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Maybe. But I wasn't talking about low tax rates, I was talking about simplifying the tax system
And I was talking about the tax burden you have as someone making less money now, as you mentioned in the post I quoted.

Simplifying the tax system should have a concrete societal goal. Not "siimplicity for simplicity's sake" when such a move is pushed for and primarily benefits rich people. Telling you it is "more just" or "less government" is just a sales pitch to get something you don't need. Like millions of men fighting to preserve the slavery they didn't benefit from.
 
Then we agree.
No. We might agree that the current system isn't fair to anybody, but we probably do not agree on what would be fair, and we probably don't agree on how to fix it.

It is all academic - as I originally stated, what I would propose to replace the current system is politically impossible and even if it came about, it would soon be corrupted back into a semblance of what we have now - people being corruptible after all. And it wouldn't take near as long as it did originally.
 
Simplifying the tax system should have a concrete societal goal.
And I disagree. Again with "society". Keep the government out of "society", that is how we went down this road to socialism in the first place.

The goal of taxes are to pay for the proper function of government, which is not to provide social programs, but rather to provide national security, a judicial system, and infrastructure (roads, bridges, etc.).
 
Let's try again....

Screwy looking to whom?
Citizen has every right to tell them to pound sand.
Government has been engaging in any number of fishing expeditions and show trials lately...and outright fabricated prosecutions......been going on big time for the past 6 years or so....or haven't you noticed. Probably not............
 
And I was talking about the tax burden you have as someone making less money now, as you mentioned in the post I quoted.

Simplifying the tax system should have a concrete societal goal. Not "siimplicity for simplicity's sake" when such a move is pushed for and primarily benefits rich people. Telling you it is "more just" or "less government" is just a sales pitch to get something you don't need. Like millions of men fighting to preserve the slavery they didn't benefit from.
Wow.

A ham handed civil war segue. (Attempted)

Awesome.

https___cdn.cnn.com_cnnnext_dam_assets_150625155637-01-confederate-flag-brazil---restricted.jpg
 
And I disagree. Again with "society". Keep the government out of "society", that is how we went down this road to socialism in the first place.

The goal of taxes are to pay for the proper function of government, which is not to provide social programs, but rather to provide national security, a judicial system, and infrastructure (roads, bridges, etc.).
Says who? The US government has always used its power to participate in the living standards of its citizens. There isn't some concrete line where a trade tariff is just business and feeding hungry kids is Communism. It is all protections for the citizenry in general.
 
Let's try again....

Screwy looking to whom?
Citizen has every right to tell them to pound sand.
Government has been engaging in any number of fishing expeditions and show trials lately...and outright fabricated prosecutions......been going on big time for the past 6 years or so....or haven't you noticed. Probably not............
Which crimes should be investigated? Can someone who defrauds you tell investigators to pack sand?

We aren't talking about a government agency randomly bothering people. We're talking about the government lowering your tax burden by rooting out the people that defraud our society.
 
I doubt many people have ever seen an IRS Criminal Investigator Special Agent. "IRS Agents" aren't armed.
Nor do they need to be so why blow billions of dollars on that?
You're not weakening my argument against IRS having their own enforcement branch.
You also haven't answered my question as to how many cases of audit/IRS interaction incidents of violence there have been. While I'm sure there have been some cases, I maintain that the number is insufficient to warrant their own armed enforcement branch.. Maybe that money would be better spent on more traditional LE organizations, giving them more officers and better training.
 
Says who? The US government has always used its power to participate in the living standards of its citizens. There isn't some concrete line where a trade tariff is just business and feeding hungry kids is Communism. It is all protections for the citizenry in general.
The line was crossed (or so the story goes) when there was a bill in Congress to pay money to a poor widow: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Davy_Crockett#CITEREFGroneman2005

As for who says what I assert is the proper use of tax revenue - I do, and a lot of other people, mostly Libertarians - many of whom would go a lot further than I do.
 
Nor do they need to be so why blow billions of dollars on that?
Show me where the IRS is spending billions on armed agents (they aren't).
You also haven't answered my question as to how many cases of audit/IRS interaction incidents of violence there have been.
Why would there be any? Are IRS Agents that perform audits ever armed? (Nope.) Do the armed IRS Special Agents perform audits? Nope, again.

You're not weakening my argument against IRS having their own enforcement branch.
I don't recall attempting to. Mostly I'm just addressing erroneous information, not changing opinions. (No, everything isn't an opinion. Some things are facts.)

Maybe that money would be better spent on more traditional LE organizations, giving them more officers and better training.
Most Federal agents train at the same Federal LE facilities. But their investigation techniques and knowledge base are tied to the agency they work under.
 
Without an audit how do we know that they are? Just take their word for it?
Not speaking of Joe's big pharma buddies, but small-to-mid sized companies, family businesses etc.
If we assume that taxpayers/companies are lying, that only demonstrates a need for a much larger and more powerful IRS. Not sure that's what we want.
 
Why is the IRS hiring so many agents and posting job descriptions that include the requirement that the agents be willing to use lethal force and be armed?
Idk.. Maybe because the armed forces are doing such a terrible job attaining new recruits they just figure they MAY need to scrape the bottom of the barrel and enlist/conscript other government employees who were already suckers enough to sign up for them in one form or another / just thinking ahead.

Thats a BIG reason why I pretty much refuse to renew my Merchant marine cred. No effing way I want to be on the short list to solve all the problems this admin and the rank and file and congress/house created.

I'll happily serve when someone in charge has a couple wits to throw about. That time isn't now.

Let's not kid ourselves. The situation(s) we are in weren't by accident. They were planned. And they are planning a lot more turmoil before the end (if they can). The harder and the faster the better, they are trying to reshape the future. Personally I think they feel they have to destroy the world (not just one country) to rebuild it better. Crack pipe logic but then again seems yo go with the territory in poolitics these days.

This is only the beginning. :mad:
 
Also worth noting as I have been proposing for a long time.. STOP PAYING YOUR (FED) TAXES!!! If at all possible, which I know isn't for some.
I sure they mean to remedy people like me by force.
Just make life hard for these *ss holes any way possible. Vote with actions any way possible to make their life and plans hard/impossible. They talk openly about making our reps lives living hell.. Return the favor.
 
I just don't get how these topics got mixed together. It's like saying the Fish and Game department are causing it to rain because fish happen to live in water. There's no reasonable connection.
That's what they WANT you to think! :s0140:
No, I'm just not a conspiracy theorist that believes everything Alex Jones has to say.
When all else fails, go to the straw man... :rolleyes:
Wanna increase revenues? Simplify the tax code. Flat tax, 10% no deductions whether you make 20 grand or 20 mil. So simple a child could complete a 1040, and no SS-Einsatzgruppen needed.
^^^THIS! Good idea for individuals, but how would it work for businesses?
There is no tax as incredibly regressive as sales tax. Poor people already spend everything they make, and it would be better if everything they make was taxed?
For once he's right. What is it they say about broken clocks?
Eazy Peazy Set a threshold for exemption (like poverty level x 2 or something) and anyone that wants a Get Out Of Taxes Free Card just applies to the IRS for an exemption card. All those out of work agents will have tons of time to make sure you qualify, and when you pop out the card at the local Stop-N-Rob everyone will know that you are really poor.
Doesn't need to be that complicated. The "poor" already receive benfits administered by other agencies. They have EBT cards. The law could just make any purchases made by EBT tax exempt. No need for excess IRS agents at all.

I prefer option 1 (simplified income tax) but would rather have option 2 (point of sale tax) than no reform at all.

Which reminds me: How many times have I been in line behind a "poor" person at the stop-'n-rob, usually sporting various tatoos (where does that money come from?), using their cash to buy cigs, beer and lottery tickets, and then whipping out their EBT card to pay for sodas and chips? Too many times to count. Let's audit the crap out of the "poor." ;) :p
 
Show me where the IRS is spending billions on armed agents (they aren't).
True It's the Democrats who are going to spend that money
Why would there be any? Are IRS Agents that perform audits ever armed? (Nope.) Do the armed IRS Special Agents perform audits? Nope, again.
So why do they need an enforcement branch? Send an IRS agent out with federal law enforcement officers. IRS agent explains why they are arresting tax cheat, federal LEO makes the arrest
I don't recall attempting to. Mostly I'm just addressing erroneous information, not changing opinions. (No, everything isn't an opinion. Some things are facts.)
Such as the fact that the IRS was soliciting for new hires that would use firearms and be prepared to use deadly force? That is indeed a fact and it is my opinion that they should not be doing that.
Most Federal agents train at the same Federal LE facilities. But their investigation techniques and knowledge base are tied to the agency they work under.
True, but my way has that enforcement agent available for other anti-crime activities, not just the IRS. More utility for the enforcement buck. The investigation can be done by the IRS, the arrest can be made by the federal LEO. The IRS agent's job is to explain why the perp is being arrested, the LEO is there to facilitate the arrest and prevent or handle any violent escalation. Once the perp is delivered to detention, the LEO goes to the next job, be it IRS or another investigation. I could even support a similar arrangement for the ATF.
 
This video is hilarious. When you stop laughing, you can cry. These potential "criminal investigators" don't look real tough. Something tells me they won't be going after the drug dealer who fails to report his income. Nope, it's your local landscaper. "YOU'RE GOIN' DOWN!" says the fat gal with the nose ring.

 
So why do they need an enforcement branch? Send an IRS agent out with federal law enforcement officers. IRS agent explains why they are arresting tax cheat, federal LEO makes the arrest
Why do we have the ATF, Border Patrol, Marshalls, NCIS, Secret Service, Diplomatic Security Service, FBI, Fish and Wildlife, Postal Inspect General, Capitol Police, Park Police?

Better yet, why are you only against one LE agency and not other ones?

Such as the fact that the IRS was soliciting for new hires that would use firearms and be prepared to use deadly force? That is indeed a fact and it is my opinion that they should not be doing that.
It is. It just isn't a fact that they are looking for 87,000 of them. But they already have armed agents and have for decades. So your outrage is a little late to the party.

The IRS agent's job is to explain why the perp is being arrested, the LEO is there to facilitate the arrest and prevent or handle any violent escalation.
Name any other crime that is primarily investigated by non-LE.

IRS Agents investigate taxes, not the kind of financial crimes IRS Special Agents investigate. So you essentially want non-LE to be retrained to be unarmed LE. For no particular reason.o_O


I honestly don't care, I just think this johnny-come-lately outrage is bizarre. All because of an erroneous news article.
 

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