Slug Barrel Q's

[JOePOe]

Hello, I've been looking at Hornadys SST 12g slugs and they say they are pretty accurate up to 200 yards? But it says rifled barrels only??
If I install a rifled barrel can i still shoot reg bird/ooBuck through it or not? Because the idea of having a badass longrange shotty sounds
cool but not if I cant do anything else with it?? Dunno

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[Bon Sauvage]

If you shoot bird or buckshot through your rifled barrel it will impart a spin to the load giving your pattern a "donut" effect. Not a great idea.

 

[Jamie6.5]

A rifled barrel opens up your pattern and scatters shot worse than a cylinder (no choke) barrel.
Best to get both if you want to use it for both.

 

[Bon Sauvage]

Holland & Holland got around the donut effect by creating a Paradox Gun. The last three inches or so of barrel was rifled while the rest of the barrel was smooth. This allowed either shot or slugs to be used effectively. Perhaps some makers still make a paradox barrel. It might be worth a search if you really want one gun to do it all.

 

[keystir]

Bottom line, if you want to shoot sabot slugs you will want a rifled barrel. If you want to shoot buck/bird shot you will need a smoothbore. If you want to do both, buy an extra barrel. Unless your planning on hunting in an area that is shotgun only, I would recommend just using rifled slugs. You'll get decent but not great accuracy at much less cost.

P.S. - There really is no such thing as a "badass long range shotty"

 

[JOePOe]

Perfect, ? I was thinking it would be kinda cool to scope/tripod/barrel a 12g that could be accurate at 200 yards......that my friend would be kinda sorta badass....just because and nothing more?

 

[PBinWA]

Check out the Savage 212, it has a good rep for an accurate slug gun:

Savage Arms

 

[DeanMk]

Holland & Holland got around the donut effect by creating a Paradox Gun. The last three inches or so of barrel was rifled while the rest of the barrel was smooth. This allowed either shot or slugs to be used effectively. Perhaps some makers still make a paradox barrel. It might be worth a search if you really want one gun to do it all.

I think there are makers that actually offer that for smoothbore shotguns that are capable of using removable chokes.
I remember T/C made a version of their Contender back in the late 60's or early 70's that was capale of shooting either a .45 Colt cartridege or a .410 shotgun shell.
When the .410 was used, an attachment was screwed onto the end of the barrel that had 6 straight grooves in it. This straightened out the otherwise spinning shot.
Personally, I'm happy with a regular ol' Foster slug, but I don't do that much deer hunting anymore, too.


Dean

 

[Blitzkrieg]

My handloaded saboted roundballs are very accurate out of most smoothbores. My suggestion is not a different barrel but trying various sabot loads

Both my SPAS 12 and my FN SLP MK 1 are smoothbores with removable chokes and I shoot improved cylinder.. plenty accurate and powerful for out to 125 yards +

 

[DeanMk]

Maybe that's the next generation in slug technology.
Self spinning sabots for smoothbores.


Dean

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Mine don't spin but are quite accurate.. and the Fosters with the "rifling" are purely cosmetic

 

[DeanMk]

Actually, Blitzkrieg, that "rifling" does serve a purpose.
It helps the slug move through a choked barrel easier.
Think of it as a "crush zone".
The fringe benefit is that it also helps the slug maintain more velocity as it moves down the barrel.
As for the rifling inducing spin (which I think was the underlying point of your comment), it has to.
There's nothing to stop the slug from spinning.
Does it spin like a rifle bullet?
Most likely not, but some spin has to be induced. 1 in 100?, 1 in 200?
Does that spin have an affect on accuracy? Who's to say, but the rifling is more than cosmetic.



Dean

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Fosters don't even make full contact with a bore so there's no spin unless they get a little from air passage after they leave the bore. One must be careful about slugs vs various chokes vs some slug types, as well

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot46.htm

 

[DeanMk]

Interesting article. Thanks for posting that. Enjoyable read.
I don't know where you got the notion that the sides of a rifled slug do not make contact with the bore of a shotgun, but I think that is an incorrect statement.
The back of the Foster slug is hollow so that the heat and pressure from the gases pushing the slug down the barrel flare the opening out.
This seals the gases and prevents them from leaking past the slug, thus not only is "optimum" performance ensured, but also a fired slug will not lodge itself half way down the barrel, because of those expanding gases leaking past the slug.
If you've ever seen a fired Foster slug (at least one that retained most of its original form), you've no doubt noticed the "rifling" is deformed. This is because it was pushed against the sides of the barrel.
So, (and this is JMHO), I feel the sides of a Foster slug do in fact, contact the bore of a shotgun barrel, for the reasons I just listed.
I still say the fact that those ribs ("rifling") are angled is what induces a slight spin on the slug.
Its physics - the ribs suggest a certain amount of twisting movement from the slug (it would be the same idea that allows a wedge to move things). With no other force to stop the slug from doing so, I cannot see why it would not spin as it traveled to its target.
Again, it may not be much spin, but its still spinning.
You are correct about matching slugs to barrels, though. The link in your prior post proves that.



Dean

 

[Member 18201]

I have used rifled choke tubes made by Cation for 25 years, and they work quite well. Winchester 1 ounce slugs will cut a 3 shot cloverleaf at 50 yards with bead sights on my 870.

RIFLED CHOKE TUBE | Brownells

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Interesting article. Thanks for posting that. Enjoyable read.
I don't know where you got the notion that the sides of a rifled slug do not make contact with the bore of a shotgun, but I think that is an incorrect statement.
The back of the Foster slug is hollow so that the heat and pressure from the gases pushing the slug down the barrel flare the opening out.
This seals the gases and prevents them from leaking past the slug, thus not only is "optimum" performance ensured, but also a fired slug will not lodge itself half way down the barrel, because of those expanding gases leaking past the slug.
If you've ever seen a fired Foster slug (at least one that retained most of its original form), you've no doubt noticed the "rifling" is deformed. This is because it was pushed against the sides of the barrel.
So, (and this is JMHO), I feel the sides of a Foster slug do in fact, contact the bore of a shotgun barrel, for the reasons I just listed.
I still say the fact that those ribs ("rifling") are angled is what induces a slight spin on the slug.
Its physics - the ribs suggest a certain amount of twisting movement from the slug (it would be the same idea that allows a wedge to move things). With no other force to stop the slug from doing so, I cannot see why it would not spin as it traveled to its target.
Again, it may not be much spin, but its still spinning.
You are correct about matching slugs to barrels, though. The link in your prior post proves that.



Dean

The sides of most (especially foster type) slugs are far smaller than bore diameter and do not make contact except something similar to a rattle, this is why they generally so inacurate in such barrels. The impetus of the wad behind them is their only accuracy factor. Now my handloads are .662 balls with a sabot shotcup and fit sort of tight like a musket ball and are reasonably accurate for slugs

12 ga bores are .72 to .80

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauge_(bore_diameter)

 

[DeanMk]

The sides of most (especially foster type) slugs are far smaller than bore diameter and do not make contact except something similar to a rattle, this is why they generally so inacurate in such barrels. The impetus of the wad behind them is their only accuracy factor.

A picture from the BO'T link you posted earlier...

Sides don't appear "skinny" here, but I can see you'll keep arguing this until we're both blue in the face, so let's just agree to disagree and get on with our lives.
I think we're straying a little off the point of the thread anyway.


Dean

 

[Blitzkrieg]

OK, here's what I mean.. this is a typical Foster type slug.. a Lyman mold.. .705 diameter.. will not fill the bore of a typical 12 GA

Lyman 1-Cavity Shotshell Foster Slug Bullet Mold 12 Ga (705 Diameter)

 

[DeanMk]

OK, here's what I mean.. this is a typical Foster type slug.. a Lyman mold.. .705 diameter.. will not fill the bore of a typical 12 GA

Lyman 1-Cavity Shotshell Foster Slug Bullet Mold 12 Ga (705 Diameter)

Where's the hollow base?
Regardless of what Lyman is calling it, I don't regard that as Foster's design for a shotgun slug.
In that Box O'Truth link, they mentioned that a Foster slug work like a dart, but a shuttlecock is a better example.

Ok, really straying off topic. My last response on Foster slugs in this thread, unless it relates to the OP's question.



Dean