Question..........Who here pracrices double taps?

[Alexx1401]

I practice double tap every time I shoot. Range I am a member of will allow up to triple taps. MANY ranges will NOT allow this though. Same with draw from a holster. Few will allow this sadly and they have good reason. For the "practice" I can't do at the range air guns can be VERY nice for this. They make some nice ones now that are quite close to many options shooters carry. I have long practiced being able to shoot for the pelvic girdle since scum wearing soft armor started to become something I kept seeing.

 

[Alexx1401]

As for the Mozambique drill...am still waiting to see or hear of that being used in an actual shooting.

Have had 100.00 on the table for the last 7 years to anyone that can come up with it...the dust is heavily accumulating.

Too lazy to look it up now but IIRC this was never something that some known teacher came up with was it? Seems like it was some passed down around the watering hole thing that just keeps going around???

 

[Knobgoblin]

As for the Mozambique drill...am still waiting to see or hear of that being used in an actual shooting.

Have had 100.00 on the table for the last 7 years to anyone that can come up with it...the dust is heavily accumulating.

How much would a real world use of the "El presidente" pay out?

 

[Cerberus Group]

How much would a real world use of the "El presidente" pay out?

Mutiple targets/threats

 

[Alexx1401]

We have those. They're hard to find and not reusable, but totally worth it. We call them raccoons.

Now there is one TOUGH damn critter alright. Have not had to (yet) kill one here but have in the past. Last night Wife and I were enjoying the front porch when one that I swear was the size of a med size dog went walking past us. Being its summer coat now that thing was HUGE. So far its been leaving our Chickens alone so its live and let live. Last run in I had with one of these was long ago when one grabbed one of my dogs. First thing that came to hand was a 5 cell Maglight. I beat that damn thing with several hits to make it let go of the dog and it still just trotted off looking back at me like I annoyed it.

 

[Flopsweat]

Now there is one TOUGH damn critter alright. Have not had to (yet) kill one here but have in the past. Last night Wife and I were enjoying the front porch when one that I swear was the size of a med size dog went walking past us. Being its summer coat now that thing was HUGE. So far its been leaving our Chickens alone so its live and let live. Last run in I had with one of these was long ago when one grabbed one of my dogs. First thing that came to hand was a 5 cell Maglight. I beat that damn thing with several hits to make it let go of the dog and it still just trotted off looking back at me like I annoyed it.

Not to mention how they crap in the worst places and spread disease. They're clever, bad tempered, vicious and rude. And they stink.

 

[po18guy]

I train under Tacoma SWAT Officer Munn. I asked him about this and he replied, "What's a double tap?" For discipline, he then made me get his coffee.

 

[Cerberus Group]

Too lazy to look it up now but IIRC this was never something that some known teacher came up with was it? Seems like it was some passed down around the watering hole thing that just keeps going around???

I understand the theory of it...but why not just go for the head and move on...get it over with?

As originally taught...two shots center mass, assess, then head shot if needed. Who is going to throw the brakes on, stop and check their work, then shot to the head?

With thousands of videos of shootings, have never seen anyone consciously do that. All I see, when the shooting starts it continues until someone is down, or someone runs off.

It's almost a waste of time.

Something that keeps going around...yep, because that's the way we've always done it...ugh

 

[Alexx1401]

Not to mention how they crap in the worst places and spread disease. They're clever, bad tempered, vicious and rude. And they stink.

They are no big deal here (as long as they steer clear of house) but, place we used to live they would tear hell out of the back yard. Few times I would go out in the morning and the yard looked like someone had gone at the grass with a rototiller.
Looking for grubs or worms or whatever. While I would be out there trying to put all the damn grass back I would be thinking about waiting up for them to show them how much I dis liked them doing my lawn

 

[Cerberus Group]

I train under Tacoma SWAT Officer Munn. I aksed him about this and he replied, "What's a double tap?" For discipline, he then made me get his coffee.

I've trained with SWAT, Rangers, Green Berets, SEALs, and IDF (Israeli)...not one has ever taught double tap. Maybe an individual might do it, but not any of the guys that I've ever trained with.

The above are going into some heavy crap...if it was all that, they'd be doing it.

 

[Flopsweat]

They are no big deal here (as long as they steer clear of house) but, place we used to live they would tear hell out of the back yard. Few times I would go out in the morning and the yard looked like someone had gone at the grass with a rototiller.
Looking for grubs or worms or whatever. While I would be out there trying to put all the damn grass back I would be thinking about waiting up for them to show them how much I dis liked them doing my lawn

What you get for having a lawn nice enough that the worms like it.

 

[Alexx1401]

I've trained with SWAT, Rangers, Green Berets, SEALs, and IDF (Israeli)...not one has ever taught double tap. Maybe an individual might do it, but not any of the guys that I've ever trained with.

The above are going into some heavy crap...if it was all that, they'd be doing it.

As tech has evolved there are so many shoots on video now that is has GREATLY changed my way of thinking. For most of my life I would hear tale of people soaking up multiple hits with some "service" round and refusing to stop. I used to think most, if not almost all of these were just hype. Story being re told over and over. Now? I see so many mainly due to scum on drugs that it has changed how I practice and even what I often carry. Still don't practice head shots as most who claim they do have no idea just how damn hard that target would be to hit. It is often scary as hell to see some scum soak up multiple hits from some LEO and just not want to stop. I think about it when I am only armed with something small enough to pocket for sure.

 

[NeoBlackdog]

They're clever, bad tempered, vicious and rude. And they stink.

Sooo.... They're Democrats?

 

[Flopsweat]

Sooo.... They're Democrats?

 

[WillametteWill]

Too lazy to look it up now but IIRC this was never something that some known teacher came up with was it? Seems like it was some passed down around the watering hole thing that just keeps going around???

The original story comes from Mike Rousseau, a mercenary in Rhodesian. He engaged an adversary while at the airport who was armed with an AK. Rousseau placed two shots in the torso from his Browning HP and the subject did not stop. As the story goes (as it was told to me) he intended to place another shot in the head to end the fight. The shot actually went low into the neck, but hit the spine and ended the fight. So the origin of the Mozambique Drill ironically did not happen the way the drill is now practiced.

Fast forward to Col. Cooper (Gunsite Col. Cooper) hearing about this (apparently from Rousseau) and the drill became part of their training (and is still practiced today). Two LAPD officers attended a class there and asked if they could bring it back to their folks. Now known as a failure drill or failure to stop drill, it is not practiced as a triple tap but rather the first two did not stop the threat so now a deliberate shot is made to the head (a good shot, not just hitting somewhere in the head). Gunsite also practices many other "non-standard" responses (i.e., not just two shots, next threat like you get at many comps and other training locations).

I don't disagree with @Cerberus Group that videos of this being used are slim (okay, maybe none). But I have seen many videos where mag dumping into center mass was clearly not stopping the threat. (Officer who was assaulted by the stick wielding guy comes to mind), where other options, head or pelvis might have stopped the fight sooner.

I'm not kicking doors in Fallujah. (Blessings and prayers to those who did.) I was harsh reviewing a video recently here where an officer mag dumped into a police car, at a suspect, while his partner was under the suspect, using a McDonalds as a backstop, from about 20 yards. Thankfully nobody in the McD's or the partner was hit but this was blind luck. IMHO we are seeing more of this "spray and pray" shooting. We have seen some citizen defender cases as well. I do not believe we can lose the mindset that every single round needs to be justified.

Those who say, "I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6," have likely never been judged by 12 when 20 years to life is on the line and they just lost their home and family due to the cost and stress of a shooting that is considered questionable. Having said that, I think practicing singles, doubles, triples, multiple areas on the target, targets from the side, targets where only parts are visible and a bunch of other possibilities are all worthy of consideration.

Good input from the crew here worthy of consideration.

 

[Knobgoblin]

Mutiple targets/threats

Yeah, but I mean would you pay a thousand bucks if somebody lived through this exact scenario?

 

[Bobbygun]

Sooo.... They're Democrats?

I was gonna go with: Sooo.... @sobo when someone badmouths a Sig?

 

[Bobbygun]

As for the Mozambique drill...am still waiting to see or hear of that being used in an actual shooting.

Have had 100.00 on the table for the last 7 years to anyone that can come up with it...the dust is heavily accumulating.

Google "John Wick", then send me my hunsky.

 

[eustace_stelio]

Now there is one TOUGH damn critter alright. Have not had to (yet) kill one here but have in the past. Last night Wife and I were enjoying the front porch when one that I swear was the size of a med size dog went walking past us. Being its summer coat now that thing was HUGE. So far its been leaving our Chickens alone so its live and let live. Last run in I had with one of these was long ago when one grabbed one of my dogs. First thing that came to hand was a 5 cell Maglight. I beat that damn thing with several hits to make it let go of the dog and it still just trotted off looking back at me like I annoyed it.

My buddy learned the hard way that raccoons will eat full grown chickens. He did bother properly secure his hen house and lost his 4 or 5 hens.

He thought he only had to worry about possible dog or coyote.

He should have been out there like

 

[ilikegunspdx]

My buddy learned the hard way that raccoons will eat full grown chickens. He did bother properly secure his hen house and lost his 4 or 5 hens.

He thought he only had to worry about possible dog or coyote.

He should have been out there like

They are smart. I had peanut butter in outside mini fridge (I kept it there to bait traps). Overnight one time a racoon opened fridge, removed peanut butter jar, unscrewed the top, and ate his fill. Found it in the yard in the morning with claw marks all over it and fridge door open.