Bob Vogel Arrested

[VinnieBoomBah]

For anyone not up to speed on Larry Vickers

Larry Vickers - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[trukinbear]

I don't know who Ron cohen is but I tend to think Larry got nabbed on something that's totally unconstitutional. I don't like anyone getting prosecuted for a law that is a blatant violation of our rights. Just because it's a law that doesn't mean it's right. The only thing keeping may of us from being outlaws in the northwest is the inability of the democrat majorities to get the guns banned outright, which is exactly what they want.

I know a bunch of Democrats who own guns, there are even clubs for them. Some are even in my family, my granddaughter is crazy liberal, but also a strong supporter of the 2nd amendment, a gun collector (plus she's starting to reload), and a hell of a good shot just like her brother another pro gun liberal. I'm not saying that the people who are trying to pass laws that affect gun rights aren't liberals, but they don't represent ALL liberals. Hell, 2 boats over from where I'm moored is an elderly flag waving MAGA couple (their TV with Fox News is deafning) that say bad things about guns, gun owners, and gun rights every time they see me with a gun (which is every time they see me) so I believe your stereotypes are just that, and create an 'other' group to demonize. Neither side is homogeneous...

 

[monks]

I know a bunch of Democrats who own guns, there are even clubs for them. Some are even in my family, my granddaughter is crazy liberal, but also a strong supporter of the 2nd amendment, a gun collector (plus she's starting to reload), and a hell of a good shot just like her brother another pro gun liberal. I'm not saying that the people who are trying to pass laws that affect gun rights aren't liberals, but they don't represent ALL liberals. Hell, 2 boats over from where I'm moored is an elderly flag waving MAGA couple (their TV with Fox News is deafning) that say bad things about guns, gun owners, and gun rights every time they see me with a gun (which is every time they see me) so I believe your stereotypes are just that, and create an 'other' group to demonize. Neither side is homogeneous...

I know some gun owning lefties too, but they still always vote for the gun banners. Every stinking time! I don't have much patience for anyone who wants to restrict my rights or voted for the ones who do.

 

[trukinbear]

I know some gun owning lefties too, but they still always vote for the gun banners. Every stinking time! I don't have much patience for anyone who wants to restrict my rights or voted for the ones who do.

I don't pretend to know how someone else votes, while I would prefer they not vote my rights away it isn't my business to know how they vote... nor would I likely believe what they said if I asked, because human nature is to tell me what I want to hear, or at least what won't make me go postal.

 

[Jade Falcon]

For anyone not up to speed on Larry Vickers

Larry Vickers - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Some douche canoe over on GlockTalk gave me smack for condemning this clown when he got arrested and/or sentenced. Apparently, it's okay when gun owners break the law, just not those pesky anti-gun Democrats!

At least, according to him.

 

[CountryGent]

Pity he didn't get actual time in the joint. But with a felony conviction and having to register as a sex offender, he's pretty much screwed for life. Zero empathy for people who prey on children.

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

Larry Vickers got nabbed for possession of full auto HK MP5 variants, Glock 18s, FN/FAL, M240, FAMAS, and conspiracy to import Russian select fire AKs. He has not been sentenced yet. I am sure it will be longer than your average urban drive-by shooter caught with Glock switchs. Although Larry has been a "don't you know who I am?" type of douche, God forbid a man have hobbies.

Ron Cohen, the CEO of Sig Sauer in the United States, was convicted in Germany for illegally exporting around 38,000 SP2022 pistols from Germany, via the U.S., to Colombia in violation of Germany's weapons export restrictions to conflict zones. Not my circus, not my monkeys, don't care.

Are you thinking of Will Hayden, star of the reality show Sons of Guns, convicted in 2017 of aggravated and forcible rape of two girls over two decades and abusing his own daughter? He received three life sentences plus 40 years without parole and is currently incarcerated at Louisiana State Penitentiary.

Or former Team GLOCK shooting coach William Abbate who was convicted in Henry County, Georgia, on one count of child molestation for providing a sex toy to a minor. While he originally faced 24 counts including aggravated child molestation and statutory rape, he was acquitted of 23 of them. Note: my search results did not provide the final, exact date-specific length of the prison sentence handed down on February 15, 2013, only the maximum potential sentence of 20 years.

Benefit of the doubt in he said, she said until evidence comes out, but you will be shunned from the community if found guilty.

 

[Jade Falcon]

God forbid a man have hobbies.

Do those "hobbies" include conspiring with a corrupt Fire Chief to use his position to illegally obtain and hold NFA firearms?

 

[1911Fanatic]

I know a bunch of Democrats who own guns, there are even clubs for them. Some are even in my family, my granddaughter is crazy liberal, but also a strong supporter of the 2nd amendment, a gun collector (plus she's starting to reload), and a hell of a good shot just like her brother another pro gun liberal. I'm not saying that the people who are trying to pass laws that affect gun rights aren't liberals, but they don't represent ALL liberals. Hell, 2 boats over from where I'm moored is an elderly flag waving MAGA couple (their TV with Fox News is deafning) that say bad things about guns, gun owners, and gun rights every time they see me with a gun (which is every time they see me) so I believe your stereotypes are just that, and create an 'other' group to demonize. Neither side is homogeneous...

Those kind of people that demonize the 2nd amendment, want to ban guns, and magazines, etc. are the first people who cry for help when they need the protection of a good guy with a gun, but they were too lazy or stupid to take responsibility for their own safety. Those people are exactly the kind of people that I won't help or protect.

I have had this type of situation before with my neighbors behind my fence and my neighbor next door. You make your bed and you lay down in it. I am not intervening as an armed citizen on the behalf of stupid people. My guns and my skills are for defending myself and my family, not for shooting my neighbor who is beating the out of his girlfriend in public view that get's arrested, bailed out and his girlfriend keeps taking him back.

My next door neighbor knows I have a gun and asked me why couldn't have or wouldn't shoot that thug. I told him he can get off his bubblegum and go get his own gun and spend years training if he want's to do that. I also told him that he would likely spend at least many years in prison if he did just that.

Some people are beyond help, and some people just don't deserve help, especially my help. They can take their chances with 911.

Bear I am especially surprised to hear about your neighbors. Do they know you are a retired LEO? If so, then if I were their neighbor, the extent of my help would be to call 911 for them if something happened.

 

[trukinbear]

Those kind of people that demonize the 2nd amendment, want to ban guns, and magazines, etc. are the first people who cry for help when they need the protection of a good guy with a gun, but they were two lazy or stupid to take responsibility for their own safety. Those people are exactly the kind of people that I won't help or protect.

I have had this type of situation before with my neighbors behind my fence and my neighbor next door. You make your bed and you lay in it. I am not intervening as an armed citizen on the behalf of stupid people. My guns and my skills are for defending myself and my family, not for shooting my neighbor who is beating the out of his girlfriend in public view that get's arrested, bailed out and his girlfriend keeps taking him back.

My next door neighbor knows I have a gun and asked me why couldn't have wouldn't shoot that thug. I told him he can get off his bubblegum and go get his own gun and spend years training if he want's to do that. I also told him that he would likely spend at least many years in prison if he did just that.

Some people are beyond help, and some people just don't deserve help, especially my help. They can take their chances with 911.

Bear I am especially surprised to hear about your neighbors. Do they know you are a retired LEO?

They do... but our interactions have been purposely brief, I get the impression they don't see a difference. I don't really care, but I do find them to be quite curious if not the only seemingly anti gun wearers of the red cap I've encountered... who I guess are on the right side of some other issues other than 2A. Everyone has their own important issues, at least these haven't brought up the lizard people, but then I've hardly given them a chance to show their true colors. That being said I would not hesitate to come to their or anyone else's rescue - human life trumps politics every time. I seldom assume to know someone's political beliefs, but when they've got the hat, and flags It's hard not to notice. There are a lot of things that are more important...

 

[1911Fanatic]

They do... but our interactions have been purposely brief, I get the impression they don't see a difference. I don't really care, but I do find them to be quite curious if not the only seemingly anti gun wearers of the red cap I've encountered... who I guess are on the right side of some other issues other than 2A. Everyone has their own important issues, at least these haven't brought up the lizard people, but then I've hardly given them a chance to show their true colors. That being said I would not hesitate to come to their or anyone else's rescue - human life trumps politics every time. I seldom assume to know someone's political beliefs, but when they've got the hat, and flags It's hard not to notice. There are a lot of things that are more important...

I hear you. I am more judging people on their behavior. Take drug overdoses for example. If I encounter one in the community, I don't try to revive them. I no longer have a license and I am not required to render aid.

The reason that I don't is because the last time I did, when I brought the person back, I was promptly punched in the face by them Then I later found out the person had MRSA, and I had been laying my hands on them. And it gets worse, the same person OD'd again and died 3 weeks later. This person was a known Junkie that was known to everyone that I used to work with at the hospital. It's a cruel joke to have that happen. A person should only have to kill themselves and die once.

I am not risking my health, what I have left of it, because of someone else's poor choices. Same thing with using a gun to protect other's. I will defend myself, my family or my friends. But not that stupid blotch that lived behind my fence.

If the thug (yes he is a known gang member) was armed and shooting people, then I would intervene with my rifle from cover if I had the opportunity. But him beating her to a pulp with his fists, and he did beat her pretty good a couple of times, well let's just say not my monkey's not my circus. I have called the police on them, and that is as far as I was willing to go. I tend to mind my business.

There are certain people that I won't help. I used to try to save everybody all the time. I am not like that anymore. I am not going to risk prison or being sued in either a defense scenario, or a medical intervention unless the stakes are so high that I feel like there is no other option.

As far as people whacked out on drugs, it's such a small percent that actually turn their lives around, that I am really reluctant to bother. I have in fact called 911 and reported the location of a suspected OD out in the community before and they are trying to get me to check for a pulse, etc, do chest compressions and such, and I wouldn't do it. I am not exposing myself to their probable diseases and risking getting sick. I mean we aren't talking about a soccer mom or a senior citizen at a football game that has a heart attack or a siezure.

I lost my sister and a brother in law to drugs, so yeah, there are all sorts of people that I feel that it would be pointless to take a risk to help in a high stakes way. I have even cared for patients with AIDS that were a living walking biohazard. But out in the community I am not carrying PPE.

 

[trukinbear]

I hear you. I am more judging people on their behavior. Take drug overdoses for example. If I encounter one in the community, I don't try to revive them. I no longer have a license and I am not required to render aid.

The reason that I don't is because the last time I did, when I brought the person back, I was promptly punched in the face by them Then I later found out the person had MRSA, and I had been laying my hands on them. And it gets worse, the same person OD'd again and died 3 weeks later. This person was a known Junkie that was known to everyone that I used to work with at the hospital. It's a cruel joke to have that happen. A person should only have to kill themselves and die once.

I am not risking my health, what I have left of it, because of someone else's poor choices. Same thing with using a gun to protect other's. I will defend myself, my family or my friends. But not that stupid blotch that lived behind my fence.

If the thug (yes he is a known gang member) was armed and shooting people, then I would intervene with my rifle from cover if I had the opportunity. But him beating her to a pulp with his fists, and he did beat her pretty good a couple of times, well let's just say not my monkey's not my circus. I have called the police on them, and that is as far as I was willing to go. I tend to mind my business.

There are certain people that I won't help. I used to try to save everybody all the time. I am not like that anymore. I am not going to risk prison or being sued in either a defense scenario, or a medical intervention unless the stakes are so high that I feel like there is no other option.

As far as people whacked out on drugs, it's such a small percent that actually turn their lives around, that I am really reluctant to bother. I have in fact called 911 and reported the location of a suspected OD out in the community before and they are trying to get me to check for a pulse, etc, do chest compressions and such, and I wouldn't do it. I am not exposing myself to their probable diseases and risking getting sick. I mean we aren't talking about a soccer mom or a senior citizen at a football game that has a heart attack or a siezure.

I lost my sister and a brother in law to drugs, so yeah, there are all sorts of people that I feel that it would be pointless to take a risk to help in a high stakes way. I have even cared for patients with AIDS that were a living walking biohazard. But out in the community I am not carrying PPE.

Last person I hit with Narcan tried to sue me, but that won't slow me down - I buy Narcan by the case, or used to before we lost funds, but I'm sure I'll find a way. I give it to people to have and hold and normally they're miffed or offended until I explain to them that it's not to use on them that is to use on someone else, that they really can save someone's life, they usually understand after I say that. We distributed nearly 5000 units last year, which in my sparsely populated area is about 4 units for every 10 people. I lost my first son in a way that no parent should have to endure, if I can save one life it's all worth it. There but for the grace of God go I.

 

[1911Fanatic]

Last person I hit with Narcan tried to sue me, but that won't slow me down - I buy Narcan by the case, or used to before we lost funds, but I'm sure I'll find a way. I give it to people to have and hold and normally they're miffed or offended until I explain to them that it's not to use on them that is to use on someone else, that they really can save someone's life, they usually understand after I say that. We distributed nearly 5000 units last year, which in my sparsely populated area is about 4 units for every 10 people. I lost my first son in a way that no parent should have to endure, if I can save one life it's all worth it. There but for the grace of God go I.

I was threatened with being sued for braking a guy's ribs doing CPR on him. My lawyer explained to his that had I not broke his ribs, he wouldn't;t be here to sue me. Guy dropped his case as his lawyer told him he wouldn't;t win. He was just looking for some money. They wanted me to pay him. We told him to take it to court. That was the end of that.

I have already saved more lives than I can count. I am tired. I am in pain. I am just not going to put myself in a situation like that unless it's for an innocent.

If I were to do CPR on somebody now, I would lose what little function I have in my left hand. I haven't been able to play or work on guitars for almost two years now. My Narcan is precious. I save it for my wife that is on an opiate just to survive. That stuff only lasts for 15 to 20 minutes, then you have to administer it again.

How did you wind up distributing 5000 units of Narcan? Are you still working with Emergency Sevices?

 

[trukinbear]

I was threatened with being sued for braking a guy's ribs doing CPR on him. My lawyer explained to his that had I not broke his ribs, he wouldn't;t be here to sue me. Guy dropped his case as his lawyer told him he wouldn't;t win. He was just looking for some money. They wanted me to pay him. We told him to take it to court. That was the end of that.

I have already saved more lives than I can count. I am tired. I am in pain. I am just not going to put myself in a situation like that unless it's for an innocent.

If I were to do CPR on somebody now, I would lose what little function I have in my left hand. I haven't been able to play or work on guitars for almost two years now. My Narcan is precious. I save it for my wife that is on an opiate just to survive. That stuff only lasts for 15 to 20 minutes, then you have to administer it again.

How did you wind up distributing 5000 units of Narcan? Are you still working with Emergency Sevices?

I refuse to attempt CPR. TV and film often depict CPR success rates as high as 75%, which is not representative of real-world outcomes. As I'm sure you know CPR performed outside the hospital has a success rate around 4.5%, and perhaps as high as 11% when performed in a hospital - my late wife was a DO who ultimately became 2nd in command at State Medical services, and oversaw Emergency services for the state so I've heard this conversation hundreds of times. Narcan is by comparison nearly 98% effective even when administered by people without medical training, as I'm sure you also know. Something that anyone can do - a miracle. I give people a way to let their inner angel shine. Narcan works both ways, people never forget being able to save a life, and may end up better people for having done so. It can make them superheroes!

 

[trukinbear]

Oregon's Good Samaritan laws provide legal protection to individuals who act in good faith to help others during emergencies, including medical crises, overdoses, and situations involving children or pets in hot cars. The laws are designed to encourage bystanders to intervene without fear of civil or criminal liability.

 

[JDubDub]

Oregon's Good Samaritan laws provide legal protection to individuals who act in good faith to help others during emergencies, including medical crises, overdoses, and situations involving children or pets in hot cars. The laws are designed to encourage bystanders to intervene without fear of civil or criminal liability.

The laws are a start, but they won't keep a Good Samaritan with the best of intentions from being sued by some money grubbing putz. The law is a good defense, but you're still going to be out the legal expenses, not to mention the time and stress. The risk won't stop me from stepping in to help and I've already been named in 2 suits many years ago. I had insurance personal liability insurance as a Dive Master and Instructor, and the company stepped in and handled the defense in both cases or I would have ended up living in a box on the corner.

 

[trukinbear]

The laws are a start, but they won't keep a Good Samaritan with the best of intentions from being sued by some money grubbing putz. The law is a good defense, but you're still going to be out the legal expenses, not to mention the time and stress. The risk won't stop me from stepping in to help and I've already been named in 2 suits many years ago. I had insurance personal liability insurance as a Dive Master and Instructor, and the company stepped in and handled the defense in both cases or I would have ended up living in a box on the corner.

I'm sure it depends on your location, but when I attempted to hire an attorney he wouldn't take my money. He said I didn't need a lawyer, that the judge would never hear it... then proceeded to call the judge who ultimately ended up reprimanding the attorney for even attempting such a thing. Your results may vary #

 

[2ndtimer]

I'm sure it depends on your location, but when I attempted to hire an attorney he wouldn't take my money. He said I didn't need a lawyer, that the judge would never hear it... then proceeded to call the judge who ultimately ended up reprimanding the attorney for even attempting such a thing. Your results may vary #

You must have had better judges in Oregon than we have in Washington. (Our governors are a dead heat, though in a race to the worst )