Winchester .223 brass

Dungannon · Aug 9, 2019

Took the grandkids shooting this week, and noticed that 47 out of 122 Winchester .223 had split necks.
Note: these were all new factory loads fired from an Aero Precision M4. Have been planning on saving all the Winchester brass for reloading.
What's your experience with the Winchester brass?

Incidentally, the 84 shells of .308 Hornady American Whitetail 160 gr Interlock were all fine. [Those fired from an Aero Precision M5.]

808hondacrguy · Aug 9, 2019

I bought a 100 pack of unprimed Winchester 223 brass once, and after the first time using, Almost half looked like that. I have reloaded the other half a few times now since then, and have had no further issues with it.

ron · Aug 9, 2019

I have been using Winchester 223 brass in competition shooting for several years. Several thousand rounds
a year. It has been working well for me. After several reloads I find a few split case necks but no splits all the way down the shoulder like I see i your photos??

I purchased all my Winchester brass several years ago.
I have no Idea what the issue is.

I have heard some rumor about poor quality with Winchester brass.

Camelfilter · Aug 9, 2019

Perhaps a lot with an anealing issue which passed by QC? Dunno.

bentoncity · Aug 9, 2019

I think I'd be getting ahold of Winchester.

Couple of "before" things though. Verify weapon chamber is in spec. Fire other brand ammo to make sure it's not doing like the current ammo is. Keep lot numbers off the boxes and some of the bad stuff. Measure neck wall thickness with this and other brand if possible just for records keeping.

I suspect Winchester will say oh well cause it's loaded ammo and designed to be shot once but ya never know. Nonetheless, this obviously should not be happening. Even more so if chamber is good.

Does this happen if ammo is fired in another weapon?

Dan

Dungannon · Aug 9, 2019

deckert said:
Does this happen if ammo is fired in another weapon?

Will find out soon. It's a new Aero upper and this was the first time taking it out. I'll be buying several brands, which is something I do anyway, as I like to find out what each barrel prefers. Just never seen that kind of brass failure before.

bentoncity · Aug 9, 2019

In 54 years of shooting & reloading with lord knows how many types of brass of many rifle/pistol calibers, I've never seen what you're posting. I've worn out/split cases due to reloading untold times, including pulling the heads/base off but have never seen what you posted on new factory ammo.
I'm prone to what Camelfilter said about annealing being the problem but I'd still contact Winchester and see where it leads. Nothing to lose...IMHO
That's where the lot numbers come into play. I'd be amiss to return 'everything' to them, if they want it, until I was satisfied all my issues and safety concerns were resolved. Just my 2 cents fwiw.

Dan

Caveman Jim · Aug 9, 2019

I've been reloading new Winchester brass for 3 years with no ill affects at all.

bsa1917hunter · Aug 9, 2019

ron said:
I have been using Winchester 223 brass in competition shooting for several years. Several thousand rounds
a year. It has been working well for me. After several reloads I find a few split case necks but no splits all the way down the shoulder like I see i your photos?? I purchased all my Winchester brass several years ago.
I have no Idea what the issue is. I have heard some rumor about poor quality with Winchester brass.

The last few years, its been horrible. So much in fact, that i wont use it at all. Pretty much garbage. I think some manufactures go in stages like that. We've heard and seen the same thing happen with FC (federal). The sad thing about Winchester, is back in the day it was some of the best stuff to use. In the 90's R-P was excellent.

gmerkt · Aug 9, 2019

In my experience, the condition shown in the OP pictures is not normal.

I'd want to shoot some different brand ammo in the same rifle to see what happens.

WW commercial rifle ammo that I've had over the years hasn't shown annealment color. I just checked some WW civilian .223 Rem. that I have that is 1978 vintage, it shows no color. But lack of color doesn't mean it hasn't been annealed.

Not too many years ago, Olin moved their centerfire ammo production from East Alton, IL to Oxford, Mississippi. I've noticed that at least the headstamp markings are different. Military ammo headstamp for the Oxford plant is WMA. I couldn't say if a change in venue as to manufacturing location relates to any QC issues.

HighlandLofts · Aug 10, 2019

It seams to me they aquired some bad brass. I've had a case split occasionally, but no where close to that amount.
I pick up range brass from a gravel pit so I have all kinds of head stamps. I have a few hundred cases that I just reload, shoot & reload again. All mixed head stampsn i see very little case splits in my recycled brass.

I think I will start throwing the bad cases in a can and see what head stamps fail the soonest.

I'd contact Winchester and see what they say, i'd think there would be a safety issue with that many split cases.

Otter · Aug 11, 2019

Looks like that brass was never annealed. I bought 100 Winchester .22-250 cases one time and almost every one of them split, but not as bad as yours. I've bought lots of other Winchester brass before and never had an issue. I would notify Winchester...they could have a problem with the entire lot.

DizzyJ · Aug 12, 2019

My guess is also not annealed properly, or at all.

Steel Head · Aug 13, 2019

I actually like Winchester 223 and 243 brass.

If you don't overwork it, anneal when needed and don't get crazy with pressure it will last a long time and shoot well.

Most cheaper dies with production chambers massively overwork brass requiring annealing often.

aklaunch · Aug 19, 2019

I used to be a fan of WW brass.

I no longer use it anymore. Lots of defects and such.

I still love W748 rifle powder though.

Olin brass just changed hands not long ago. A German company bought the whole thing.