

[mjbskwim]

Please feel free to post the source(s) of your “facts”. Personally, I don’t put a whole lot of stock into hyped up internet lore nor paper ballistic. Bottom line all handgun calibers are pathetic “man-stoppers” and to suggest the 45acp is some sort of magic death ray in pure nonsense.

Well go back and read my post again.Then see what I DIDN'T SAY

It's a joke I use when men are buying a 9.

But the German engineers knew that if they killed the US soldiers,that would take 1 guy off the line.
Hitler liked the thought of killing all of us.
The engineers knew if they just wounded us,it would take 3 guys off the line.2 guys to carry the wounded guy.

Now go back to the early 1900s,when we were in the Philippines.The philippinos where high on some local plant that increased their adrenaline.They would tie straps around their arms and legs,so if they got shot in them they could still attack and not bleed out.And when our boys shot them with the 38's they would still get chopped up by the warriors with machetes.

Along came John Moses Browning and the 1911 in what else? 45acp.

The gun was developed with taking down the aggressor and killing them.
Not injuring them like the 9mm was by the Germans.

It is not the #1 one shot kill champ and hasn't been that I know of.It is too big for most hands and there for not as controllable.
The 40S&W holds that position.
For me,it fits well and points well.I can hit most anything,within 40yards,I aim for.If you have small hands,it won't be very effective.
It still has more energy than most any 9mm round.And putting an attacker down is a good thing.

Now go investigate how many times,with both rounds,a person has gotten up and ran away.Or who didn't die from the calibers multiple shots.

I believe history will show you that the 9mm has had a bad reputation for over penetrating and not killing as good.

That's the point I was making,not that the 45 was thee best round anyone could ever get.

I wonder why a lot of police forces did away with the 9mm?
Seems they went with the 40 or 45acp.

Shot placement is the most important aspect of all this. A454 Casull is worthless for defense,if you are afraid to shoot it or can't aim it.

But a 22 (or the 380 for this thread) is perfect if you can place the shot where you want it.Yes,a 22.But you have to be able to put all the rounds thru the heart/head

Just sayin'

 

[MrNiceGuy]

Just sayin'

You should stop. You're not good at it and you're making yourself look bad.

I dont want to go as far as saying that you're a blowhard... but it's just such a perfect word to describe you. Your "facts" are just silly to say the least. Thankfully they are contradicted by reality.

For your research, I'll start you off with some light reading.

Here's a quick overview of the history of the 9mm round
9x19mm Parabellum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And for the love of god, dont bring up Hitler. The 9mm was in use by the German military when Hitler was still a wandering hippy painter. He had absolutely nothing to do with the use, design, adoption, or anything else for that matter.

Simply put, saying that the 9mm round was designed to "wound rather than kill" is just ignorant... and perpetuating that ignorance is disgraceful.

Then see what I DIDN'T SAY

If you cant defend what you DID say, you try to switch focus to what you "didnt say"?

That's just sad.

 

[mjz52]

Try a 21 before you buy one, if you have smallish hands, it may not work for you...heck, I have largish hands, and tried twice, but never could get used to them....

That's why I got the 21SF...fits my hands perfect!

Try it, you'll like it....

 

[TapRackNGo]

Have both, get both.

 

[FIDO6]

I had a 21, I dumped it due to the unsupported chamber. Otherwise a great piece.

 

[oasis618]

I prefer 17 but stick with 21 due to legalities.

 

[novamind]

Wow, First off I vote for the Glock 17, Next I vote .45acp. I have shot .380, and .44 mag I'll take >44mag. Except for the nite flash from the barrel, which equals short term total tempory blindness. Then I'll take the .380.

 

[Lloyd Braun]

I have heard a guy should have a couple glock 9mms around with 2k rounds to go with it.

With that said.
9mm was developed as an injuring round. Yes.Zee Furur?(who cares) wanted to kill all of us but his people knew that injuring would take more men off the line.

Now the 45 ACP was specifically developed as a man stopper,drop them in their tracks caliber.

The chances of you needing to find ammo,more than you can find now are pretty slim.There will be ammo and plenty of guns to take care of what ever we need.
There won't be the big gun battles in the streets.There isn't anyone stupid enough to come here and fight us like that.

Just sayin'

the 9mm developed as an injuring round? non-sense!
i dont know where you got that notion but when the cartridge was developed there was no such notion of just wanting to "injure" on the battlefield. ive read a ton of info on the cartridge and never read that anywhere.

 

[novamind]

Wow, First off I vote for the Glock 17, Next I vote .45acp. I have shot .380, and .44 mag I'll take >44mag. Except for the nite flash from the barrel, which equals short term total tempory blindness. Then I'll take the .380.

 

[mjbskwim]

Can't kill a fly with the 9mm?hmmm don't remember that one.

I'm not buying the rest of your post for one reason

It's about survival and bullets kill no matter what they are! Even when shot from a handgun

First the 9mm aren't really killers,then any caliber,even a 22 will kill you,even from a handgun.

<broken link removed>

A 45 generally has about 100 ft#s more energy than a 9mm,giving it more knock down power.

Even a 38 will kill a MoFo and destroy organs.

It all comes down to shot placement.If yoy hit a human in the head it will usually kill them

I have to take the dogs out or I would go on.

I love the 9mm,it has to be thee best round ever,way better than the 45acp.

Is that better?

 

[hendrixfan]

I like the option of a Glock 22. You can then get barrels for a .357 sig or 9mm, and you have a .40. If SHTF is a true concern if you had the ability to shoot both .40(what most law enforcement agencies around here use) and 9mm I would think you have as good as chance at finding ammunition as anything. Plus 9mm is cheaper to practice with and the .40 has a bit more energy.

Which is more deadly 4 .357 mag shots into center mass or a .22lr from less than a 2" barrel into the arm?

In the unfortunate case of Trooper Coates it was the .22 that went across the body and into his heart...

No matter what size bullet it has to hit something that counts.

 

[CWO USN]

Just remember...carry a .45. Why? Because they don't make a 46!

 

[SVT-ROY]

17, cheaper to get more practice rounds down range. As we all know in the right hands a bug is devastating. And its easier to make home armor to defeat a. 45.

 

[Wenis]

Oh yeah..... 10mm!

Boom. Roasted.





j/k, I would get the G17. I have a Kimber in 45acp and the ammo is just so much more expensive to shoot and sometimes hard to find. I am wavering between 9mm semiautos right now. I think it'll end up being a SW MP9 Pro Series, but the G17/G19 and XDm9 keeps popping into my mind too.