Gew 88. "S" - Loewe Berlin Model 1888 Commission Rifle - 8mm Mauser (7.92x57mm)

[BooneOrvis]

Ad Type

1. For Sale

Price

$400

Manufacturer

Other / Not Listed

Caliber

8mm

City

Beaverton

State

Oregon

Zip Code

97007

Loewe Berlin Model 1888 Commission Rifle - Gew 88 "S" 8mm Mauser Rifle (7.92x57mm).

Good condition German Rifle (Gewehr modell 1888) was supplied to the Ottoman Empire (Turkey) during WWI.

The Gew.88 rifle is often erroneously referred to as "Mauser" or "Mannlicher", but in fact it is neither. Its bolt is a more or less indigenous design by German gunsmith Schlegelmilch.

In Germany, service life of the Gew.88 as a primary infantry rifle was relatively short. After just 10 years of service it was officially replaced with the Mauser-designed Gew.98 – one of the best bolt action rifles of its time.

This rifle has very smooth bolt action, good rifling, and though I'm no expert, a clean and reasonably bright bore.

$400

Read More

 

[Cjv]

Will that handle todays commercial ammo?

 

[BooneOrvis]

According to Wikipedia:

In 1903, the Germany Army adopted a new service cartridge that fired lighter bullets measuring 8.20 mm (. 323 in) in diameter. From then on, many Gewehr 88 rifles were rechambered to fire the new 1903 pattern 7.92×57mm Mauser cartridge becoming Gewehr 88 S rifles.

[Gewehr 1888 - Wikipedia]

I inherited this gun several years ago, but haven't shot it myself. I would take it to a reputable gunsmith for confirmation.

 

[Spaz]

According to Wikipedia:

In 1903, the Germany Army adopted a new service cartridge that fired lighter bullets measuring 8.20 mm (. 323 in) in diameter. From then on, many Gewehr 88 rifles were rechambered to fire the new 1903 pattern 7.92×57mm Mauser cartridge becoming Gewehr 88 S rifles.
[Gewehr 1888 - Wikipedia]

I inherited this gun several years ago, but haven't shot it myself. I would take it to a reputable gunsmith for confirmation.

Most are marked with an S as well. Personally, unless it's American lower powered cartridges I'd avoid it.

 

[BooneOrvis]

This one definitely has the "S" stamped clearly on the top of the receiver and this one has been converted to fire spitzer ammo and has had the stripper clip modifications done.

From a gun forum: "Following adoption of the modified 7,9mm S-patrone in 1902 (with lighter and much faster "Spitzer" or pointed bullet) many of the Gew.88 rifles were adapted for this new ammunition by reaming out the front of the chamber. These rifles, sometimes referred to as "Gew.88S", are clearly marked with the letter "S" stamped on the top of receiver, in front of the ejection opening."

 

[Spaz]

This one definitely has the "S" stamped clearly on the top of the receiver and this one has been converted to fire spitzer ammo and has had the stripper clip modifications done.

From a gun forum: "Following adoption of the modified 7,9mm S-patrone in 1902 (with lighter and much faster "Spitzer" or pointed bullet) many of the Gew.88 rifles were adapted for this new ammunition by reaming out the front of the chamber. These rifles, sometimes referred to as "Gew.88S", are clearly marked with the letter "S" stamped on the top of receiver, in front of the ejection opening."

Oh duh, I definitely didn't look at that hard enough

 

[Cjv]

So, at the end of the day, the anemic ppu should suffice? Unless you reload of course. I wonder what kind of charge was original, vs what would be safe today

 

[BooneOrvis]

I AM NO EXPERT ON THIS RIFLE AND ITS AMMO, BUT THERE IS A LOT OF LITERATURE ON IT. QUITE FRANKLY, IT MAKES ME BRAIN HURT.

7,9; 7,92; "8mm" Correct Nominative

Since we ( the Organisation of Cartridge Collectors) are dedicated to academic and correct research regarding Cartridges, we Should Rid our Correspondance and research of Incorrect Terminology. In this case, the Technically ( and Legally ) incorrect use of “8mm” in describing the 7,9 Patrone in...

forum.cartridgecollectors.org

THIS FROM MILSURPS.COM:

Clarification (I hope) of the 8x57I /8x57IS confusion

As several queries have involved this matter, here is the real story.

1) With the Gew.88, the Germans introduced the 8x57I cartridge, the I standing for Infantry. In German literature you may find 8x57J. Don't worry, it's the same thing, but the Germans often used a capital J instead of I in print, to avoid confusion with the number 1.

2) It was discovered that the bullet was too small for the bore. Gas blowby led to rapid barrel wear.

3) The military therefore increased the bullet diameter when they introduced the Spitzer bullet (hence the S). This was a better fit in the bore, and resulted in both improved barrel life and improved accuracy. Note that the bullet was changed, to suit the barrel - not the other way around. The land/groove dimensions were not altered. But the neck end of the chamber + lead had to be reamed out to accept the larger bullet.

All military rifles thus altered were marked with an S (for Spitzer) and the chambering/cartridge was renamed to 8x57IS (or 8x67JS). As the offical date of this change was 1905, the Gew.88 rifles thus marked are known as Gew.88/05.

4) While the military was painfully facing up to the need for change, civilian gunmakers had long implemented their own solution - which was to change the barrel to suit the bullet!
So the bore dimensions (land/groove diameters) were reduced, enabling civilians to continue using the original bullets and cases (which must have been cheaply available by the million when the 8x57I was phased out by the military). It took nearly forty years until this chambering was officially recognized and standardized as 8x57I in 1939.

When wondering what ammo is right for your 8x57 is it therefore vital to distinguish between military and civilian rifles.

Military
Gew.88 with the S mark (i.e. Gew. 88/05)
- this has the standard 8x57IS chambering. No problem with cartridge dimensions. But please remember (as always) that the words "full load" and "century-old rifle" do not go well together.
If you came across some 8x57I ammo and fired it in these rifles - no problem, but probably poor performance (and throat erosion).

Gew.88 without the S
If you find one of these, do NOT try and feed it with 8x57IS ammo. If the cartridge can be chambered at all, the cartridge neck will be a jam fit in the chamber, and will therefore produce serious overpressure when fired. In this case, you must use 8x57I ammo.

Civilian
The civilian picture is totally unsure. The late introduction of the standarization distinction between 8x57I and 8x57IS, plus the fact that there are plenty of civilian rifles around that have been converted from military rifles, means that the ONLY safe thing to do with a civilian 8x57 is to measure the chamber before firing anything! (It's always a good idea for any rifle, regardless of what may be stamped on it!)

Patrick

 

[Phantom Man]

Will that handle todays commercial ammo?

The "S" designation has nothing to do with bore size but of opening the chamber to fit Spitzer rounds.
German military rifles were in .321 or later .323 not .318 as many believe.
If this rifle has been in Turkey as parts suggest then the bore would have plenty of wear and as mentioned PPU "Mauser" ammo is fine. Not to be confused with PPU 7.92×57. Pressures are different between the two. If the bore shows little or no wear and us indeed. 321 then .32 bullets commonly used in lever guns are ideal for loading. Good luck.

 

[Cjv]

Pm'd

 

[genin88]

Just a quick fact on this rifle, the proper nomenclature is Gew 88/05. Yes used by the Turks, but not converted to the Gew 88/05/35 configuration. As mentioned with this rifle you need to slug the bore to see the bore diameter, that's the bottom line before shooting safely and use ammo that does not exceed the pressure for the receiver (i.e. American 8mm Mauser or Romanian 8mm Mauser surplus).

I have a friend that loads gallery loads for my Gew 88/05/35, its like shooting .22LR in a 8mm rifle as far as recoil.

 

[BooneOrvis]

Thanks for your insight. I will pass it on to its new owner soon.

 

[Phantom Man]

Just a quick fact on this rifle, the proper nomenclature is Gew 88/05. Yes used by the Turks, but not converted to the Gew 88/05/35 configuration. As mentioned with this rifle you need to slug the bore to see the bore diameter, that's the bottom line before shooting safely and use ammo that does not exceed the pressure for the receiver (i.e. American 8mm Mauser or Romanian 8mm Mauser surplus).

I have a friend that loads gallery loads for my Gew 88/05/35, its like shooting .22LR in a 8mm rifle as far as recoil.

This is a 1888/05 unless rebarreled and sleeve omitted. The reciever would have been scrubbed and Turkish stamps applied.
This looks like a 1888/05 to me.

 

[BooneOrvis]

Thanks. The more info the better.