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Worst Possible Self Defense Situation

Discussion in 'Education & Training' started by aslinged, May 15, 2012.

  1. aslinged

    aslinged Southern Oregon Well-Known Member

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    The article suggests (but they don't confirm yet) that a turd somewhere in Mississippi is posing as a cop, pulling people over and shooting them in the head.

    For what? Who knows, but from a tactical point of view I can't really imagine a worse possible situation.

    On the one hand if you keep ready access to your weapon and it's a real cop...you risk getting shot. Let's be honest, you're gonna get shot. But on the other hand if you don't keep ready access and it's a fake cop/random murderer then you are definitely gonna get shot, probably in the face and probably die on the side of the road.

    The article recommends that when the flashers go on to put on your signal, call 911 to confirm and continue to some 'well-lit spot.' This strikes me as absurd.

    Here is the link: Police: Phony officer could be killing Mississippi drivers - CNN.com

    What's your all's opinion? The same thing is becoming more common with fake cops/bad guys going to homes, knocking them over. Again, bad situation.
     
  2. lamrith

    lamrith tacoma Active Member

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    When these sort of things start happening that is the standard course of action, get to a well lit POPULATED area. This is recommended for women especially during night-time stops regardless of the situation. Putting your hazards on is a way to let the officer know you do see and acknowledge you see him, make sure to follow the laws of the road whiel you find a safe place, do not speed up (DUH, but had to be said). Most officers will understand as long as you do not drag it out for miles and miles..

    The tough part is calling 911 before you come to a stop, since most states make it illegal to use a cell phone while driving...
     
  3. Nwcid

    Nwcid Yakima and N of Spokane Well-Known Member

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    Not really since most have an exemption for emergencies.....

    WA for example, RCW 46.61.667: Using a wireless communications device while driving.


    (1) Except as provided in subsections (2) and (3) of this section, a person operating a moving motor vehicle while holding a wireless communications device to his or her ear is guilty of a traffic infraction.

    (2) Subsection (1) of this section does not apply to a person operating:

    (a) An authorized emergency vehicle, or a tow truck responding to a disabled vehicle;

    (b) A moving motor vehicle using a wireless communications device in hands-free mode;

    (c) A moving motor vehicle using a hand-held wireless communications device to:

    (i) Report illegal activity;

    (ii) Summon medical or other emergency help;

    (iii) Prevent injury to a person or property; or


    (iv) Relay information that is time sensitive between a transit or for-hire operator and that operator's dispatcher, in which the device is permanently affixed to the vehicle;

    (d) A moving motor vehicle while using a hearing aid.
     
  4. beavernation

    beavernation Canby Active Member

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    WTH is this world coming to?......wow, I can't even visualize from a tactical standpoint how I would handle this?????.....Its been awhile since I was stopped by the police but now???????.......WTH!......If this is a true report they need to wack this dude and quick, I can see a body count rising really quickly if he is active!!!.....unbelievable how creative human beings can get on how to eliminate each other from this world!!!!....OK off my soapbox now........
     
    Trailboss and (deleted member) like this.
  5. lamrith

    lamrith tacoma Active Member

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    Nwcid - Thanks for the info! I will make sure my family all know this!
     
  6. Riot

    Riot Benton County, Washington Well-Known Member

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    To give you guys some pointers spotting an acual cop car.

    1) All officers want you to pull over in a safe manor and in a well lit and safe area. This isn't just for your safety, it is for their safety as well. Even if it means driving an extra mile or two to get to a safer area, nobody's feelings will be hurt. If you don't feel safe pulling over in the location you are at I suggest slowing down, turn your hazards on and pull slightly to the right of the road. This tells the officer that you understand and acknowledge his/her intentions but you are not yet ready to pull over. If the driver suddenly becomes aggitated that you haven't pulled over soon enough, this should be clue #1.
    2) Most traffic patrols have spotlights to blind the driver from seeing the rear facing mirrors. This is so you cannot see the aproaching officer. If your mirrors aren't lit up like a christmas tree after being pulled over, this should be clue #2.
    3) After your vehicle stops, the officer will radio into dispatch the location of the stop and approximately how many occupants are in the vehicle. They are usually waiting on confirmation that the registered owner of the vehicle is not a wanted felon before they approach as well- hence why it usually takes a minute or two after you are pulled over before you see an officer at your window. Especially at night. If after you stop, the "officer" automatically comes directly to your door, this should be clue #3.

    Nothing is wrong with picking up your cellphone and dialing 9-1-1 to verify if the person behind you is an actual police officer. The 9-1-1 dispatcher will confirm with the local police that they are attempting to make a stop with a vehicle matching your description and will even tell the police dispatcher that you have called 9-1-1 to confirm that they were following them. Cool, huh? This happened to me when I was an MP and I had no problems with it. They had ever seen a Chevy Lumina converted to a patrol car before and did exactly what I layered out (put on hazards, pulled slightly over, slowed down and called 9-1-1).

    I hope this helps.
     
  7. slimer13

    slimer13 Deer Park Well-Known Member

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  8. PaulZ

    PaulZ Oregon City Active Member

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    Could have been a long drawn out terror situation. Glad this guy was not too smart
     
  9. Riot

    Riot Benton County, Washington Well-Known Member

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    Also looks like the "fake cop" report was a bogus theory, as well.

     
  10. Blitzkrieg

    Blitzkrieg WA Well-Known Member

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    Let's also acknowledge that many times real and fake cops have committed these and even worse crimes.. I am reminded of the CHP who kidnapped, raped and murdered a pretty blonde co-ed in the 1970s in Cali

    I trust no one and am ready to respond with lethal force to any unlawful attempt. My life means nothing compared to the life and safety of my lady
     
  11. soberups

    soberups Newberg Well-Known Member

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    Usually when you hear about someone posing as a cop in a private car, he is using one of those old fashioned "Kojack" rotating lights that stick onto the roof or dashboard. All modern unmarked police vehicles that I have seen in the last decade or so have had the high-intensity LED flashers mounted in the grill, on the front of the mirrors, on top of the sun visors, or combinations of all three. They are also wired so as to cause the headlights, high beams and hazard lights to flash. Its like being followed by a pinball machine. Calling 911 is also a good idea, since the call itself is recorded.
     
  12. Riot

    Riot Benton County, Washington Well-Known Member

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    On Ft. Bragg they had one dude that had two white flashers attached to the back of his viser. Because of the tint on top of the windshield it looked like he had blue flashers on an unmarked car. Dude would pull people over and just be an ***...just scream and yell like he had authority to random people.
     
  13. mcathcart

    mcathcart Beaverton, Oregon Active Member

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    The Po-Po dont like this.
    Ive done it looking for a safe spot to pull over.
    Sirens and loud speaker comes on. Feelings DO get hurt.

    "You are supposed to pull over immediately!" is what I was told, after driving an additional 150yrds @30mph with flashers on.

    Real world application differs from your advice here.
     
  14. lamrith

    lamrith tacoma Active Member

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    Was this at nighttime or during the day? I can see them being testy if you do this in the middle of the day, unless you are in a really unsafe place. I have been told this is acceptable from a number of LEO's.

    You should have gotten his badge number and informed dispatch and his superiors of this after you got home that day/night. Barring any other unknown circumstances, the officer should not have reacted that way.
     
  15. Riot

    Riot Benton County, Washington Well-Known Member

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    The only thing I can say is it differs from officer to officer and the situation. If I was an officer and was pulling you over because I thought you were beating up your passenger or your vehicle matched the description of a violent fugitive, then yeah- that extra few seconds you spend before pulling over would get me screaming at you on the PA. The advice I gave was for most, average situations. Even with the spotlight advice, some patrol cars do not have takedown/spotlights and you may not see any blinding lights in your mirrors.

    My advice to you would be this...

    *Don't do anything illegal that would warrant the stop in the first place

    Also, since this was a topic about how you may be able to spot a real officer from a fake one and how tactically to respond accordingly I might also point out that if the individual has a PA system then chances are they are a real officer.

    But the core of the problem is this...you can never know for sure. There are even stories of people stealing police cars (one was the relative of an actual officer) and making stops. Nevertheless my advice still applies. I would like to see a case where someone got arrested for calling 9-1-1 on a suspected fake cop. I'm pretty sure that almost any judge would throw out the charge. You have to make the best of the situation. Just remember, police have a job to do; regardless of what you think of them or the laws they enforce.
     
  16. Marz

    Marz PDX Member

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    Crazy people today, I would say go with your gut. If you feel its not right, it usually is not.
     
  17. Burt Gummer

    Burt Gummer Portland Completely Out of Ammo

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    This explains why my female friend drove away from a Lake Oswego cop without a speeding ticket. She cracked her window 1/2" and said how do I know you are a real cop? He was in uniform driving an unmarked car. He gave up. She got no ticket, drove away.

    A buddy of mine in HS used to love to pull people over with his ex police car and drive away until he was caught. He pulled over some city official one time. Funny - he is a Clackamas Deputy sheriff now.
     
  18. Hook686

    Hook686 Northern California Active Member

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    I think it depends also whether, or not, it is a marked, or unmarked police car. If it is you standard jurisdiction police car I doubt that ignoring the unit and continuing to drive will work to your advantage.
     
  19. mcathcart

    mcathcart Beaverton, Oregon Active Member

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    Whaaat???
    Beating Passenger, violent fugitive?
    What planet are you on?
    How did you jump to this wild eyed hypothetical conclusion?



    You should have saved all the typing and just wrote this to begin with.
     
  20. Burt Gummer

    Burt Gummer Portland Completely Out of Ammo

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    Similar to this scenario, I am sure post SHTF that there will be a lot of perps dressing up like cops to gain access to homes and do invasions. After all, you can get Swat type vests, police badges, patches, etc for next to nothing.

    Makes life hard no doubt about it.