Pistol optics

[Josh89]

So I'm thinking about getting one of base plates that replaces the rear sight on my glock just to try out before I purchase a mos glock.has anybody uses one and was prettt happy with the results and what red dot did you use.im looking for a inexpensive one that will hold up for a bit before I purchase a new glock and a vortex viper.

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[clearconscience]

I have been reading and looking into this a lot. From my research I found a lot of people like the Burris fastfire for a less expensive option.
And from what I read those rear sight red dot mounts are actually pretty good.

I have no real world experience though.
Red dots are great for target shooting and competition but not so much for self defense.

I would never trust anything that requires batteries for self defense

 

[Josh89]

I have been reading and looking into this a lot. From my research I found a lot of people like the Burris fastfire for a less expensive option.
And from what I read those rear sight red dot mounts are actually pretty good.

I have no real world experience though.
Red dots are great for target shooting and competition but not so much for self defense.

I would never trust anything that requires batteries for self defense

Yea I agree,I'd want co witness sights if I was gonna carry it,mostly just want it for a range toy,slap the 50 round drum mag in and go to town

 

[salmonriverjohn]

I have a Burris fast fire 111 on a ruger 22/45 lite that is at least as accurate as I am, so far I've pleased with it.
My son is an expert marksman with tons of training provided by the gov. And I watched him wack a crow free hand at a smidge over 100 yards first shot, he gave it back and his words were "accurate little ba$turd, nice".

 

[ORYGUNHolsterCompany]

I have installed a bunch of those type of adapters for reddots. They are a great way for a person to figure out if the red dot is a good choice for them without any permanent modifications to their slide or the expense of buyinf a whole new slide or firearm (mos/core etc).

Co-witness is not something I like on pistols with red dots personally as they tend to draw my eye and or block the already small sight window of most pistol style optics. I find tritium and fiber optics to be especially terrible for drawing the eye away from the dot. The flat black sights less so, but still obtrusive IMO.

 

[EPS]

I got one right here but the only problem is my vortex viper will not arrive till tomorrow afternoon so after I go to work and return on Thursday morning I should have it installed by Thursday afternoon and will let you know

 

[EPS]

I ordered the viper last week from Midway they had a sale

 

[salmonriverjohn]

View attachment 354201 View attachment 354202 I ordered the viper last week from Midway they had a sale

What was the sale price EPS?

 

[RicInOR]

here's my story.

I shoot Smiths. I bought the Viper - I could not find a base plate for it. I guess I could have found a machinist to make one ...

So, I bought the Razor - and installed the rear sight replacement mount as you describe.

I have not stressed the pistol enough to say good/bad. Only maybe 250 rounds.



Since I still had the Viper, I bought a new gun for it. ... The CORE - already milled.



Some things I have heard over this past year - about various dots
- one can set the elevation / horizontal on top, but the set screws are to the rear, so you have to remove the rear sight on the pistol to lock adjust. Which means you can't use suppressor height sights to co-witness.

There are shops around which will mill your top slide, or you can just buy another one. (hard to justify to keep things inexpensive)

The Razor takes what feels like forever to turn on - I think it is really 2 seconds.

30,000 hours of battery life is a marketing term

Some people have strong opinions on how to change the battery - and if you do that a couple of times a year, it is part of your decision making.

Someone here on the site, search for red dot and my user name it should pop up, sells a nice rail which replaces your rear sight. That can give you a lot more options.


If you spend less than the ~250-300 a Viper costs, I am not sure the sight would stand up to a pistol - unless you mount to the frame rather than the slide. Just my suspicion.



Personally, I like the idea, I hope it works out for me. Ask me come end of summer when I have a few months competing.



Now, how do I get a red dot attached to my single stack carry gun ....

 

[EPS]

Well it kinda a sale I looked around for vipers on line and they all were around $230 then midway had it for 230 plus free shipping and I got a 50 dollar gift card from midway to use on my next purchase from them so basically $180 buck 's the rear site mount was $20 bucks

 

[EPS]

here's my story.

I shoot Smiths. I bought the Viper - I could not find a base plate for it. I guess I could have found a machinist to make one ...

So, I bought the Razor - and installed the rear sight replacement mount as you describe.

I have not stressed the pistol enough to say good/bad. Only maybe 250 rounds.



Since I still had the Viper, I bought a new gun for it. ... The CORE - already milled.



Some things I have heard over this past year - about various dots
- one can set the elevation / horizontal on top, but the set screws are to the rear, so you have to remove the rear sight on the pistol to lock adjust. Which means you can't use suppressor height sights to co-witness.

There are shops around which will mill your top slide, or you can just buy another one. (hard to justify to keep things inexpensive)

The Razor takes what feels like forever to turn on - I think it is really 2 seconds.

30,000 hours of battery life is a marketing term

Some people have strong opinions on how to change the battery - and if you do that a couple of times a year, it is part of your decision making.

Someone here on the site, search for red dot and my user name it should pop up, sells a nice rail which replaces your rear sight. That can give you a lot more options.


If you spend less than the ~250-300 a Viper costs, I am not sure the sight would stand up to a pistol - unless you mount to the frame rather than the slide. Just my suspicion.



Personally, I like the idea, I hope it works out for me. Ask me come end of summer when I have a few months competing.



Now, how do I get a red dot attached to my single stack carry gun ....

If I like it I will have my slide milled for a permanent mount or just buy a milled slide

 

[EPS]

I looked at the glock store and Lenny recommend the viper for a good first one because of the price and the warranty there are some cheaper ones out there that people say are good but if you go for one like a tigicon or something your talking bout 500 bucks give or take a 100 bucks

 

[NWMA]

In a few more years, red dots on pistols will be standard. The trend is already accelerating.

On rifles, everyone agrees on the need for skill with irons, but optics (yes, even with batteries) are common place. When is the last time you saw a picture of a soldier's rifle without a modern optic?

I've attended and taught a number of rifle classes. I can remember classes when only a third of the class had optics, but now that's the exception. Honestly I can't remember the last class I attended where anyone used irons only. Why is that? Because they give you capabilities exceeding what is possible with iron sights.

The same trend is happening with pistols and will accelerate. The MOS and CORE systems are evidence of that, not to mention the increasing numbers of small shops offering slide work (a much better solution IMO).

Yes, people can accomplish amazing things with irons. But I suspect if the gun fighters of old were alive today they would adopt every advantage they could, including red dots.

No amount of training can overcome age and declining eye sight; many guys I know simply can't focus on the front sight at all. Red dots are an excellent solution for that problem.

With attention to marksmanship, the red dot pistol will offer greater capability at distance. Distances shots are rare in self-protection scenarios but they happen. Remember this incident, or <broken link removed> . That can obviously be done with irons but a good red dot will make that job easier. Likewise with any problem that is closer...imagine a bad guy's elbow or foot sticking out beyond cover. Or the need to take an eyeball shot at room distance. Any situation requiring that additional level of marksmanship will be aided by a dot.

A properly set up red dot pistol will have iron sights. These serve a few functions...for one they are useful to verify that your dot has maintained its zero by checking the sight picture before you leave the house. Irons are also useful in training...you have many thousands of repetitions finding the sights with your eyes as you drive the pistol towards the target, so the irons act as training wheels to help you find the dot. Once the dot is found then you can ignore the sights. And of course the irons are there if the dot should fail, which takes all of a split second to acquire your irons as you normally do.

If your red dot is just intended as a range toy then it really doesn't matter which one you pick up. But if you mean it for serious business that means Trijicon RMR or Leupold Deltapoint Pro.

And if the idea of batteries is just out of the question, there are the dual illumination models.

 

[old11bravo]

Thank you for that insightful post NWMA!

My 80 year old father, who loves shooting, is the very reason I began looking into these sights. My pops is 80 but still healthy and fit for his age. His eyes aren't that great though and he often complains of it when we go shooting. Now he's also very ornery, resistant to change and things he might consider gimmicky. That's why I knew I would have to buy the first pistol with a dot sight. So I did..... and he loved it! He liked it so much he ended up sending his Glock 21 Gen 4 out to Suarez for a milling job, Trijicon RM06 installation and suppressor sight install. He's like a kid anticipating Christmas morning waiting for that Glock to come back.

Mission accomplished!